First battle thread on the wiki.battle between two 1A

[Noneless21]

And since she's at the top of the chain that's 20+ layers of Resistance to Resistance negation too

How does she has layers of resistance anyway?

 

[FallenMaou2234]

How does she has layers of resistance anyway?

Via Authorities, basically a lower authority absolutely cannot bypass the resistances provided by an authority stronger than theirs. So like the Authority of a low level Divine spirit would get resisted by the authority of a Mid-level divine spirit but against another divine spirit with a similar level of authority or higher the authority can affect them. And currently the scaling chain for levels of Authority has 20+ people in it with Shiki being at the very top of that scaling chain as the strongest entity in the Verse.

 

[Noneless21]

Via Authorities, basically a lower authority absolutely cannot bypass the resistances provided by an authority stronger than theirs. So like the Authority of a low level Divine spirit would get resisted by the authority of a Mid-level divine spirit but against another divine spirit with a similar level of authority or higher the authority can affect them. And currently the scaling chain for levels of Authority has 20+ people in it with Shiki being at the very top of that scaling chain as the strongest entity in the Verse.

Isn't authorities caps like at 1-C?

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

Via Authorities, basically a lower authority absolutely cannot bypass the resistances provided by an authority stronger than theirs. So like the Authority of a low level Divine spirit would get resisted by the authority of a Mid-level divine spirit but against another divine spirit with a similar level of authority or higher the authority can affect them. And currently the scaling chain for levels of Authority has 20+ people in it with Shiki being at the very top of that scaling chain as the strongest entity in the Verse.

Hm, so a lower / weaker divine spirit cannot do anything to a stronger divine spirit, am i right?

 

[FallenMaou2234]

Hm, so a lower / weaker divine spirit cannot do anything to a stronger divine spirit, am i right?

Yeah they can't use their Authorities to harm a Divine Spirit/God with a higher level of Authority than them

Isn't authorities caps like at 1-C?

Normally but Shiki possesses all the abilities and Resistances in the Verse on a 1-A level since each and every ability and Reistance came from the Root as it's the source of like everything in the verse

 

[Noneless21]

Yeah they can't use their Authorities to harm a Divine Spirit/God with a higher level of Authority than them

Normally but Shiki possesses all the abilities and Resistances in the Verse on a 1-A level since each and every ability and Reistance came from the Root as it's the source of like everything in the verse

Then why the scaling chain got caught up with the 1-A too?

 

[FallenMaou2234]

Then why the scaling chain got caught up with the 1-A too?

Because the authorities and levels of Authority in and of themselves come from the Root

 

[Noneless21]

Because the authorities and levels of Authority in and of themselves come from the Root

That just means their origin cames from the same source, it doesn't specify why it has a scaling chain from its products

 

[TrueKingOfHeroes]

Authority scaling can't be used in 1-A level, 'cause only Shiki is being 1-A in the verse.

 

[FallenMaou2234]

That just means their origin cames from the same source, it doesn't specify why it has a scaling chain from its products

You're missing the point, Think of those abilities and powers as lesser versions of the ones she possesses when she uses them they get elevated in Tier so when a Divine Spirit or God uses them it's 1-C when she uses them they're 1-A

 

[Noneless21]

You're missing the point, Think of those abilities and powers as lesser versions of the ones she possesses when she uses them they get elevated in Tier so when a Divine Spirit or God uses them it's 1-C when she uses them they're 1-A

Authority scaling can't be used in 1-A level, 'cause only Shiki is being 1-A in the verse.

^this is my point, you don't bring scaling chain from lower dimensionality tiering just because they came from the same source of power

 

[FallenMaou2234]

Authority scaling can't be used in 1-A level, 'cause only Shiki is being 1-A in the verse.

Doesn't make sense with the way Void shiki works on this wiki. All her abilities and resistances are 1-A when she uses them so naturally the scaling chain still applies if it didn't then it directly contradicts all the other Shiki matches here on the wiki since that's how we operate

We treat them as lesser versions of her own power if we were to say that the Reistance scaling chain doesn't apply since it comes from Lower Dimensional people in the Verse then neither would all the Abilities and powers she gets via power Mimicry since they also come from lower Dimensional entities in the Verse which kinda isn't how Shiki works

 

[John985]

Isn't authorities caps like at 1-C?

