GER vs Future Trunks

[Zenkaibattery1]

Let's get on with the Trunks matches. Giorno tied with Goku and now faces someone who fought alongside SSJ4 Vegito!

Future Trunks vs Giorno Giovanna

Trunks starts as a SSJG and has the Keysword

Speed is equalized

Trunks:

Giorno:

Inconclusive:

 

[Zenkaibattery1]

Should note Trunks will have light manipulation, Durability Negation with the sword and purification added when his profile is unlocked in case it changes anything

 

[Nitro90]

Should note Trunks will have light manipulation, Durability Negation with the sword and purification added when his profile is unlocked in case it changes anything

And Mid-Low Regen

 

[Shubham_Sonsurkar]

 

[Planck69]

Redundant match is redundant.

 

[Dragomer]

Isn't this one of those thread where either one character resist everything the other has and it's a stomp or they don't and it's a stomp the other way ?

 

[Eganergo]

Nope, this is the thread that either Giorno incon or he stomps.

 

[Zenkaibattery1]

Wasnt Goku v Gio inconclusive because Goku couldn't kill him due to him reviving and gio couldnt kill Goku?

Trunks' keysword can seal and nullify higher dimensional beings like Mechikabura

 

[Planck69]

Wasnt Goku v Gio inconclusive because Goku couldn't kill him due to him reviving and gio couldnt kill Goku?
Trunks' keysword can seal and nullify higher dimensional beings like Mechikabura

Wouldn't matter if it were 10-D Sealing. As long as Trunks himself still needs an act to seal then it's MUDA MUDA.

 

[Dragomer]

Wasnt Goku v Gio inconclusive because Goku couldn't kill him due to him reviving and gio couldnt kill Goku?
Trunks' keysword can seal and nullify higher dimensional beings like Mechikabura

Wouldn't matter if it were 10-D Sealing. As long as Trunks himself still needs an act to seal then it's MUDA MUDA.

Sound like a very exaggerated interpretation of what is on Gio's profile.

 

[Everything12]

Does Trunks resist Causality Manipulation, from what I can tell he doesn't, and Where's the Empathic Manipulation resistance from?

 

[Planck69]

Sound like a very exaggerated interpretation of what is on Gio's profile.

Not really? GER reverts all actions taken by an opponent to zero. As long as Trunks needs to activate his powers or do anything, then it get's reverted. Bypassing this requires either Acausality Types 4 or 5, passive abilities or resistance to causality manip. The 10-D stuff was just an example of how smurf hax are meaningless if they require activation against GER.

 

[Dragomer]

Sound like a very exaggerated interpretation of what is on Gio's profile.

Not really? GER reverts all actions taken by an opponent to zero. As long as Trunks needs to activate his powers or do anything, then it get's reverted. Bypassing this requires either Acausality Types 4 or 5, passive abilities or resistance to causality manip. The 10-D stuff was just an example of how smurf hax are meaningless if they require activation against GER.

Not what the profile say, the profile say '(Reverts actions moment by moment to where they started, with those actions otherwise creating a future that is guaranteed to occur; Said guaranteed future to occur is, in turn, a reality that "none who stand before" GER will ever arrive to, without Giorno himself being aware of it', i have no idea of how you jump from that to what you're saying.

 

[Planck69]

Not what the profile say, the profile say '(Reverts actions moment by moment to where they started, with those actions otherwise creating a future that is guaranteed to occur; Said guaranteed future to occur is, in turn, a reality that "none who stand before" GER will ever arrive to, without Giorno himself being aware of it', i have no idea of how you jump from that to what you're saying.

Yes. Trunks using his sealing sword is an action. One that gets reverted to "zero" i.e. the beginning of the attack.

 

[Planck69]

Seriously though, what's different between this and the Goku thread?

 

[Zenkaibattery1]

Has GER ever worked on resetting higher dimensional sealing?

