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Fourth Hokage Defends Hidden Leaf Village

TauanVictor said:
What does Hiruzen have that would make this a debate in the first place?
Click to expand...
Even in his elderly state, he could fight against Edo Hashirama and Edo Tobirama, as well as put up a good fight against Orochimaru, so this isn't a stomp if that's what you're implying. I'd just like to see some debate since almost no matches exist for the Third Hokage.
 
TauanVictor said:
Hashirama and Tobirama who were far from their Edo versions in FSWW and didn't even use their most destructive jutsus.
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We didnt know anything about Prime Hiruzen either.. All we know is that Hiruzen was stronger than the 4 Kage (Before he got older) otherwise Konoha would already been a goner since 2nd World War.
Hiruzen was in 1st Shinobi War.
Hiruzen was Hokage in 2nd Shinobi War. The Title Sannin was created at the end of 2nd War.
Hiruzen was still in 3rd Shinobi War as Hokage.

Facts that Hiruzen couldnt be killed during 2nd and 3rd World War. Meaning his strength isn't weak. Considering How Strong Mu and Oonoki jutsu are. If you put Oonoki against those Six Path of Pain. Oonoki would win easily.

It just that we never seen anything about Prime Hiruzen. Only the Old Age Hiruzen, even if he was revive as Edo, it was still Old Age Brain Hiruzen.
 
We know virtually nothing about Prime Sarutobi, which makes this particular debate difficult.

But pain's got too many tricks up his sleeve.

I'll wait for further debate
 
Crayons said:
We didnt know anything about Prime Hiruzen either.. All we know is that Hiruzen was stronger than the 4 Kage (Before he got older) otherwise Konoha would already been a goner since 2nd World War.
Hiruzen was in 1st Shinobi War.
Hiruzen was Hokage in 2nd Shinobi War. The Title Sannin was created at the end of 2nd War.
Hiruzen was still in 3rd Shinobi War as Hokage.

Facts that Hiruzen couldnt be killed during 2nd and 3rd World War. Meaning his strength isn't weak. Considering How Strong Mu and Oonoki jutsu are. If you put Oonoki against those Six Path of Pain. Oonoki would win easily.

It just that we never seen anything about Prime Hiruzen. Only the Old Age Hiruzen, even if he was revive as Edo, it was still Old Age Brain Hiruzen.
Click to expand...
You know, make a CRT for Prime Hiruzen to be compared to Hashirama. At the moment, we are only using speculation, which unfortunately makes it too difficult for Hiruzen.
 
Alright, since there's too much speculation around Prime Hiruzen, I've changed the keys so now it's Gaara fighting Pain.

Edit: After realizing that Gaara would likely be stomped due to the Preta Path, I'll change it to the Fourth Hokage instead.
 
Last edited:
TauanVictor said:
Pain absorbs all of Gaara's sand. Stomp.
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Pain can only absorb Chakra. Gaara Sand isn't made of Chakra. Its actual Solid Object..Gaara uses his Chakra to Make Ground turn into Sand. Pain would actually have more time dealing with Gaara Sand than any Ninjutsu Chakra attack. Those Sand will not disappear even if the chakra was absorbed.
 
So this is taking into account the rest of the Village yeah? If that's the case I think similar to Obito's attack, Hiruzen and the rest of the village can easily hold back most of the other paths besides the Deva Path so it won't be much different honestly.

Considering Minato's different tags outside the village and around like the one he used fighting Obito, he should be able to bring Deva path away especially since he's unable to phase through kunais. A counter to Shinra Tensei could be Minato just figuring out the interval for its use being 5 seconds, and throws kunais during that time, one is likely to hit and that'll let him teleport him away. Minato could also just teleport to a kunai thrown near him like he did with Ay and slash his neck off, this could be done with the other paths as well before he ever focuses on the Deva path but can still see him going for the Deva path since it'll probably be showing the most destruction and also being accompanied by the Asura path protecting him.

