bro, this is some basics type shit dawg. that was offguard, when dangai Ichigo wasn't really trying at all. Ichigo proceeded to slap away his 6 fragor
read the actual quote. it's talking about the gotei 13 in general. Though Yama > Aizen in AP, Aizen isn't Kenpachi, he's got Kyoka Suygetsu. Who are stronger than that in the gotei dawg?
Again, there's no proof Ichigo had the combat pass with him while in the dangai nor when he did the FGT.
no, his fullbring form is only above bankai, not striped mask
bruh moment, that blatantly doesn't mean they scale to him in power. They're literally scientists figurign out ways to counter that. TYBW Aizen deliberately outscales them. This is the dumbest argument I've seen yet, since it's specifically restraints that aren't overpowering Aizen or doing something crazy like what you're claiming.
OMFG, not that stupid hype for Jugram that's written by the editors, provably untrue (as Jugram < Almighty Yhwach), and removed from any actual important releases of the manga. Blud can't handle Bankai Yama's power.
Bottom line, and a fact you can't get across:
Yama = static in power, implied heavily by the series, stated WOG.
CFYOW Yoruichi, Byakuya, Tokinada, and Shunsui < Base Aizen and Yama's Shikai
Yama > everyone in the gotei, except for Kenpachi in CFYOW, by a lot. His shikai alone >>> Bankai Byakuya and people who get massive amps in the TYBW arc.
From what we know of second, third, fourth, Monster Aizen, Dangai Ichigo, and Mugetsu, there is a substantial gap between even the strongest in the gotei and the weakest I've mentioned here. Multiply Shikai Aizen by 20, and it's still not enough to get dangai Ichigo.
Idk how to quote in specific sections unfortunately
1.) It most definitely wasn’t off guard, Ichigo was literally staring at him charge up and launch the Fragor. Ichigo swatting away Ultra Fragor means he scales above Aizen still, but Aizen closed the gap enough to the point where he could damage Ichigo
2.) Are you asking who’s relative to or stronger than Shinigami Aizen? In that case, anyone relative to Urahara or anyone relative to Complete Fullbring Ichigo, who above Striped Mask Ichigo who’s in the same realm of power as Shinigami Aizen (though he downscales) and Yama not counting Ryujin Jakka’s AP (As that specifically is what put Yama above Aizen)
3.) Wym there’s no proof? You think Ichigo suddenly just put it down randomly off screen at some point? That and as supporting evidence, in the anime, the exact scene where Ginjo explains the badge monitors and regulates Ichigo’s energy, it shows Ichigo going into FGT. And other scenes during the anime show Dangai and FGT Ichigo when recalling the badge remembers his past battles.
4.) Why would Ginjo and Tsukishima only be talking about Ichigo’s Bankai? For one, Ginjo knows Ichigo has hollowfication, which is why he brought up that the fullbringers had hollow powers they wanted to get rid of. For Ichigo to sympathize with that. Second, Tsukishima is even aware of up to Dangai Ichigo in both the anime and manga when he ‘helped Ichigo defeat Aizen’. And we know for Tsukishima, it’s not just memory implantation, but from his perspective the events actually happened.
And finally, Bankai Ichigo even in FKT was weaker than the upper tiers of Shinigami. Ginjo’s entire goal was to use Ichigo’s power to wipe out the Gotei 13. With the context of Striped Mask Ichigo, Shinigami Aizen, Shikai Yama etc’s power being able to be sensed, Ginjo and Tsukishima knowing about Ichigo’s hollowfication, at least being aware of Dangai even if we argue they don’t know it’s strength etc, you’d have to infer than Ginjo and Tsukishima are idiots for them to refer to Ichigo regaining and surpassing his original powers and going beyond/transcending Shinigami meaning just his Bankai. Especially when Fullbring encompasses hollow powers already. The Fullbring is the reason why FB Shini Ichigo doesn’t hollow-fy anymore anyways
5.) Not inherently it doesn’t, but given the context of even Chrysalis Aizen’s power being completely foreign and unable to be understood by them to the point Aizen compared it to the difference between 2-D and 3-D beings, to them being able to not just understand but to be able to actively restrain the power of TYBW Aizen who surpassed God Aizen, and to be able to understand Ichigo’s power in the Death Saves the Strawberry novel and the Fullbring Arc in order to restore his power to the exact level it was at before…ontop of the Gotei training to defeat threats on that level and sending a hit squad of a few Captain level Shinigami to kill the man that defeated Aizen
after they restored his powers back and Ginjo if they happened to work together….yea, there’s a lot of supporting evidence.