If not GER sounds like a massive NLF and his battles are just slapping "lol reset zero"

I can do this with so many characters

 

[Everything12]

How the the swords sealing work, does the sword have to hit the opponent to seal?

 

[Zel97]

Doesnt matter as long as its an action ger will reset it but he's physically too weak so its another incon

 

[Zel97]

U can bypass rtz's causality reset by either being acausal,having Causality M res,higher dimensional existense etc.

 

[Chariot190]

>Has GER ever worked on resetting higher dimensional sealing?

Doesn't need to, Trunks isn't Higher Dimensional, doesn't resist causality manipulation and it's Trunks performing the action, absolutely everything is in play for RTZ to work on Trunks. Ger doesn't need to reset the sealing itself if he can just negate Trunks himself.

 

[Zenkaibattery1]

The Keysword is Higher-Dimensional.

It is powered and made through time itself, similarly to how Mechikabura is a higher-dimensional via absorbing time and timelines.

 

[Chariot190]

Good for it, you somehow completely missed everything I said and how that is completely irrelevant.

 

[Zenkaibattery1]

So one GER supporter says Higher D works, one doesn't. Which one? You literally yourself said "Trunks isn't higher dimensional" as a way to say the sword won't work

Unless you can show definitve proof GER works against Higher Dimensional weapons, you are literally going down the route of NLF.

 

[Chariot190]

Higher D probably does work (As long as it's higher than 4D anyway, given GER has negated 4D abilities), to bad Trunks isn't Higher D, it doesn't matter if the sword has a Higher D ability when Trunks will never in a million years actually be able to use it because of RTZ because he's susceptible to it in every conceivable way, which is the part you're ignoring.

 

[Dragomer]

The whole point of the keysword is that it's higher D and **** other higher D characters, try again, if someone who was absolute time and beyond couldn't **** with it while also in their own magic realm that they made the rules for, GER can't either.

Trunks has basicaly the same power as the keysword when he wield it, that's the whole point, this isn't dragon age where the weapon's enchantement is independent from the user, it would make the whole thing pointless.

 

[Chariot190]

Good thing Trunks isn't Higher D then. Which seems to be the point neither of you actually understand.

 

[Dragomer]

Good thing Trunks isn't Higher D then. Which seems to be the point neither of you actually understand.

Read above, not dragon age.

 

[Chariot190]

Yes, he gets Chronoa's powers and assumedly Toki-Toki's powers, of which neither resist causality manipulation, so your point is? Trunks isn't Higher D and the powers he gains don't let him resist causality manipulation so...?

Actually a better question, what reason do we even have to assume the sword is acausal beyond time paradox? Because if the sword is still bound to cause and effect, it doesn't even matter how good its sealing is if it's basically just a 3D object with a Higher D power. Hell Mechikabura doesn't even causality manip.

Ignoring the fact the sword doesn't make Trunks Higher D nor does it grant him causality resistance, it's on you to prove Trunks can resist causality manipulation when nothing suggests he does, not even the powers he does gain, rather than me to prove causality manip would work on a character that dosn't resist it.

 

[Planck69]

So one GER supporter says Higher D works, one doesn't. Which one? You literally yourself said "Trunks isn't higher dimensional" as a way to say the sword won't work
Unless you can show definitve proof GER works against Higher Dimensional weapons, you are literally going down the route of NLF.

The weapon itself isn't higher dimensional, isn't acausal, doesn't resist causality manip, is well within GER's range and isn't passive. Now tell me, why wouldn't GER work beyond you just parroting "muh higher dimenshuns" and throwing around NLF likke it automatically debunks what I said. Go on, explain this to me. Hell, even higher dimensional beings can be bound by the same system of causality as lower dimensional beings (though this portrayal is rare) so I don't even see your point regardless.

 

[C2_of_Omegon]

As far as I can see, there's nothing saying that Trunks himself is higher dimensional nor does he resist casuality, he is still within GER's capability to effect. Trunks would still have to bring the Keysword to bear and use it. Thus, he still is going to get MUDA MUDA.

