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Elden Ring General Discussion

Torn between waiting for my PS5 to download it and going in completely blind (Outside of watching the trailers) or watching Jerma stream it right now
 
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Tragically I won't get to play it for very long since my family is going out for dinner in like a half an hour and my grandma who's visiting which is very rare will be there and I don't wanna be rude lmao.
 
Aight I'm back now I can actually play the DLC. I got into it for like 5 mins then had to leave I was so heated bro.

Also they were not kidding about the difficulty spike. No spoilers but yeah my max level characters gets folded like a pancake by normal enemies.
 
Aight so I'm like several hours in I think around the halfway point or so, maybe even close to beating the main story quest. Thoughts so far (keeping things vague so that there's not many spoilers but still some);

Very good DLC. For those of you who like a challenge yeah trust me it's harder than anything in the main game. The first little side boss I encountered did more damage than most of Malenia's attacks, for example. Some of the main bosses quite literally (and I mean literally) one-shot me even when I'm wearing the best armor in the base game with damage reduction Talismans on. I'm on Messmer rn which is where I chose to stop because holy SHIT he is hard. He makes Malenia look like a joke. He darts around the field in a manner akin to Morgott but way more deadly and with way more range. The fight is extremely cinematic but my god I wish he would slow down just a itsy bitsy amount. It seems like he might leave and show up again later to me though.

Besides him, many bosses in the DLC don't know the word "Stop". They just attack, attack, attack, and keep going instead of how the base game bosses usually are with one combo then a small interval to do damage. I've only taken down 2 Remembrance bosses so far, working on Messmer, and I've met the dragon one whatever his name was but he was straight-up one-shotting me so I dropped it and kept going.

I don't know yet for sure but sadly it sounds like Miquella will be a cliche betrayal guy from the vibes I'm getting. Everything around him sounds super manipulative. Even some of his followers openly admit to having a spell put on them, and some of the followers are outright not even fans of the guy but still decide to follow after him. Also he's apparently using Mohg's vessel for his consort (that being us?) maybe I misunderstood it but I think Miquella is planning on making us into his lord at all costs. Pretty funny that Mohg used Miquella for his own ends just for Miquella to turn around and do the same to him. Irony.

Yeah, the map is HUGE and it's absolutely jam-packed full of content. I will be skipping some stuff on my first playthrough for sure but dude it's literally just a sequel to me.

So far I'd rate the DLC a solid 9/10. Might be 10/10 by the end. I really wanna play more tbh but I gotta stop for my own sake lmao.
 
Miyazaki let me down. To put this in fast food terms, I was expecting blud to cook a beef wellington but got a decent filet mignon, but I'll take it over McDonald's.

I'm close to the end of the "DLC". There's still a ton I haven't explored (like half of it lmao) but I wanted to get through the main story already so I started to just press through that and...my, god. What the actual f*ck is this final boss. So basically Miquella used Mohg's remains to resurrect Radahn in his prime, it literally looks like a mod btw, so that RADAHN could be his consort. Not us, RADAHN. THAT'S who he meant in the trailer. What I'm wondering is if Miquella is using his ability to force Radahn into this or if Radahn actually wants this cause a lot of people are going to lose respect for Radahn if he's consciously doing this. What's worse for me though is that he has no dialogue. Like my guy Miyazaki we finally meet Radahn without him being absolutely insane from Scarlet Rot poisoning and he doesn't even have a single word to say? And Miquella is very different from what I was expecting as well. Oh and as for Miquella's apparent age, it's kinda hard to say. He definitely does NOT look like a little kid but he does look pretty young still, a bit more than I expected, but I'd say the notion he looks like a child outright is out the window. Again, Demi-God standards.

Looking into this more and searching around it seems that Radahn was indeed willingly going to become his consort. Basically, to summarize what's happening with him; a long while ago Miquella, Malenia, and Radahn formed a vow that led to Malenia and Radahn fighting in Aeonia, Malenia defeating Radahn, and then Radahn coming back via Miquella to become his consort, so that Miquella could ascend to godhood and make the world a better place. Whether or not Radahn has any actual romantic attachment to Miquella or if he just wants Miquella to ascend is unclear, but I'm going to guess the latter for my own sake because I'm sorry this shit is WEIRD to me.

