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Fusion Zamasu powers

That's just the one scanlation. The Viz translation says the universe will be destroyed. The spoiler providers also said the universe would be destroyed. The Korean raws also say the universe will be destroyed. I'm having a hard time finding the Japanese raws, I suspect they'd say the same.
 
Jobbo said:
That's just the one scanlation. The Viz translation says the universe will be destroyed. The spoiler providers also said the universe would be destroyed. The Korean raws also say the universe will be destroyed. I'm having a hard time finding the Japanese raws, I suspect they'd say the same.
Click to expand...
Yeah, even the italaian translation does.
 
DBS manga universal
Found the raws. The word "hakai" is used, it's definitely destruction.
Looking at the exact words:

Uchu = Universe

Zentai = Whole, entirety

Hakai = Destruction, Destroy

Shimau = To finish, to close, to do something completely

It's basically saying the whole universe will be completely destroyed.
 
Any DB fan has heard Hakai and Uchu countless times so those should be self-explanatory, here's the other two from eudict:

https://eudict.com/?lang=japeng&word=shimau

https://eudict.com/?lang=japeng&word=zentai

Anyway, even SSG Goku should be solidly 3-A from this. If he weren't 3-A there'd be some surviving neutron stars at the other edge of the universe no matter how many shockwaves Goku and Beerus send out since they wouldn't receive enough energy to completely overcome their GBE and thus the universe wouldn't be completely destroyed.
 
Yeah no, its 3-B not 3-A. We have no time frame.

Also gonna have to repeat my question: "This question may come out stupid, but do we actually have evidence that Hakai is existance erasure in the manga and not just transmutation / matter manipulation? (Asking because I just say a picture showing manga hakai making someone turn to dust rather than what anime hakai does)"
 
That is a lie @Jobbo. Even you know Elder Kai says "at this rate" and never gives a timeframe.
 
Goku and probably Toppo or Jiren at this rate. Maybe Beerus (But he would be a heavily nerfed one)
 
That's the only part that's relevant. The clash of their fists produces the energy, everything after that happens on its own.
 
It would be the only part that's relevant if it was ever stated to be one clash that makes the universe go boom, the destruction of the universe wasn't gonna be in one clash, but at a rate. We don't know the rate either, maybe 30 seconds more of fighting, maybe 5 minutes, maybe an hour, that's the issue here.
 
It wouldn't really make a difference, though. A single clash would need to have the power to destroy the outermost neutron star in order to properly destroy the universe. If that one clash fails to overcome the star's GBE, it'd just collapse back together and the subsequent shockwaves would change absolutely nothing.
 
I don't know. There's really no difference, Black and Zamasu just fused together permanently.
 
@Jobbo..... How long do you think it takes for the GBE to collapse back together?....

@Torlikoff no idea, I'll probably remove it once this thread is concluded. (Though technically they treat it as a form for some reason)
 
It's because it's in the Powers and Abilities section and is different from regular Zamasu.
 
It depends. I suppose close to infinitely long if the energy is just under the GBE. I suppose you're assuming Goku and Beerus would rapidly create shockwaves that hit the star before it has time to recompose itself. I guess that's fair enough, but the energy still shouldn't be significantly below the actual GBE in order for each shockwave to have any significant effect on the star. The total energy required would also go up quite a bit since the star would have some time to lose velocity between each shockwave.

It seems it comes down to how frequently you believe Goku and Beerus were hitting each other. Considering fights in the ToP can take minutes each, I imagine each hit would have been a few seconds or so apart.
 
I mean, when you're Massively ftl+, a few minutes or even seconds is a lifetime of punches. I find it hard pressed that GBE would even matter at that point.

There's also the fury of punches dragon ball is known for, which would mean an insane amount of punches every once in a while.
 
It never actually works that way, though. Hit's a complete jobber despite having a 0.1s time skip which would logically be practically an eternity, yet he's only able to get a single attack off in that time.

The surface gravity of a neutron star is also in the trillions of metres per second^2 and the escape velocity is close to the speed of light. Unless its mass is accelerated to a signifcant portion of the speed of light it'd collapse practically instantaneously.
 
I'm talking about the manga. He's a bit more impressive in the anime, though still not nearly what one would expect from an MFTL+.

It was considered. GBE can approximated as the mass times the escape velocity squared. It's a bit off since mass is unevenly distributed, but it's within an order of magnitude. Failing to overcome a body's GBE naturally means failing to accelerate it fast enough.
 
The thing is they have to be universal to accelerate it that fast. Kinetic energy and velocity are directly linked, it's how celestial body destruction feats are measured on this wiki. In order to destroy something you must give it enough energy for it to move fast enough to overcome its gravitational pull. And the energy required to perform this acceleration at that range would be universal.
 
No, they don't where are you getting that they have to be universal? Universal means they destroye the universe in that one punch which is definitely not the case.

Kinetic energy falls apart the moment we reached ftl speeds, ignoring the fact that by dbz you can actually hit slower but harder at the same time (USSJ Trunks)
 
So from what I see, the arguments from Jobbo is that in order for the 3rd Punch to be universal (Destroying the outermost Neutron Stars) before they reform, their punches still must be 3-A as if their total force doesn't make enough energy, the stars would simply not be harmed whatsoever ,MFTL+ or not.
 
3rd punch?? Thats anime exclusive, the manga doesn't have the 3 / 2.5 punches part.
 
I'll try find a new scan to replace the old one when I get home (if I can't now), or someone else can.

That was originally meant to just be a scan of them shaking the universe, rather than some universal destruction feat from the translation because we agreed in some other thread that it wasn't, which was based solely on the universe only being in "jeopardy".

Also, I think we should add the key back. It's neater, and the normal one doesn't have those abilities.

@Data if I remember, it only shows one and skips to the end.
 
No I'm pretty sure they never mentioned anything about the 2.5 / 3 punches part, only the shockwaves part is the same.
 
That's what I was saying.

Also, this is apparently the original if someone can translate it. [1]

Edit: Never mind.
 
I didn't see your comment.

The guy in the place I got this from must have been mistaken then.
 
Since we are discussing the translations, I must point out again that according to this hard copy, the scene was almost exactly like the anime. The shock waves were reaching the Kaioshin realm and according to the Elder Kai - "the entire universe will be destroyed".

Manga
 
As for the OP, I agree. Fusion Zamasu should have all the abilities of Zamasu and Goku Black (and Goku).
 
AKM sama said:
Since we are discussing the translations, I must point out again that according to this hard copy, the scene was almost exactly like the anime. The shock waves were reaching the Kaioshin realm and according to the Elder Kai - "the entire universe will be destroyed".
Manga
Click to expand...
Which means 3A like others have said before.
 
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