 

[Chariot190]

Well technically no, what it means is that neither can actually kill each other. It's gonna end up as inconclusive, Trunks can't do shit all and GER can't actually kill Trunks or incap.

 

[Dragomer]

No, it's going to end with Trunks sealing GER with a seal a higher dimensional being couldn't do shit about, GER's power never worked like you're trying to say, we clearly see Diavolo doing normal shit between each 'reset', Diavolo didn't just get reset back every picosecond or any such nonsense., the only difference here is that the sealing won't be reset.

 

[Planck69]

No, it's going to end with Trunks sealing GER with a seal a higher dimensional being couldn't do shit about, GER's power never worked like you're trying to say, we clearly see Diavolo doing normal shit between each 'reset', Diavolo didn't just get reset back every picosecond or any such nonsense., the only difference here is that the sealing won't be reset.

If you're talking about the Death Loop, the very point was that no matter what Diavolo did he would always end up dying but never actually approaching death. The first time RtZ is actually used, Diavolo couldn't do jack and was reverted to the very beginning of the fight. And are you seriously trying to ignore causality manip with the excuse, "muh higher dimensions" when I've already told you how that in itself means jack? Trunks sword may have higher dimensional power but it's just a 3-D sword end of the day. It's still getting reverted either way.

 

[Dragomer]

Yeah and he wasn't re-sent to the start every pico second, so the seal go off either way and there's no undoing that.

The sealing isn't 3D at all, the whole point is that it could seal Mechikabura's higher dimension nonsense, try again and calling the Keysword 3D is nonsense when it's litteraly made to be at least 4D, that's like the whole point of the sword.

'muh higher dimension' is an actual thing on this site, not my fault and it's better than 'my overexaggerated interpretation of the ability's description on the profile'.

 

[Chariot190]

You can keep saying that but you're wrong, for one trying to make such claims nothing on any of the profiles is backing you up.

>we clearly see Diavolo doing normal shit between each 'reset', Diavolo didn't just get reset back every picosecond or any such nonsense

That's straight up wrong, factually incorrect, either you're blind or being ignorant because that's literally what happened, ignoring Diavolo couldn't do anything at all nor did he do anything at all when being reset, he was frozen in place, it's even less than a picosecond, it's every singular moment, a moment is less than a picosecond, a moment is a literal instant. Unless you mean his death? The thing that never actually happened because it was always reset an infinitasmly small amount of time before it actually occurred? Diavolo wasn't being reset in those instances, his death was, and his death never actually came to be, when Diavolo himself was being reset, well he couldn't do **** all, same with Trunks here. He's never going to be able to seal because him sealing will never actually occur, because he'd be reset the exact moment before he actually does it, and he's completely susceptible to being reset and nothing he or the sword has suggests otherwise.

Also nice try but you're gonna have to prove that Trunks or any of the powers he gained somehow makes him immune to cause and effect even though he lacks said powers and nothing in the source material actually suggests he can resist or is unbound by it and even the characters he fought lack the capability to manipulate cause and effect in anyway so there's no powerscaling going on either. If you wanna make a CRT that says Trunks is immune to cause and effect when weilding the key sword go ahead but till then, you're wrong. Also you're acting like the sealing itself is Higher Dimensional and ignores causality, which looking into it along with various other cases on the wiki, being able to effect a higher dimensional thing doesn't make you higher dimensional as well, simply not how it works. Hell DBZ alone is the prime example of that, just about any character worth a damn can blow up time but they're all still 3D.