In any case, if I'm being honest, while the rest of the entire DLC is amazing, I'm severely disappointed with where Miyazaki went in regards to the story. It feels like needless twists for the sake of needless twists. Like, first off, WHY Radahn? Why tarnish (pun intended) such a beloved character and bring him in when the story did not need him, why give him no dialogue, why take out everything that made him cool, etc.. Radahn in Elden Ring was the coolest boss for most people and managed to be amazing without a single line, Radahn in the DLC feels like a generic fantasy warrior NPC dude (and a puppet of Miquella despite being fully consenting of the circumstance) with no personality and nothing making him unique or interesting. He is Radahn in name, appearance, and moves, but in spirit, I cannot look at this guy as being Starscourge Radahn.

The entire build-up of how Miquella has such a powerful ability to allure people was completely dropped because he never actually manipulates people. The very followers that we meet during the journey are fully self-aware and conscious and even when the spell is removed from them, they still gladly obey Miquella because they full-heartedly believe he is just, so then what was the point?

Miquella was never actually our ally to begin with nor did he really want anything to do with us and apparently our entire journey in the Land of Shadow is just to kill him anyways like the rest of the Demi-God's (minus Ranni). He had absolutely no interest in us or seemingly even awareness in our existence. We were literally just some random Tarnished that followed his crumb trail to kill him.

Like so much that had been built-up for this DLC story wise that had us all absolutely enthralled was completely thrown under the rug and substituted with an insane unpredictable (not in a good way) lackluster and mostly unsatisfying story that only serves to diminish one of the most beloved characters in the game and kill any interest I had in Miquella, and the NPC's barely do a damned thing besides getting summoned to help in fights.

Messmer had so much build-up throughout the promotional material just to literally be a short one-off boss fight with little to no relevance or impact in the game. He just had one cool fight with two cutscenes and said "Peace.". I didn't even realize I was about to fight him because it was out of nowhere, same with the final boss.

Besides that, I have to say that while I love how big the DLC is, the pacing is wonky, it's so hard to maneuver throughout the map that I often found myself genuinely lost and with no idea where to go or HOW to explore. Etc. etc..

I finally got my hands on the martial arts fighting style just to learn that it's trash and unusable.

I'm sorry to say it but I genuinely am disappointed by the DLC. I enjoyed it a ton my first half and was expecting a blast later on but I kept going and towards the end it kind of got ruined. But I don't want to rate it unfairly because of one or two aspects not being up to par for me. I'd rate the DLC an 7-8/10, the base game still being a 10/10. And trust me it breaks my heart to say that, like I'm genuinely sad that it wasn't as good as I had hoped.

But I haven't actually gone through all of it yet so MAYBE that can still change. I hope so. But for now, I am genuinely disappointed. I expected much better.
 
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And another thing to add onto my other comment.

I got some things wrong and just had a huge revelation. So uh...Mohg did nothing wrong (not actually but yk what I mean). Miquella was 100% using Mohg the whole time SPECIFICALLY to make Mohg a vessel for Radahn, more than likely. Mohg was a victim of Miquella's allure, and according to the NPC that served under Mohg, it sounds like he was genuinely a good leader to his people. Which also adds up with Varre speaking of Mohg as a loving lord that accepts all who are unwelcome elsewhere. Not saying Mohg is innocent or anything blud is still a weirdo and pretty bad but I genuinely think we had a slightly warped impression of the guy.

We also speak to St. Trina who apparently Miquella abandoned if I understand right? Anyways according to St. Trina, Miquella is genuinely a good guy but he would be dooming himself by becoming a god which is basically what happens, and that we MUST kill Miquella but understand that he too is a victim of sorts.

It's all basically a f*cked up situation. Miquella wants to help people, he really does, but his methods are flawed.

I still don't like where Miyazaki went with the story personally but that helps a bit.

