Final Fantasy IX massive upgrades

[Zer00Negativo]

Basically the characters are far below their levels, to begning in game there is a great crystal called original crystal that is the source of all existence and from where the universe originated, according to Kuja he had power to destroy that crystal and so destroying Terra(Earth in latin and portuguese), Gaia, the universe and all things, when Kuja is defeated he uses his Ultima magic that ends up damaging the crystal and thus opening an entrance to the "final dimension" from where Necron descends from the heavens to return all existence to the nothing (famous "Void" of the series).

So, I think most characters should be updated low 2-C?

 

[The_Everlasting]

The thing is destroying the Crystal doesn't require universal power. Or at least we don't know it does.

It's basically equivalent to Kuja destroying a lynchpin that then systematically destroys everything else.

 

[Zer00Negativo]

why would not it be if in the final fantasy multiverse the crystals are what give you powers to face universal beings and even multiversal level? And in FFIX the crystal is what created the universe, just like FFIII And what you said does not make much sense because minutes later Necron appears with also power to destroy the existence, and to complete the crystal also owns a universe inside because when Zidane enters it he first thinks that it was own nothing but Garland says that that was the sidereal space (which in the context is a universe because it has stars and nebulae in the background inside the crystal.

 

[The_Everlasting]

What do the other games, much less III, have to do with this?

The Crystal itself has no durability feats. We cannot say that destroying it would take Universal power.

 

[Dark649]

I agree with Ever.

 

[KinkiestSins]

I tried this, and I would like this to be true. Dark and Ever said no. The idea is that think of crystals in FF9 as a sort of peg that keeps the universe in check.

The only thing that you can argue that is universal by feats is Necron, who stated very vaguely he was going to bring everything into the 'zero' world.

Pretty sure Dark can bring up the thread I tried to in, This was discussed before.

I am waiting for Ultimania to be translated so I can get more context regarding Necron's feat. Personally neutral on the necron thing, more or less against the crystal Low 2-C thing. And trust me, I am one of the people on this wiki who wants 9 to be this high.

 

[Zer00Negativo]

Share the same multiverse, the same principles, the same elements, certainly has nothing to do with obviousness.

You are literally saying that the universe does not have universal level durability, since there is a universe within itself including a time because in it you could see the moment of collision between Terra and Gaia, besides the fact that the crystal being cited as the root of everything that exists, that is, before the universe existed it existed within the crystal.

you must find that crystal is just what was behind the kuja when in fact it is only a part of its totality called the "crystal of memory" and not the crystal of the origin itself, and kuja was using this part of the crystal to create monsters, for even the region known as Memoria that controls the flow of souls of the universe exists within the crystal

And you're ignoring the Necron that would also destroy existence with its own power.

 

[KinkiestSins]

1. Basically true. 2. No, I am saying destroying a crystal that can likely end the universe is not applicable for AP, because you can argue it is just a peg keeping the universe together. 4. Not ignoring, probably legit. Even on OBD, they list him at possibly universe level

But the translation is what matters here. We can get someone to translate it and see what it says. Ending all of existence is kind of vague.

I am neutral on that point tbh. I cant find a japanese play through of the game for translation, so at the very best, it gets 'possibly 3-A'

 

[Zer00Negativo]

do you generally consider someone's word as an uncontested truth? You can not just deny all the facts just because someone "thinks" it does not have many proofs that show otherwise. The crystals are not only a "support" they literally created the universe according to III https://imgur.com/a/ijQuu if it were only a support then basically all the light warriors of III and V would have resistance level well below their villains, which would enter in contradiction since these types of void villains usually have the power to destroy the universe or more.

ask him to show me a scan with all the words, I repeat with ALL the words saying that the crystals only support the universe, if he do that I close the thread at the same time, otherwise it's just supposition above supposition.

 

[The_Everlasting]

Stop bringing the other games into this. They're irrelevant.

 

[KinkiestSins]

I will make a thread regarding that, because we somewhat have a double standard when it come to rating final fantasies. We use a dissidia statement for High 6-A 15 ffs. But it is either all okay, or none of it.

 

[The_Everlasting]

The Dissidia statement is a broad statement for every Ifrit in the franchise.

 

[KinkiestSins]

The Dissidia statement is a broad statement for every Ifrit in the franchise.

Sorry Ever, but it is not just Ifrit.

We also can say the same thing for how Exdeath is rated as well, using other game as sources for other ratings. One example, I might write off Two is a pattern to me.

Honestly, for Ifrit it is less troublesome.

Exdeath is more of an issue I think.