“The magecraft from the Age of the Gods allows people to directly access the authority of Divine Spirits. And since Divine Spirits are close to the Root, mages won’t have to search for the Root anymore.” My mentor explained. - Case File Volume 10 Chapter 2.

 

[FallenMaou2234]

Totally forgot this scan exists lol

 

[TrueKingOfHeroes]

Doesn't make sense with the way Void shiki works on this wiki. All her abilities and resistances are 1-A when she uses them so naturally the scaling chain still applies if it didn't then it directly contradicts all the other Shiki matches here on the wiki since that's how we operate

We treat them as lesser versions of her own power if we were to say that the Reistance scaling chain doesn't apply since it comes from Lower Dimensional people in the Verse then neither would all the Abilities and powers she gets via power Mimicry since they also come from lower Dimensional entities in the Verse which kinda isn't how Shiki works

I'm a bit iffy with 1-A resistances to be honest, but I still think it's fine for now. However, for 1-A scaling chain resistances is no, we can't arbitrarily equalize the resistance gap in each layers is the same at all tier levels. The resistance layer gap at 1-C can only be reached by people who are at 1-C. 1-A scaling can't be done because there's only 1 character in the verse, we can't scale resistance gap in different tier, or create resistance layers with just a multiplier

 

[FallenMaou2234]

I'm a bit iffy with 1-A resistances to be honest, but I still think it's fine for now. However, for 1-A scaling chain resistances is no, we can't arbitrarily equalize the resistance gap in each layers is the same at all tier levels. The resistance layer gap at 1-C can only be reached by people who are at 1-C. 1-A scaling can't be done because there's only 1 character in the verse, we can't scale resistance gap in different tier, or create resistance layers with just a multiplier

Normally, but once again it's literally stated that that's where they come from like not just infering or deducing it's actually stated that the resitances the powers all of it simply comes from the Root and by extension is a lesser version of that which the root possesses so in this Particular instance it's justified because we have a proper reason to assume so. No need for Multipliers or whatever. Plus there is also the El Melloi scan which also provides further precedent.

 

[Noneless21]

That scan didn't bring me why do the 1-A authority has scaling chain to each other

I get the resistance, but not the scaling chain, it just means the authority came from the Root, but it didn't specify as to why it has a scaling chain

 

[FallenMaou2234]

That scan didn't bring me why do the 1-A authority has scaling chain to each other

The Gods are close to the Root but not on its level Void Shiki is the Root so

1-A Authorities<<<Shiki which basically would place her at the top of the scaling chain

I get the resistance, but not the scaling chain, it just means the authority came from the Root, but it didn't specify as to why it has a scaling chain

And like I said earlier this in and of itself is contradictory because the Resistances she has comes from scaling her to the people who's abilities and resistances she gets from her Power Mimicry so if we want to say the scaling chain doesn't apply because "It's 1-C" then her resistances and powers are also "1-C" because that's where we get them from 1-C Charachters. Again those authorities and powers are simply lesser versions of the ones Shiki possesses as the Root add on to that the El Melloi scan and there's really no need to discuss it.

 

[Noneless21]

And like I said earlier this in and of itself is contradictory because the Resistances she has comes from scaling her to the people who's abilities and resistances she gets from her Power Mimicry so if we want to say the scaling chain doesn't apply because "It's 1-C" then her resistances and powers are also "1-C" because that's where we get them from 1-C Charachters. Again those authorities and powers are simply lesser versions of the ones Shiki possesses as the Root add on to that the El Melloi scan and there's really no need to discuss it.

so you saying she didn't even get it from the Roots? I don't understand, unless you sayin she has like 1-A power mimicry that allows her to mimic authority in which that still didn't explain why she gets that scaling chain

 

[TrueKingOfHeroes]

Normally, but once again it's literally stated that that's where they come from like not just infering or deducing it's actually stated that the resitances the powers all of it simply comes from the Root and by extension is a lesser version of that which the root possesses so in this Particular instance it's justified because we have a proper reason to assume so. No need for Multipliers or whatever. Plus there is also the El Melloi scan which also provides further precedent.

Yeah layer of resistance is can't be copied, you just need to be on top of scaling to get it, Shiki is indeed at the top but resistance layer starts from 1-C, so it doesn't affect 1-A resistance. 1-A resistance scaling can exist if Shiki is able to bypass through 1-A character's resistance, which is none in the verse.