6.) The narration text is removed in the volume release versions of all jump manga, not just Bleach. Doesn’t make why they say any less valid. As well as every statement made in the TYBW regarding the strongest Quincy always without exception excludes Yhwach. As for the Yama, for 1, the statement was made during the first invasion where there were more Quincy alive for Jugram’s power to be distributed to and boost up. By the time of the statement, most of the others were either dead or effectively had their power redistributed to the Elites via the Holy Selection. And 2, the statement was made when Jugram had the Almighty and was specifically referring to Almighty Jugram, not his normal state. Though you could argue he’s above Yama in all but raw AP regardless due to Yama’s physicals while bloodlusted and rage amped scaling to Royd who’s not even top 7 Sternritter, but that’s neither here nor there.
7.) A key thing people miss about the CFYOW statement is which versions of said characters it was referring to. Aside from characters like Yoruichi and Urahara already being on Shinigami Aizen level back in FKT as stated by Aizen himself in Urahara’s case and Yama’s physical stats and Shikai AP being far surpassed by many Shinigami in the second invasion due to scaling ridiculously above Royd who could easily take bloodlusted Shikai Yama’s AP. (with his Zanpakuto’s AP being what both Aizen and Yhwach noted was most dangerous about Yama)
The statement was comparing Base/Shikai Tokinada to Base Yoruichi and Base/Shikai Byakuya. Yoruichi has several tiers of Shunko which are beyond Bankai level amps, and Byakuya’s Bankai already increases stats (of his zanpakuto, not his body per say though his reiatsu is what’s powering those stat amps). On top of Byakuya’s Bankai most likely being at the maximum 10x boost or beyond due to 0 Squad training.
Shunko Yoruichi and Bankai Byakuya would far surpass Shikai Tokinada, who scales to their Base/Shikai reiatsu levels.
At best you could argue Bankai Yama’s AP > most everyone in the Gotei, but you’d be hard pressed to argue that his physicals stats and Shikai AP do, due to being relative to Shinigami Aizen and Royd who’ve been far surpassed in the manga.
You could even argue Yama’s most dangerous abilities like East and West are through existence erasure hax and not raw AP but that’s another can of worms.
What we know for a fact based on the manga/anime and data books is that the Gotei has people stronger than Shini Aizen. But also that ‘Aizen’ hasn’t been surpassed yet. Unless we assume they’re talking about an arbitrary form of Aizen in between Shini and Final, they’re most likely referring to his most recent form at that time. So they have people arbitrarily above Shini but below God Aizen
It doesn’t matter too much for scaling because literally nobody in the Gotei scales to Fullbring Bankai Ichigo up until either maybe the last act of the TYBW or CFYOW (Who also has Ginjo, who canonically didn’t get any stronger and had just been wandering around the Rukon district aimlessly), relative to or above Hikone. Wiki profiles here say he randomly got stronger to accommodates the sites specific scaling consistency, and say he only reaches Hikone levels or above when rage amped, but the problem in actual context of the story, he’s the same strength as he was in the FB Arc, is on that Hikone level in Bankai, and then when rage amped he far surpassed that and hits True Bankai Ichigo GT levels of AP.
FB Bankai Ichigo scales to all but Rage Amped Ginjo as they were pretty damn evenly matched before Ginjo got his resolve shaken and smoked
