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I still disagree about Sasuke's Genjutsu > Infinite Tsukuyomi. I didn't think the statement says that, and he also doesn't have any feat,
I disagree, I think that's exactly what the statement is saying. I'm not seeing any extra or hidden context for it.

But look, here's an idea. You could fetch the raws and have them translated. I can wait, I'm in no rush to close this.
and the infinite Tsukuyomi literally has only one way to be broken and there's no way to do it alone, unless the person are a Rinnegan user and have the 9 bijuus chakra (Like Hagoromo for example).
That's only a requirement to dispell the Jutsu and free everyone, it has nothing to do with potency, and it doesn't say anything regarding the Sasuke situation.
 
I disagree, I think that's exactly what the statement is saying. I'm not seeing any extra or hidden context for it.

But look, here's an idea. You could fetch the raws and have them translated. I can wait, I'm in no rush to close this.

That's only a requirement to dispell the Jutsu and free everyone, it has nothing to do with potency, and it doesn't say anything regarding the Sasuke situation.
I agree with UchihaSlayer96 on this. It specifically says he has the best Genjutsu but if the Raws say otherwise then I'll change my mind.
 
team 7 in the chunin exams were able to notice see through a force field illusion, what would that classify as?
 
Itachi stated that the Kotoamatsukami was the ultimate genjutsu, and he's aware of the Infinite Tsukuyomi, so it should be stronger than it. It doesn't even say its the strongest Mangekyo Sharingan Genjutsu
 
I agree with OP's stated. Isn't Infinite Tsukuyomi supposed to be above all Genjustu and Rinnegan Sasuke's Genjustu? Or something wrong...
 
Hey US96, I'm curious, I wanted to answer from you, why Rinnegan Sasuke's Genjutsu is way stronger than IT thanks to Hagoromo (What he did to Bijuu by using Rinnegan Genjutsu in Anime, Manga and Game), IT was supposed to be all above Genjutsu. Why I get it from now on.
 
Hey US96, I'm curious, I wanted to answer from you, why Rinnegan Sasuke's Genjutsu is way stronger than IT thanks to Hagoromo (What he did to Bijuu by using Rinnegan Genjutsu in Anime, Manga and Game), IT was supposed to be all above Genjutsu. Why I get it from now on.
Because of the statement from the Last guidebook. It's linked in the sandbox.
 
Do you have proof that he's aware of the Infinite Tsukuyomi? Not trying to be an ass, I'm genuinely asking.
The Akatsuki all work to finish project Tsuki no me, and Itachi obviously knows how his organisation is gonna do it through a genjutsu

And the databook statement also just says its the strongest genjutsu, and the Infinite Tsukuyomi databook statement is in that same book
 
The Akatsuki all work to finish project Tsuki no me, and Itachi obviously knows how his organisation is gonna do it through a genjutsu

And the databook statement also just says its the strongest genjutsu, and the Infinite Tsukuyomi databook statement is in that same book
Actually, no, this is not true at all. Most Akatsuki members had no idea about the Infinite Tsukuyomi. Pain, the leader, thought they'd control the world through the power of the Bijuu. He never spoke of the IT. Obito knew Itachi was a spy, and didn't trust him at all. The only Akatsuki members who actually knew were Zetsu and Kisame.
 

Kotoamatsukami

  • Genjutsu, Kekkei Genkai, Supplementary, All ranges
  • User(s): Uchiha Shisui, Shimura Danzou
The eye dominates the consciousness, transforming the one who sees into a pawn.

The Mangekyou Sharingan of Uchiha Shisui uses the strongest Genjutsu. The user exerts influence on the opponent, manipulating his actions without his being aware of it. Victory can be achieved without a battle, a wonderful jutsu. The constraints of Impure World Reincarnation were rewritten by their power. The Sharingan that Danzou stole from Shisui was used to manipulate Mifune in order to secretly dominate the conference of the Five Kage
Hmmm, well, you're right. It does say that. So that's technically two statements of it being the "strongest" or "ultimate" genjutsu.
I guess it's fine, but I'd like to hear more opinions on this one.
 
Hmmm, well, you're right. It does say that. So that's technically two statements of it being the "strongest" or "ultimate" genjutsu.
I guess it's fine, but I'd like to hear more opinions on this one.
But there's still Sasuke's Statement from the Novel and his Genjutsu comes from an Eye far superior to a Mangekyo Sharingan.
 
You forgot sense manipulation for Genjutsu, also for your Sharingan profile

And you forgot that Hagoromo has it too
 
Fair enough. Does that mean the more superior genjutsu require Uchiha blood for them to be escaped?
I don't think the "Sharingan + Uchiha blood" thing should be taken literally for Tsukuyomi. Itachi used it on seasoned Sharingan users during the massacre and they couldn't do anything about it. Likewise, Sasuke also couldn't truly escape from it, even with a fully mature Sharingan. Even his MS genjutsu apparently paled in comparison.

So I think it was either Itachi not being entirely truthful (which wouldn't be a first), or it was simply retconned later on.
 