Edit: I found a YouTube comment explaining it very well.

"I have this explained, but this is a long one: There's actually no hint to this, it seems everyone knew, and agreed, including Radahn and Malenia. Reason why Miquella sent his sister to kill Radahn was because he was under the influence of a great rune and forgot his promise to Miquella, Malenia was along with it because in a helm description it said, "Miquella awaits thee, O' Promised Consort", and if you remember the cinematics where they fought, she says something but we couldn't hear, it was already hinted at before the base game even came out. But because she used scarlet bloom to defeat him it didn't kill him so Miquella had to manipulate Mogh to get his body somewhere else to where he could access the realm of shadows. Which was revealed in the DLC by Moghs follower. Then we kill Mogh and Radahn, two of the requirements to get into the DLC, therefore allowing Radahn to finally die and Miquella uses Moghs body but bc he is the Lord of Blood, Radahn is able to have his form come to fruition due to the malleable body, which we saw when his body came from blood, but since it's still his body you can see Omen horns on Radahns Gauntlet. And another thing Miquella needed a consort that wasn't an emperyan to ascend to Godhood and from a remembrance we know Miquella had a crush on Radahn and if it was going to be anyone it was going to be him, and Radahn promised. This would also bring the Carian family back with the Golden Order aligning their families to peace."
 
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RinneItachi said:
Miyazaki let me down. To put this in fast food terms, I was expecting blud to cook a beef wellington but got a decent filet mignon, but I'll take it over McDonald's.

I'm close to the end of the "DLC". There's still a ton I haven't explored (like half of it lmao) but I wanted to get through the main story already so I started to just press through that and...my, god. What the actual f*ck is this final boss. So basically Miquella used Mohg's remains to resurrect Radahn in his prime, it literally looks like a mod btw, so that RADAHN could be his consort. Not us, RADAHN. THAT'S who he meant in the trailer. What I'm wondering is if Miquella is using his ability to force Radahn into this or if Radahn actually wants this cause a lot of people are going to lose respect for Radahn if he's consciously doing this. What's worse for me though is that he has no dialogue. Like my guy Miyazaki we finally meet Radahn without him being absolutely insane from Scarlet Rot poisoning and he doesn't even have a single word to say? And Miquella is very different from what I was expecting as well. Oh and as for Miquella's apparent age, it's kinda hard to say. He definitely does NOT look like a little kid but he does look pretty young still, a bit more than I expected, but I'd say the notion he looks like a child outright is out the window. Again, Demi-God standards.

Looking into this more and searching around it seems that Radahn was indeed willingly going to become his consort. Basically, to summarize what's happening with him; a long while ago Miquella, Malenia, and Radahn formed a vow that led to Malenia and Radahn fighting in Aeonia, Malenia defeating Radahn, and then Radahn coming back via Miquella to become his consort, so that Miquella could ascend to godhood and make the world a better place. Whether or not Radahn has any actual romantic attachment to Miquella or if he just wants Miquella to ascend is unclear, but I'm going to guess the latter for my own sake because I'm sorry this shit is WEIRD to me.

In any case, if I'm being honest, while the rest of the entire DLC is amazing, I'm severely disappointed with where Miyazaki went in regards to the story. It feels like needless twists for the sake of needless twists. Like, first off, WHY Radahn? Why tarnish (pun intended) such a beloved character and bring him in when the story did not need him, why give him no dialogue, why take out everything that made him cool, etc.. Radahn in Elden Ring was the coolest boss for most people and managed to be amazing without a single line, Radahn in the DLC feels like a generic fantasy warrior NPC dude (and a puppet of Miquella despite being fully consenting of the circumstance) with no personality and nothing making him unique or interesting. He is Radahn in name, appearance, and moves, but in spirit, I cannot look at this guy as being Starscourge Radahn.

The entire build-up of how Miquella has such a powerful ability to allure people was completely dropped because he never actually manipulates people. The very followers that we meet during the journey are fully self-aware and conscious and even when the spell is removed from them, they still gladly obey Miquella because they full-heartedly believe he is just, so then what was the point?

