Flowey Vs Naofumi & Raphtalia

[AccelerAx]

2-C Omega Flowey is used

Naofumi & Raphtalia are 2-C

Speed is unequalized

Omega Flowey:

Naofumi & Raphtalia:

Inconclusive:

 

[AccelerAx]

Bump

 

[ApiesDeathbyLazors]

I'm not sure why you're limiting Nao and Raph to Low 2-C when both have 2-C ratings. Even then it might be an AP stomp in Flowy's favor. I forget how high into 2-C he is.

 

[YungManzi]

Yeah, putting them at Low 2-C against a 2-C makes no sense.

 

[AccelerAx]

I changed them to 2-C (also the reason I put them at Low 2-C is because in their profiles it states that they are possibly 2-C)

 

[ApiesDeathbyLazors]

That's great. So what's the AP difference?

 

[Planck69]

Flowey currently scales to hundreds of timelines so AP stomp.

That said, he's being downgraded as we speak to Low 2-C at most so this will be a stomp the other way around.

 

[Jinsye]

just make Nao and Raph Low 2-C then lol

 

[Planck69]

This is on the premise that Low 2-C is even accepted. He might move down to 9-A unless the CRT's direction changed.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Even about abilities, I don't see from the duo a counter for nor the SAVE and LOAD, nor against the absorption, which are Flowey's major wincons in his threads, so stomp in his favor.

 

[AccelerAx]

Even about abilities, I don't see from the duo a counter for nor the SAVE and LOAD, nor against the absorption, which are Flowey's major wincons in his threads, so stomp in his favor.

Question is the SAVE and LOAD Time Manipulation? Also Naofumi resists Soul Manipulation and Absorption and both of them have Acausality.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Question is the SAVE and LOAD Time Manipulation?

Yup, and is a system of "Time hax + power nulli agaisnt Time Hax + bypass against said power nulli" since:

1. Users with more DT can completely null other users with less DT from LOADing
2. They can't be nulled either from less DT users from using their LOAD

Also, DT, as stated in this thread, is a physical substance, aka you need a really similar power to DT to counter it, and not just a random Time Hax.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Also Naofumi resists Soul Manipulation and Absorption and both of them have Acausality.

Lmao at this editing too

LOAD works on Frisk who has acausality too, plus, I don't see resistance to absorption on their profile, but just to soul attacks, which isn't an issue for Flowey.

 

[AccelerAx]

LOAD works on Frisk who has acausality too, plus, I don't see resistance to absorption on their profile, but just to soul attacks, which isn't an issue for Flowey.

Resistance against Decay, Darkness, Fire, Plants, Insects, Demons, Soul Attacks, Mind Attacks, Alcohol, Aquatic Monsters, Poison, Energy Absorption, Impact, Beheading, Electricity, Conceptual Attacks, Time Manipulation, Causality Manipulation, and Law Manipulation.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Energy Absorption =/= Body + Soul absorption.

Read better next time.

 

[Daddybrawl]

SAVE and LOAD are more akin to Time Travel, in a sense. They jump the timeline back and forth, from SAVE point to SAVE point. Resistance to Time Manip doesn’t quite help there- it’d be like saying someone with Resistance had a free Acausality, lol.

Anyways, as for nullifying it, Determination is listed as ‘the Will to live’. Essentially, in order to negate its effects, you’d have to literally nullify Floweys Will to keep going, his Will to fight back and keep on living, which is hard for people without Empathic Manip.

 

[AccelerAx]

SAVE and LOAD are more akin to Time Travel, in a sense. They jump the timeline back and forth, from SAVE point to SAVE point. Resistance to Time Manip doesn’t quite help there- it’d be like saying someone with Resistance had a free Acausality, lol.

Anyways, as for nullifying it, Determination is listed as ‘the Will to live’. Essentially, in order to negate its effects, you’d have to literally nullify Floweys Will to keep going, his Will to fight back and keep on living, which is hard for people without Empathic Manip.

Could Law Manipulation help here?

• Infinity Zero: A defense and sealing spell. It makes it impossible for the opponent to destroy the world in battle and created barriers around the universe that prevent the opponent from escaping, even with teleportation. Furthermore, the spell prevents the use of godly powers within the world and forces everyone to obey the world's laws. In case of the world Naofumi was summoned into this means that the opponent is bound to stats. For example, the speed of a bullet within that world is dependent on the statistics of the one firing the gun and can be both faster or slower through that. It is also important that the HP dropping to 0 means death, meaning that immortality gets negated.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Could Law Manipulation help here?

• Infinity Zero: A defense and sealing spell. It makes it impossible for the opponent to destroy the world in battle and created barriers around the universe that prevent the opponent from escaping, even with teleportation. Furthermore, the spell prevents the use of godly powers within the world and forces everyone to obey the world's laws. In case of the world Naofumi was summoned into this means that the opponent is bound to stats. For example, the speed of a bullet within that world is dependent on the statistics of the one firing the gun and can be both faster or slower through that. It is also important that the HP dropping to 0 means death, meaning that immortality gets negated.

STATs aren't new to UT verse, and Flowey can still absorb, and I heavily doubt that the LOAD is counted as a "godly" power, as it should be things as Concept hax as I read in the verse profiles.

 

[AccelerAx]

STATs aren't new to UT verse, and Flowey can still absorb, and I heavily doubt that the LOAD is counted as a "godly" power, as it should be things as Concept hax as I read in the verse profiles.

Time Manipulation is also considered a godly power in the verse.

 

[YungManzi]

Godly powers just means powers that aren't natural to the setting, or can't follow the rules of the setting, can't be used.

Technically, Durability Negation in general would essentially get nulled by Infinity Zero's law manipulation (Although status effects, like Mind Manipulation, would still work), but I'll have to bring that up for the revisions.

Spoiler

="The reason why is because it converts all attacks into stats with fixed damage. Soul attacks would do damage, but they wouldn't be instant-kill techniques, or even more effective than regular physical attacks... because that's how soul attacks work in the Shield Hero verse. Unless you're up against someone with a weakness to soul attacks, they're pretty much useless. Even if we don't consider that stuff, the heroes would technically scale to being able to resist soul absorption with potency in the hundreds of billions via the spirits of their weapons not being absorbed by the spirit turtle."]

Ah yes.

I just realize speed is unequal, so what prevents a blitz?

 

[Planck69]

Oh yeah, Naofumi blitzes.

 

[StrymULTRA]

LMFAO true for the last part

 

[Antvasima]

I was asked to close this thread, due to it being a stomp.