I don't think the "Sharingan + Uchiha blood" thing should be taken literally for Tsukuyomi. Itachi used it on seasoned Sharingan users during the massacre and they couldn't do anything about it. Likewise, Sasuke also couldn't truly escape from it, even with a fully mature Sharingan. Even his MS genjutsu apparently paled in comparison.

So I think it was either Itachi not being entirely truthful (which wouldn't be a first), or it was simply retconned later on.
Is it confirmed that he used Tsukiyomi against the Uchiha's in the massacre? I can only remember Itachi casting it on Izumi in the novels.

And Sasuke did break out of the Tsuikyomi against Itachi, even if Itachi held back he still broke out of it himself.
 
He did I forgot who it was on but I remember him doing it (not including Izumi)

Itachi let him escape
Yeah, I sort of remember that he used it on some guy he didn't like to violently kill him in the illusion, causing him to die in the real world.

Obito literally told Sasuke that Itachi could've killed him at any point in that fight.
 
He did I forgot who it was on but I remember him doing it (not including Izumi)

Itachi let him escape
Really? Even if he did, he can still kill them whilst they are busy breaking out of the Tsukiyomi (unless the context is different).

After Itachi casted Tsukiyomi on Sasuke, there was a brief moment where he was paralysed before he broke out of it. Itachi could have took the opportunity to kill during that time.
 
Really? Even if he did, he can still kill them whilst they are busy breaking out of the Tsukiyomi (unless the context is different).

After Itachi casted Tsukiyomi on Sasuke, there was a brief moment where he was paralysed before he broke out of it. Itachi could have took the opportunity to kill during that time.
Yeah, which Itachi was trying to avoid as much as possible. He didn't want to kill Sasuke, he wanted to get rid of Orochimaru and then have Sasuke kill him in the Process since he was literally on Death's Door anyways due to his Illness.
 
Yeah, which Itachi was trying to avoid as much as possible. He didn't want to kill Sasuke, he wanted to get rid of Orochimaru and then have Sasuke kill him in the Process since he was literally on Death's Door anyways due to his Illness.
But he can still cast Tsukiyomi without having an intent to kill. He used it on him 2 times before, without killing him.

Itachi wanted to test Sasuke as well, and considering Sasuke has both requirements for breaking out of Tsukiyomi, Itachi could have casted it without worrying whether Sasuke gets beaten by it.

He even used Amaterasu against Sasuke even though it was an insta-kill move back then. He wouldn't have done that if he wasn't sure Sasuke had a means to counter it. Same with Tsukiyomi.
 
But he can still cast Tsukiyomi without having an intent to kill. He used it on him 2 times before, without killing him.

Itachi wanted to test Sasuke as well, and considering Sasuke has both requirements for breaking out of Tsukiyomi, Itachi could have casted it without worrying whether Sasuke gets beaten by it.

He even used Amaterasu against Sasuke even though it was an insta-kill move back then. He wouldn't have done that if he wasn't sure Sasuke had a means to counter it. Same with Tsukiyomi.
No, he had ZERO intention of harming Sasuke. He just wanted to push him just enough to
A) Make the fight believable enough for Sasuke to still believe he's evil.
B) To have Sasuke run out of chakra and release Orochimaru, so he'd get rid of him.

Obito straight up confirmed that Sasuke never saw through Itachi's illusions, and that Itachi could've killed him at any point if he really wanted to.
 
No, he had ZERO intention of harming Sasuke. He just wanted to push him just enough to
A) Make the fight believable enough for Sasuke to still believe he's evil.
B) To have Sasuke run out of chakra and release Orochimaru, so he'd get rid of him.

Obito straight up confirmed that Sasuke never saw through Itachi's illusions, and that Itachi could've killed him at any point if he really wanted to.
Yes, it's obvious that Itachi wasn't trying to kill him, but Sasuke still broke out of Tsukiyomi regardless whether Itachi held back.

And btw, why does Obito's statement carry any more worth than Itachi's back in part 1? It's not contradicted is it?
 
Yes, it's obvious that Itachi wasn't trying to kill him, but Sasuke still broke out of Tsukiyomi regardless whether Itachi held back.
But it does matter. Him holding back puts the feat into question. Sasuke apparently failing to see through his illusions, puts the feat into question.
And remember, Obito saw the battle, because Black Zetsu recorded it for him. So he's a good source of information.
And btw, why does Obito's statement carry any more worth than Itachi's back in part 1? It's not contradicted is it?
It is. Like I already said, Itachi used it on a guy called Tekka Uchiha, and he was completely helpless against it.
 
They worked with Kishimoto in that arc to make sure it was accurate,
Irrelevant. Even if that were true, it doesn't change the fact that the anime filler is anime filler. It also has multiple contradictions to the manga, but again, it doesn't matter because it's.....well, anime filler.
and where does it say our profiles don't include filler?
I'll do you one better. We don't use the anime at all, let alone anime filler.
Our profiles are strictly manga only, alongside the canon novels, databooks, fanbooks, and certain accepted game OVAs.
 
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