I mean the multiplier is because we arbitrarily made Shiki's resistance to 1-A just because she is a 1-A being which even though the resistance is copied from a smaller scale that is 1-C, also same as resistance layer.

For Authority which can access root, it is new scaling which this wiki has not accepted yet, we have to discuss about the new authority scaling first in the crt.

 

[Ubdon]

so you saying she didn't even get it from the Roots? I don't understand, unless you sayin she has like 1-A power mimicry that allows her to mimic authority in which that still didn't explain why she gets that scaling chain

If i not wrong it's sounds like
Authority of god: 1-c
Authority: Has chain
Authority from root via power mimicry: 1-a
Authority: Still kinda has chain

 

[Noneless21]

If i not wrong it's sounds like
Authority of god: 1-c
Authority: Has chain
Authority from root via power mimicry: 1-a
Authority: Still kinda has chain

if she didn't even get the authority directly from the Roots but from the power mimicry then that scaling chain is even more vague since if she use those power mimicry to overpower her enemy that has authority that she mimic (for example) then for absolutely sure she will get the better version of it because it's 1-A power, there's no further mention that it has layering in it

 

[FallenMaou2234]

Yeah layer of resistance is can't be copied, you just need to be on top of scaling to get it, Shiki is indeed at the top but resistance layer starts from 1-C, so it doesn't affect 1-A resistance. 1-A resistance scaling can exist if Shiki is able to bypass through 1-A character's resistance, which is none in the verse.

I mean the multiplier is because we arbitrarily made Shiki's resistance to 1-A just because she is a 1-A being which even though the resistance is copied from a smaller scale that is 1-C, also same as resistance layer.

For Authority which can access root, it is new scaling which this wiki has not accepted yet, we have to discuss about the new authority scaling first in the crt.

Again she possesses all their Resistances and powers on a 1-A level Jaguar mans Authority on a 1-A Level vs Zeus's Authority on a 1-A level it's as simple as that if she has the resistances it makes Zero sense for the chain to not exist for the same reasoning

so you saying she didn't even get it from the Roots? I don't understand, unless you sayin she has like 1-A power mimicry that allows her to mimic authority in which that still didn't explain why she gets that scaling chain

Again everything in the verse is simply a lesser version of the powers she possesses we simply class it as power Mimicry on the wiki so it isn't so much as shes Copying the abilities and resistances but simply using a more powerful version

 

[Noneless21]

Again she possesses all their Resistances and powers on a 1-A level Jaguar mans Authority on a 1-A Level vs Zeus's Authority on a 1-A level it's as simple as that if she has the resistances it makes Zero sense for the chain to not exist for the same reasoning

Again everything in the verse is simply a lesser version of the powers she possesses we simply class it as power Mimicry on the wiki so it isn't so much as shes Copying the abilities and resistances but simply using a more powerful version

that still didn't make that scaling chain logical at all, sure she gets resistance and from the Roots but it doesn't mean there's a scaling chain to anything unless there's someone who has 1-A resistance in the verse and Shiki somehow able to overcame it

 

[Ubdon]

if she didn't even get the authority directly from the Roots but from the power mimicry then that scaling chain is even more vague since if she use those power mimicry to overpower her enemy that has authority that she mimic (for example) then for absolutely sure she will get the better version of it because it's 1-A power, there's no further mention that it has layering in it

By that i mean that Root has origin of that chain thay now kinda 1-a so layers became 1-a in potence and Shiki copy that so that layers goes to her

 

[Ubdon]

By that i mean that Root has origin of that chain that now kinda 1-a so layers became 1-a in potence and Shiki copy that so that layers goes to her

 

[Noneless21]

By that i mean that Root has origin of that chain thay now kinda 1-a so layers became 1-a in potence and Shiki copy that so that layers goes to her

that's the thing, the layers is how we tell on who has more potency in hax contest, there's no mention of Shiki has layered hax/resistance because not only she is the only 1-A being in her own verse, there's also no one who has 1-A resistance so you sayin she can mimic layers to 1-A level is not viable and you need more proof than all authority came from the Roots

 