Miquella was never actually our ally to begin with nor did he really want anything to do with us and apparently our entire journey in the Land of Shadow is just to kill him anyways like the rest of the Demi-God's (minus Ranni). He had absolutely no interest in us or seemingly even awareness in our existence. We were literally just some random Tarnished that followed his crumb trail to kill him.

Like so much that had been built-up for this DLC story wise that had us all absolutely enthralled was completely thrown under the rug and substituted with an insane unpredictable (not in a good way) lackluster and mostly unsatisfying story that only serves to diminish one of the most beloved characters in the game and kill any interest I had in Miquella, and the NPC's barely do a damned thing besides getting summoned to help in fights.

Messmer had so much build-up throughout the promotional material just to literally be a short one-off boss fight with little to no relevance or impact in the game. He just had one cool fight with two cutscenes and said "Peace.". I didn't even realize I was about to fight him because it was out of nowhere, same with the final boss.

Besides that, I have to say that while I love how big the DLC is, the pacing is wonky, it's so hard to maneuver throughout the map that I often found myself genuinely lost and with no idea where to go or HOW to explore. Etc. etc..

I finally got my hands on the martial arts fighting style just to learn that it's trash and unusable.

I'm sorry to say it but I genuinely am disappointed by the DLC. I enjoyed it a ton my first half and was expecting a blast later on but I kept going and towards the end it kind of got ruined. But I don't want to rate it unfairly because of one or two aspects not being up to par for me. I'd rate the DLC an 7-8/10, the base game still being a 10/10. And trust me it breaks my heart to say that, like I'm genuinely sad that it wasn't as good as I had hoped.

But I haven't actually gone through all of it yet so MAYBE that can still change. I hope so. But for now, I am genuinely disappointed. I expected much better.
Click to expand...
RinneItachi said:
And another thing to add onto my other comment.

I got some things wrong and just had a huge revelation. So uh...Mohg did nothing wrong (not actually but yk what I mean). Miquella was 100% using Mohg the whole time SPECIFICALLY to make Mohg a vessel for Radahn, more than likely. Mohg was a victim of Miquella's allure, and according to the NPC that served under Mohg, it sounds like he was genuinely a good leader to his people. Which also adds up with Varre speaking of Mohg as a loving lord that accepts all who are unwelcome elsewhere. Not saying Mohg is innocent or anything blud is still a weirdo and pretty bad but I genuinely think we had a slightly warped impression of the guy.

We also speak to St. Trina who apparently Miquella abandoned if I understand right? Anyways according to St. Trina, Miquella is genuinely a good guy but he would be dooming himself by becoming a god which is basically what happens, and that we MUST kill Miquella but understand that he too is a victim of sorts.

It's all basically a f*cked up situation. Miquella wants to help people, he really does, but his methods are flawed.

I still don't like where Miyazaki went with the story personally but that helps a bit.

Edit: I found a YouTube comment explaining it very well.

"I have this explained, but this is a long one: There's actually no hint to this, it seems everyone knew, and agreed, including Radahn and Malenia. Reason why Miquella sent his sister to kill Radahn was because he was under the influence of a great rune and forgot his promise to Miquella, Malenia was along with it because in a helm description it said, "Miquella awaits thee, O' Promised Consort", and if you remember the cinematics where they fought, she says something but we couldn't hear, it was already hinted at before the base game even came out. But because she used scarlet bloom to defeat him it didn't kill him so Miquella had to manipulate Mogh to get his body somewhere else to where he could access the realm of shadows. Which was revealed in the DLC by Moghs follower. Then we kill Mogh and Radahn, two of the requirements to get into the DLC, therefore allowing Radahn to finally die and Miquella uses Moghs body but bc he is the Lord of Blood, Radahn is able to have his form come to fruition due to the malleable body, which we saw when his body came from blood, but since it's still his body you can see Omen horns on Radahns Gauntlet. And another thing Miquella needed a consort that wasn't an emperyan to ascend to Godhood and from a remembrance we know Miquella had a crush on Radahn and if it was going to be anyone it was going to be him, and Radahn promised. This would also bring the Carian family back with the Golden Order aligning their families to peace."
Click to expand...
Oh thank goodness, a real reasonable critic yet a realisation comments about the DLC story and final bosses decision, so far I seen so many peoples being such of dumbass having an uproar over it like it was the end of a world lel

