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Garou Revision

Continent level+, up to Small Planet level+ (Comparable to his attack potency)

You should note that he survived Saitama's Consecutive Normal Punches which are individually stronger than Garou's Extreme Power Attack.
 
Yes, it did. Everything after he initially hit the ground is him pushing Saitama into the Earth, which directly causes seismic waves that lift the continental plate. Once again, if he had stopped his attack after hitting the ground, then it would count for only AP.

What do you mean that "doesn't happen via pushing"? You do realize the action of pushing releases energy too, right? Especially kinetic energy. There is absolutely nothing preventing a push from generating shockwaves, holes, and denting of the crust. It is literally what happens in the panels. What even is your argument?

Yes, it is both Lifting Strength and Attack Potency. It is not uncommon for them to go together, especially with pull/push feats like this.

You just fully evaded my point. It's on you to prove that nothing past mountain busting would have happened had he turned off those thrusters. Simply saying "well, he keeps pushing" isn't evidence of anything.

Either prove it or concede, but don't play thus "duh, ofc this is the case" game, because that's just wasting everyone's time. There is no evidence, nor is that even implied, as we see all those panels right after another before cutting back to Garou continuing to push Saitama.

Like I said, it is only LS if the original charge was irrelevant to him continuing to move. Continuing to move is easier once in motion. So much easier that it probably shouldn't even be LS even if the initial charge was irrelevant.
 
This seems fine though we usually remove text from dialogue bubbles in pictures
 
You just fully evaded my point. It's on you to prove that nothing past mountain busting would have happened had he turned off those thrusters. Simply saying "well, he keeps pushing" isn't evidence of anything.

Either prove it or concede, but don't play thus "duh, ofc this is the case" game, because that's just wasting everyone's time. There is no evidence, nor is that even implied, as we see all those panels right after another before cutting back to Garou continuing to push Saitama.

Like I said, it is only LS if the original charge was irrelevant to him continuing to move. Continuing to move is easier once in motion. So much easier that it probably shouldn't even be LS even if the initial charge was irrelevant.
It is you who is wasting time. What I and others have stated is what is shown to you in the manga. And I have already provided evidence in the scans above.

It is on you to prove that he would've busted the mountain and caused the feat without pushing Garou into the Earth, not me to prove the opposite.
 
Suggestion on Garou's Key Naming Scheme:

Naming all of Garou's Post-Sage Centipede Self "Perfected Fist Garou" is bad, because Garou's Perfected Fist" is something he attains while he is still lean and human-looking. The more monstrous he becomes over the following chapters the more wild and brute his attacks become. So It should still be Post-Sage Centipede, and not "Perfected Fist" for the whole thing.

However, we can't also call it Monster Garou since Garou definitively becomes a Monster by the time he breaks into the surface, since there's an entire chapter where he has his epiphany and accepts his Monster Self before emerging. So here is my simple solution:

  • Garou's Post-Darkshine Self should have Two Pictures, one of which is Garou with the Spirals in his body, which should be named Limiter Breaking since that is what happens to his body right as that starts to happen, and Garou gets to power-boost to stomp Darkshine whereas previously he was struggling against a brick wall.
  • The second picture in Garou's Post-Darkshine Self should be Monster Garou and that would be the Current Picture. Self explanatory.
  • Now for Garou's Post-Sage Centipede Key, we would have the same four pictures that we have, only we need to change their naming scheme. Calling the first picture Garou's "First Form" is objectively wrong, as that is just the same Garou as before, only evolved and with his martial arts being perfected. Instead, we should call the first picture Perfected Fist because that's his defining characteristic
  • This means that what we are calling Garou's "Second Form" should instead be called Complete Monster, as once that happens Garou starts gloating about finally becoming the monster he always wanted to be and using his newfound strength to plunge the world into darkness and defeat Saitama.
  • Finally, the current "Third" and "Fourth Form" Just get renamed to Second Form and Third Form since they are merely quick evolutions of Garou's Complete Monster Self.
To demonstrate my proposal, I made this mockup:

 


"ここに最強のガロウが覚醒!"
"Koko ni saikyō no garō ga kakusei!"
"The Strongest Garou awakens here!"


We could also just call the Fourth Key Awakened Garou since this Tweet supports it.
 
Suggestion on Garou's Key Naming Scheme:

Naming all of Garou's Post-Sage Centipede Self "Perfected Fist Garou" is bad, because Garou's Perfected Fist" is something he attains while he is still lean and human-looking. The more monstrous he becomes over the following chapters the more wild and brute his attacks become. So It should still be Post-Sage Centipede, and not "Perfected Fist" for the whole thing.

