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Foxy Attack Speed Revision (One Piece)

Firestorm808

Firestorm808

VS Battles
Administrator
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Chapter 309

Foxy describes Noro Noro beams as Radiation and photons.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-WxcVwERRH..._tXR-N9-ZjSTxFuUigee8QCHM/s16000/0309-004.png

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-096PNIJee...jTN9iPxjaCh1oeASB-QVIgCHM/s16000/0309-005.png

Chapter 316

Foxy's Noro Noro beams are able to reflect off of mirrors.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-_T5qhiG2v...oC1uxOqx8AHEErLKSEr8BQCHM/s16000/0316-005.png

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-x-YPQjEX_...rbbfUFZcLhNB6Mzav0dbpACHM/s16000/0316-006.png

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-xPYxmi3je...pzKFHgjL_hAG-QfMugUC5QCHM/s16000/0316-007.png

On a side note, it's shown that Luffy is able to react to them.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-TCC60O5eR...OUeA_Mstt_ugiPYh7MKMGwCHM/s16000/0316-009.png

Based on these attributes, these Noro Noro Beams should be Speed of Light.

If this is considered a mistranslation, an outlier, or a PIS within the series, please elaborate.
 
While I think we shouldn't use this for scaling purposes, I agree with rating the Noro Beams as SoL with the evidence.
 
I don't think it can be called an outlier for Foxy at least, since it only scales to him and his attack speed. Luffy obviously doesn't scale for it being an outlier for him and it would really mess up scaling.
 
I agree that it seems to be indicitive of a light speed attack according to our standards.

I don't know much about the verse so I can't comment on PIS or who it scales to.
 
I'm not 100% sure they are lightspeed or if they just possess some of the properties of light while being slow themselves, but since we're agreeing not to scale anyone to them then it's fine for now.
 
Of course, this only applies to Foxy's Noro Beams and not even his combat/travel speed.

What do you mean with the beams being slow?
 
I'm aware of the trope. I was just saying the whole scene gives me doubts.

And as I've already said up above I'm fine with the scaling for now since it is an outlier.
 
I do not think there is enough evidence for light speed in the scans. The beams appear to be a attack that shares some properties with light but is clearly not light itself. Sharing some properties doesn't necessarily prove that the beams will share the speed of light as well.
 
"The beams appear to be a attack that shares some properties with light but is clearly not light itself. Sharing some properties doesn't necessarily prove that the beams will share the speed of light as well."

Are there other attacks in fiction that aren't light but act like light yet not as fast as light?

Lasers/light beams are only accepted as real if they meet, at a minimum, a few of these criteria:

  • The beam refracts in a new material, such as a liquid or...
  • The beam reflects off a material that it can be expected to, such as a non-magical mirror
  • The beam is called lightspeed by reliable sources
  • It is stated to be made of photons or light itself, again by a reliable source
  • It has its origin at a realistic source of light, such as a camera
Furthermore, there are a few criteria which show a beam is NOT real light:

  • It is shown at different speeds in the same material
  • It is tangible and can be interacted with physically by normal humans (Noro Beam Sword Phases through Luffy)
  • They do not travel in straight lines (unless you can prove refraction/reflection, see above) (Yes, they travel in straight lines.)
 
As far as I can see, the beams are not real light just going by how they have powers real light doesn't and was stated to be undiscovered by scientists. The criterias aren't really helpful here since they are used to determine if something stated to be light or laser are real light/laser or not.

If they are to be considered lightspeed, they need to be proven to share all properties of light or at least be implied to share the same speed as light.
 
^ I am disappointed in myself for not mentioning that comparison, especially since I looked over those calcs and threads.
 
The ghost rays might be a good point. Anyway, I don't agree with the thread but I won't contest it too hard. It doesn't bother me either way if it gets accepted or not.
 
It does not seems to pass the Laser/Light Beam Dodging Feats

Standards for laser determinatio
Most lasers in fiction are not real or provable as real. Often they are supernatural in nature and do not function anywhere close to how real light should. Therefore, lasers/light beams are only accepted as real if they meet, at a minimum, a few of these criteria:

  • The beam refracts in a new material, such as a liquid or...
  • The beam reflects off a material that it can be expected to, such as a non-magical mirror
  • The beam is called lightspeed by reliable sources
  • It is stated to be made of photons or light itself, again by a reliable source
  • It has its origin at a realistic source of light, such as a camera
Furthermore, there are a few criteria which show a beam is NOT real light:

  • It is shown at different speeds in the same material
  • It is tangible and can be interacted with physically by normal humans
  • They do not travel in straight lines (unless you can prove refraction/reflection, see above)
Please note that the opposite of these criteria do not prove a beam is at lightspeed, merely that it could be, should it meet the first list of criteria.

Additionally, if a series is very close to lightspeed or exceeds it in several other calcs and scenarios (such as what is seen in DBZ), there is less of a burden of proof to show that the laser is a true laser.

This is not a full list of qualities that can qualify/disqualify a feat as a true laser/light beam, but they are what is taken as basic by this wiki.

In all cases, when light beam feats pop-up, they must be discussed with the staff before implementation.
 
We could say that it comes from a natural source considering the Devil Fruits' powers shares the properties with the actual element.
 
The Noro Noro Beam literally literally fits the majority of the criterias for Light Speed. It's directly stated to be made out of photons and radiation particles, which move at light speed in real life. It's intangible, moves in a straight line, reflects off of surfaces and mirrors. Something doesn't need to be made of light in order to be light speed and various calcs and real life events prove this.
 
HierophantDeluxe said:
I don't know what Elizhaas talking about, seems like he just linked the page for you but didn't provided a counterpoint or anything.
Click to expand...
Photons that slow thing form radiation makes it hard to believe as it is nowhere near a light/radiation properties to this level- granted its from a fictional atomic source. Also, Radiation Manipulation attacks does not always scaled to the speed of light in fictions. Most importantly, suddenly The straw hats like Monkey D. Luffy (Pre-Timeskip) with At least Massively Hypersonic likely higher got with no even a plus sign get speed of light or Relativistic reaction; by Occam's Razor's, I am inclined to believe the beam is less likely to be light.
 
This seems mostly agreed and finished unless we need anyone else's approval I think this can be applied.
 
Calaca Vs said:
First, the speed of the verse is outdated. Second, we agreed that this would scale to Foxy and only Foxy.
CinCameron made a calc about Luffy dodging the Noro Beams at Sub Rel, but we're not using it.
Click to expand...
Then it would contradicted since the characters that can dodged or react to it are nowhere near the speed of light. I don't see the point. This is not reaction occurrence is way too much be call Outlier or Inconsistency.
 
Rei Rubro said:
If this only scales to Foxy, I do not see why not add
Click to expand...
We can't ignored contexts, the speed for update is contradicted many times from other characters.

To put put simply, there are more context of it being other characters speeds than light speed by Orcham Razor here and also update that are contradicted to such level in the verses tends not be accepted anyway.
 
I am a One Piece fan, but I can't do double standard for a feat that is contradicted.
 
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