[Ubdon]

that's the thing, the layers is how we tell on who has more potency in hax contest, there's no mention of Shiki has layered hax/resistance because not only she is the only 1-A being in her own verse, there's also no one who has 1-A resistance so you sayin she can mimic layers to 1-A level is not viable and you need more proof than all authority came from the Roots

Everything kinda comes from it and ends here that's also why it has those powers but i'm neutral of root having chain inside itself

 

[FallenMaou2234]

that's the thing, the layers is how we tell on who has more potency in hax contest, there's no mention of Shiki has layered hax/resistance because not only she is the only 1-A being in her own verse, there's also no one who has 1-A resistance so you sayin she can mimic layers to 1-A level is not viable and you need more proof than all authority came from the Roots

All Resistances and powers become 1-A so if we were to take the Powers of the Gods and make them 1-A what would you get?? You'd get a 1-A scaling chain Zeus's authority(Cheif God level) would still be superior to Jaguar Man(Lesser Diety) At 1-A and to add context once again the El Melloi scan exists as well. But whatever i guess seems like were not going to come to a consensus here

 

[Noneless21]

fine, I'll drop this matter since it's a whole can of worms and let yall discuss about that

besides, Shiro can plot manip someone who's immune to plot manip anyway so layers of resistance is not viable, only her NEP and TD saves Shiki from getting yeeted

 

[Ubdon]

fine, I'll drop this matter since it's a whole can of worms and let yall discuss about that

besides, Shiro can plot manip someone who's immune to plot manip anyway so layers of resistance is not viable, only her NEP and TD saves Shiki from getting yeeted

Sounds like Yogiri

 

[Noneless21]

Sounds like Yogiri

basically but better character developing but we ain't go that way

 

[FallenMaou2234]

fine, I'll drop this matter since it's a whole can of worms and let yall discuss about that

besides, Shiro can plot manip someone who's immune to plot manip anyway so layers of resistance is not viable, only her NEP and TD saves Shiki from getting yeeted

Which should get resistanced since Shiki's layers are 1-A but it's not like it matters anyways cause TD go Brrr in this case

 

[TrueKingOfHeroes]

Again she possesses all their Resistances and powers on a 1-A level Jaguar mans Authority on a 1-A Level vs Zeus's Authority on a 1-A level it's as simple as that if she has the resistances it makes Zero sense for the chain to not exist for the same reasoning

You misunderstood how resistance scaling chains work. There is no Jaguar man's 1-A Authority, there is no Zeus' 1-A Authority. The scaling chain still exist but not at 1-A level. there's no reason to put it at 1-A because scaling can't happen in 1-A that doesn't show superiority over other 1-A. Shiki only showed superiority over 1-C.

Scaling is a term what we make up, it doesn't necessarily mean that the term is attached to a verse. Although the Root is the source of everything but authority scaling is what we create, not blatantly explained in the narrative, so the idea of 1-A scaling from the start doesn't make any sense, except for the things I mentioned earlier.

 

[TrueKingOfHeroes]

Yes, i totally agree that NEP and Transduality can hardly resist plot manipulation

 

[PainKiller07]

f i not wrong it's sounds like
Authority of god: 1-c
Authority: Has chain
Authority from root via power mimicry: 1-a
Authority: Still kinda has chain

It's blatantly faulty to assume sth like this. Let's remember what happened with Arceus.

You can't just magically give 1A hax and resistance to 1A HDE granting 1C powers.

 

[Ubdon]

Yes, i totally agree that NEP and Transduality can hardly resist plot manipulation

Why hardly? They just give immunity to it

 

[Ubdon]

It's blatantly faulty to assume sth like this. Let's remember what happened with Arceus.

You can't just magically give 1A hax and resistance to 1A HDE granting 1C powers.

That not just because 1-a root but also because verse mechanic but sure you can think that this is main reason


Also why you guys always compare Arceus to it i know they simmilar but oof

 

[Noneless21]

That not just because 1-a root but also because verse mechanic but sure you can think that this is main reason


Also why you guys always compare Arceus to it i know they simmilar but oof

The staffs are revamping characters that gain every abilities in the verse whether or not they do gain every abilities in their own verse or not

 

[Ubdon]

The staffs are revamping characters that gain every abilities in the verse whether or not they do gain every abilities in their own verse or not

Okay, I guess

By the way, are there any FAA vs. Vernal plans here?