However, we can't also call it Monster Garou since Garou definitively becomes a Monster by the time he breaks into the surface, since there's an entire chapter where he has his epiphany and accepts his Monster Self before emerging. So here is my simple solution:

  • Garou's Post-Darkshine Self should have Two Pictures, one of which is Garou with the Spirals in his body, which should be named Limiter Breaking since that is what happens to his body right as that starts to happen, and Garou gets to power-boost to stomp Darkshine whereas previously he was struggling against a brick wall.
  • The second picture in Garou's Post-Darkshine Self should be Monster Garou and that would be the Current Picture. Self explanatory.
  • Now for Garou's Post-Sage Centipede Key, we would have the same four pictures that we have, only we need to change their naming scheme. Calling the first picture Garou's "First Form" is objectively wrong, as that is just the same Garou as before, only evolved and with his martial arts being perfected. Instead, we should call the first picture Perfected Fist because that's his defining characteristic
  • This means that what we are calling Garou's "Second Form" should instead be called Complete Monster, as once that happens Garou starts gloating about finally becoming the monster he always wanted to be and using his newfound strength to plunge the world into darkness and defeat Saitama.
  • Finally, the current "Third" and "Fourth Form" Just get renamed to Second Form and Third Form since they are merely quick evolutions of Garou's Complete Monster Self.
To demonstrate my proposal, I made this mockup:

I still think it would look better if all of Garou’s Monster form would be under a a single Monster Garou tab.

It could go
Monster tab:
1st Form
Perfected Fist/Awakened Garou
Complete Monster/2nd form
3rd Form
4th Form
 
I’d rather just give him At least Low 5-B+ for now because I don’t want this thread to turn into a 5-B Saitama debate.
I'm fine with either at least low 5-B possibly 5-B or solid 5-B for Saitama
Hmmm


Mid-End is accepted.

1.6128177e+32 joules or 38.583 Zettatons

Cool.


Planet level starts at 2.48700e32 or 59.44 Zettatons

59.44/38.583 = 1.54057486

Saitama needs to be x1.54 times stronger than Garou to break into Planet level.

And here's the thing, he objectively is.

A Casual Saitama was overpowering Garou despite only having half as many arms as he does. Garouhas twice the number of limbs to exert his strength with and yet he couldn't measure up to Saitama's casual punches, in a fight where Caped Baldy isn't even trying to kill him.

Saitama is at least twice as strong as Garou at the most lowballed ever, and everybody knows he is much, much, much stronger. To deny it is downplay.

Couple that with Saitama's own statement and a definitive Planet level Rating for Caped Baldy is 100% acceptable.
 
What is the basis for 5-B Saitama? Just upscaling + planet obliteration statement?

Upscaling 1.55x isn't allowed and Low 5-B+ AP is still enough to destroy the planet with minimal effort.

While I do think Saitama is more than likely above 5-B, I don't think this evidence is quite enough to support a solid rating for him.

Possibly or likely should be sufficient.
 
Saitama is at least twice as strong as Garou at the most lowballed ever, and everybody knows he is much, much, much stronger. To deny it is downplay.
I am well aware that there is enough support to put Saitama at 5-B. I have said that I am fine with 5-B Saitama on multiple occasions in the discussion thread.

However, I know that there are some people that disagree with that, and I’d rather not have this thread that’s about Garou turn into a big debate over Saitama being Low 5-B or 5-B.
 
Hmmm


Mid-End is accepted.

1.6128177e+32 joules or 38.583 Zettatons

Cool.


Planet level starts at 2.48700e32 or 59.44 Zettatons

59.44/38.583 = 1.54057486

Saitama needs to be x1.54 times stronger than Garou to break into Planet level.

And here's the thing, he objectively is.

A Casual Saitama was overpowering Garou despite only having half as many arms as he does. Garouhas twice the number of limbs to exert his strength with and yet he couldn't measure up to Saitama's casual punches, in a fight where Caped Baldy isn't even trying to kill him.

Saitama is at least twice as strong as Garou at the most lowballed ever, and everybody knows he is much, much, much stronger. To deny it is downplay.

Couple that with Saitama's own statement and a definitive Planet level Rating for Caped Baldy is 100% acceptable.
Not to mention it was established Garou’s attack point of contact = the highest damage output last chapter so Saitama tanked far more of the energy than the Earth did.
 
I mean, I really don't think we need another thread just for Saitama scaling to this feat
 
dam these wiki upscale rules be atrocious, sad that in verse multipliers where a character goes toe to toe and triples his strength to barely edge out a win is supported over someone neg diffing yet not being 1.5x stronger. :confused:
 
6gfabc.jpg
 
I agree with using this. Looks good.

Though one thing that bugs me personally is that half-monster garou image being the only colored image on the page. It's just a little out of place.

(Referring to Matt's suggestion)
 
Hold up, isn't limiter breaking part of his half monster key? That's where his At least 7-B is in his half monster key. And that form is in the dark shine fight, not after it.
 
Hold up, isn't limiter breaking part of his half monster key? That's where his At least 7-B is in his half monster key. And that form is in the dark shine fight, not after it.
He has a Power Boost when he blocks Darkshine's Bazooka and the Limiter starts to break, and then another after monstrifying. Its okay to be in the same key.
 
He has a Power Boost when he blocks Darkshine's Bazooka and the Limiter starts to break, and then another after monstrifying. Its okay to be in the same key.
But that happens within said Garou vs Dark shine fight. His third key is when he appears on the surface again
 
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