Seems to me you simply don't actually understand what causality manip entails, how characters are deemed able to resist it or not and are blatantly ignoring what actually happens when it's being used, or rather the lack of what happens. Don't like it? Then I suggest you start working on giving Trunks some resistances because GER has 4D causality manipulation and that's something Trunks nor the sword has ever shown the ability to resist, especially because Trunks and the sword just seem t be 3D but with a 4D skill and as such are obviously still effected by hax they have no resistance towards. The only way sealing would work is if Trunks could retroactively seal something in the past but even then, that won't work because GER can disconnect what happens with what is guranteed to happen in the future, so given Trunks would be reset the exact moment before he actually does anything and Trunks isn't immune to causality manipulation, well honestly you're unfortunately wrong on this front.

 

[Dragomer]

You should take your own advice, just because you keep pretending GER is going to undo a higher dimensional sealing and power null won't make it true.

 

[Chariot190]

Nice rebuttal. I can't tell if you're being ignorant or simply failing to read the simplest of things.

GER doesn't need to revert it (Even though nothing actually states he can't, it having a higher dimensional skill doesn't equate to having a resistance to any and all powers, especially when GER's causality manipulation is on the same dimensional tiering as said power and said power has never shown a resistance to cause and effect), why? Because Trunks is by all accounts susceptible to it and as such it doesn't ******* matter what the sealing is because Trunks will never be able to get it off because he'd be reset the exact moment he tries to use it ad infinitum. You don't like it? Have fun giving Trunks resistance to causality manipulation because untill then you're wrong.

Learn to read, undo the sealing? He doesn't need to when he can just reset Trunks before he even gets the chance to use it.

 

[Dragomer]

It's a valid rebuttable, you finding it nice or not doesn't matter.

I'v read all the scans and none of them show him just spamming people back to their starting point before they can move a centimeter.

All your stuff is based on Trunks somehow being vulnerable to something below the sword litteraly made to power him up and give him powers and still fail because as it is depicted, Trunks can still use his power null and sealing and from that point on, it doesn't matter if we assume it just get insta reset every picoseconde, neither the power null nor the sealing will be undone.

 

[Zenkaibattery1]

Writing massive paragraphs continuiosuly isn't going to help your case

Trunks has 4th dimensional power so he can control a 4th dimensional weapon. He literally does so in the game lmao.

The sword is what's going to work on Gio, not Trunks himself. How the hell do you think it worked on Mechikabura who himself is a 4th dimensional being

Again, please prove to me GER can reset a higher-dimensional weapon.

 

[Chariot190]

I wouldn't call you not actually rebutting anything a valid rebuttal. By definition your rebuttal fails at being a rebuttal because you didn't rebut anything, the fact you consider it a rebuttal is even worse, because that's the one thing you actually failed to do.

>I'v read all the scans and none of them show him just spamming people back to their starting point before they can move a centimeter.

Then you have poor reading comprehension because he reset Diavolo the exact moment he tried attacking GER, putting him back to where he started, the moment Diavolo attempted to attack GER he was reset and made to have never actually done anything. Same thing will happen to Trunks, Trunks will attempt to seal GER and the exact moment before iot happens Trunks will be reset. That's hpow it works and that's how it's going to work.

>All your stuff is based on Trunks somehow being vulnerable to something below the sword litteraly made to power him up and give him powers and still fail because as it is depicted, Trunks can still use his power null and sealing and from that point on, it doesn't matter if we assume it just get insta reset every picoseconde, neither the power null nor the sealing will be undone.

Yes, because he is vulnerable to it, don't like it? As said go make a CRT, give Trunks Invulnerability to anything 4D and below including powers he's never shown any sort of resistance towards nor the characters he gained the powers of when weilding the sword, because none of them have it either, that's what you need to do, untill than as far as the wiki is concerned you're wrong. Trunks can't still use the sealing because he'd be reset the exact moment he tries to do it and unless the sealing is retroactive and can effect things in the past (It can't) and ignoring GER can create a disconnect to future events guranteed to occur, it won't matter, why? Because the sealing will never actually happen, Trunks won't get to use it and as such GER doesn't even need to reset the sealing because it won't even be used.