Konoha FRA
 
Arkenis said:
So this is taking into account the rest of the Village yeah? If that's the case I think similar to Obito's attack, Hiruzen and the rest of the village can easily hold back most of the other paths besides the Deva Path so it won't be much different honestly.
Click to expand...
No, the rest of the village is not taken into account. It's just Minato, meaning Minato has to fight against all six Pains by himself.
 
CiscoTheSoto said:
No, the rest of the village is not taken into account. It's just Minato, meaning Minato has to fight against all six Pains by himself.
Click to expand...
Well that changes it again i guess. Minato can still just throw kunais, teleport them and or cut their heads off.
 
Oh, it was Alive Minato i think Minato could win with his summon and Flying Raijin+ Rasengan combo.

judging from how a genius he is, he can easily figure out how the pain work and because pain with all 6 active also gonna have a lot of disadvantage if referring to ap and durability
 
How? What's Pain gonna do about FTG? or The Reaper Death Seal?

Not to mention Minato would take one look at the pains and figure them out, given his intelligence.
 
BEASTHEART880 said:
How? What's Pain gonna do about FTG? or The Reaper Death Seal?

Not to mention Minato would take one look at the pains and figure them out, given his intelligence.
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The Question would be. How would Minato dodge Shinra Tensei..
Minato doesn't have any Durability feat.

Speed is EQUAL.. Reason Minato was good -> due to his combat speed reaction + ftg jutsu. He wasnt even good using at Senjutsu..
 
Crayons said:
Minato doesn't have any Durability feat.
Click to expand...
Doesn't need one...
7amafGo.png

He'e physically capable of tanking his own output, and Pain scales there so it's irrelevant .

Crayons said:
The Question would be. How would Minato dodge Shinra Tensei..
Click to expand...
Throws a kunai and teleports.
 
Arkenis said:
Doesn't need one...
7amafGo.png

He'e physically capable of tanking his own output, and Pain scales there so it's irrelevant .


Throws a kunai and teleports.
Click to expand...

So where did you get this Large Mountain level? We have not seen anything about Minato being hit by a Large Mountain. Orochimaru durability? Are u seriously going to use Orochimaru body and compare it to Minato? If u cut Minato, does he open his mouth and give birth to another Minato? Again Minato was good due to his unrivaled speed, no shinobi was able to tag Minato.

If Minato was Large Mountain level. then he could just FLICK Biju Dama from Start where it was said to be "MOUNTAIN LEVEL".
 
Crayons said:
He cannot Spam FTG, Also he cant see it coming. Since its shockwave. Show us Minato dodging a shockwave, cuz there 0 feat. Not even Naruto or Jiraiya could do it.
Click to expand...
He can spam ftg lol, and they can see shinra tensei ripping apart the ground.
 
Arkenis said:
He can spam ftg lol, and they can see shinra tensei ripping apart the ground.
Click to expand...

He cannot Spam FTG. Otherwise He would have spam them against Obito (First Fight). When he used it once, he should have used it again, Since he already mark Obito before, he shouldve have used it and finish him off. Even Edo Minato stated himself he doesnt have enough chakra to use FTG again, despite being in Kyuubi Chakra Mode.
 
Crayons said:
He cannot Spam FTG. Otherwise He would have spam them against Obito (First Fight). When he used it once, he should have used it again, Since he already mark Obito before, he shouldve have used it and finish him off. Even Edo Minato stated himself he doesnt have enough chakra to use FTG again, despite being in Kyuubi Chakra Mode.
Click to expand...
He used FTG like 10 times in the Obito fight. Excluding the fact that he teleported 100% Kurama who's bigger than actual mountains + a bijuu bomb bigger than the heads on the hokage monument; he would have far more chakra to use here.

Either way, Minato figured out kamui entirely based on their first fight, and Itachi didn't even though he had extensive time with Obito, who knew how to deal with Nagato's abilities when they fought. Minato would figure out Pain's abilities and end them all with a kunai. None of his paths have a solid counter to FTG or his amazing sensing abilities. Not to mention he has Mount Myoboku contracts to handle his light work.
 
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