As for the Necron thing, I am still looking for a japanese version of 9 so I can get that translates. And honestly, just because it is a broad statement it gets a pass? Please explain that to me.

 

[The_Everlasting]

Why is Exdeath relevant to literally any of this?

 

[KinkiestSins]

Why is Exdeath relevant to literally any of this?

Because. It uses. Different sources. From different games. To prove he is 2-A. It isnt that hard. Again, either all of this or none of this.

In my opinion, we should probably seperate the canon, And Ifrit gets somewhat of a pass. But this is a thing we do apparently Use sources for different things on our wiki regarding final fantasy.

 

[The_Everlasting]

There is a ''world'' of difference between a game stating the size of the multiverse and "The Crystal functions this way in this game so clearly it functions like that in every game".

 

[Dark649]

I checked the original jap translated script and did not found anything that would upgrade the FF9 cast to Low 2-C.

 

[KinkiestSins]

I checked the original jap translated script and did not found anything that would upgrade the FF9 cast to Low 2-C.

Welp, that answers that question. Out of laziness, probably gonna nope.

 

[Zer00Negativo]

Stop bringing the other games into this. They're irrelevant.

why would I do this if FF is a multiverse that shares much of the same ideas? mainly FFIII, V and IX where in the 3 games there are crystals that created the universe and in the 3 games the villains want to destroy the crystals to destroy the universe or to release the void, however the only FF where this fact is not considered is in IX.

And I think it would be no exaggeration to consider them at this level because here in wikia consider characters who fought against Gilgamesh as possible 3-C, in FFIX Gilgamesh neither fight because he is afraid of Zidane, and Gilgamesh in Mobius FF quotes have visited all "15 worlds without counting side stories" which is a reference to the games themselves, so yes Gilgamesh IX is the same of all games.

 

[Dark649]

That Gilgamesh is probably not the same as the one from the other FF, or if it was [which i'm not sure] that one is nowhere as comparable to the others. So, they do not scale to 3-C nor Low 2-C.

 

[Dark649]

In the original version Zidane does not ask about the crystal, but rather the world of crystal. Necron states that they were sent to an another dimension, and was waiting for Zidane to ask him if it was searching for a motive to exist, Necron by analyzing Kuja actions came to think that the life of everyone is to become extinct and states that it wants to reconstruct the world of void where there is no life, evolution and there is not the world of crystal [we don't how it can do it nor how much time it needs in order to do so]. Lastly the Ultimania states that Necron is nothing more that the soul/origin of the Lifa Tree, which is connected to life, death and souls. After Necron is defeated, the Tree will lose control.

 

[Zer00Negativo]

you have not refuted me at all with this comment actually, I have already shown the scan where he cites who visited the 15 title of the series, and he still refers to them as SeeD and Balamb Garden (FFVIII), SOLDIERS (FFVII), Colosseum of time (FFXIII-2), chaos and harmony (Dissidia) among others.

 

[Zer00Negativo]

In the original version Zidane does not ask about the crystal, but rather the world of crystal. Necron states that they were sent to an another dimension, and was waiting for Zidane to ask him if it was searching for a motive to exist, Necron by analyzing Kuja actions came to think that the life of everyone is to become extinct and states that it wants to reconstruct the world of void where there is no life, evolution and there is not the world of crystal [we don't how it can do it nor how much time it needs in order to do so]. Lastly the Ultimania states that Necron is nothing more that the soul/origin of the Lifa Tree, which is connected to life, death and souls.

an argument that can not be proved is an argument that must be ignored

 

[Dark649]

It does not matter if he visited other world, only the ones that fought him scales to him. Gilgamesh is 9 is not 5-A nor 3-C

 

[Dark649]

An argument that can not be proved is an argument that must be ignored

The english translation of FF9 is inaccurate and cannot be used, there is anything that will upgrade anyone.

 

[Zer00Negativo]

first you had said that the Gilgamesh were different people with the same name, now you have gone back and saying that they are the same people, you are contradicting yourself, is this desperation? I do not know if you read what I said before but I'll repeat, Gilgamesh did not fight with Zidane just because he was FEAR.

 

[The_Everlasting]

Gilgamesh isn't even in every game in the main series. He's not in II, III, VII, X, XI or XV.

 

[Zer00Negativo]

just because we did not see him in those games does not mean he was not there, he may have visited before, during or after the games.

 

[Zer00Negativo]

The english translation of FF9 is inaccurate and cannot be used, there is anything that will upgrade anyone.

English translation is official wanting or not and I checked in 3 different languages and everyone says basically the same thing, but well show me this original version I want to take a look at it too