I expecting a lots of apologist letters to Mohg after learning the truth about him and Miquella lmao, from a ****** up lord to an actual based lord
 
So, as Rinnel said, Miquella is basically the main antagonist of the DLC. When they were younger, he fell in love with Radahn and wanted to make hims his consort. Radahn accepted but some time after he relented for unknown reasons. So Miquella devised a plan: he ordered Malenia to go to Caelid and kill Radahn so he could resurrect him. As we know, unfortunately for Malenia, Radahn was so strong and skilled the battle ended in a draw and Malenia released the Scarlet Rot. It's not clear if she did it out of desperation or because she thought it would kill him but the game heavily implies unleashing the Rot was Miquella's plan. In the meantime, he brainwashed Mohg into abducting him, possibly without telling Malenia, and entered the Realm of Shadows. The reason why we have to kill Mohg and Radahn to enter the DLC is because Miquella wanted Radahn and Mohg dead so he could use Mohg's body as a vessel for Radahn to resurrect him, essentially using Mohg's corpse as a golem. It's not clear if Radahn is brainwashed but since he doesn't say anything and originally refused to become his consort yet fights with him, it's hinted Miquella somehow tempered with the process to mold him into his consort. Also, one of the reasons that Radahn locked the stars in place was all so Ranni couldn't become a pawn in the Golden Order's designs so he seems to have had an alliance with Ranni.
So yeah, Miquella is an anti-villain. Shady, manipulative and ruthless. However, his desire to help the LB and bring about a better age, the Age of Compassion is sincere. Freyja for example was healed from the Rot by Miquella without second thoughts and he really intended for the Haligtree to replace the Erdtree and bring about a better age for everyone. But he's still shady as **** and a bit of a disppointment for me. At least he's not some mustache twirling villain I guess.
Also, Mohg kidnapped him because he was compelled and was apparently pretty good with his underlings, or at least some of them, but it's made clear he was also a ****** and mass murderer and his devotion to the Formless Mother and ambition to rule all lands was really his objective.
 
Messmer is actually not a villain but a victim. The reason why he seems so vile is because Marika ordered him to be like that. He was basically his general when she arrived in the Lands of Shadows and ordered him to be as violent, murderous and horrifying as possible so the people from the land would focus their hatred and rage on him instead of her. His armor was designed to invoke this, with the sinister dragon motif and all. Messmer himself has come to hate this duty (which is why you can find so many statues of Marika without their head). In fact, when you enter his room, he seems more curious than anything and doesn't hate you but only attacks you because it's his duty and he's bound by it. When he dies, the only thing he says is to curse Marika for everything she's done. The incantation you get from him also stated he hated his fire powers and wanted to get rid of them (indicating he was born with them) but couldn't.

But wait there's more (and worse). You know the red serpent we see with Messmer? Well, Messmer doesn't control the serpent, it's inside of him. We know nothing of it except three things: 1) it's called the Abyssal Serpent, 2) it's very powerful to the point the second phase is the Serpent controlling Messmer's body and not only using all his moves but also giving him new, more devastating attacks and 3) Marika was scared shitless of it. That eye with the same mark as Melina and Ranni Messmer has? It's not an eye, it's a Golden Order seal. Marika forcibly plucked his eye out and sealed the Serpent inside his body. It's also one of the reasons why she basically banished him to the Land of Shadows, both to use him as a scapegoat for her atrocities there and to keep the Serpent away.

A bit of interesting lore. The promo said the Land of Shadows was the place Marika first entered the LB and Messmer was his general leading her amies under her name when she started her conquest. Combined with the fact that we don't know about his parents (his red hair and native fire powers might indicate he descends from some Fire Giant, though it's never made clear and his fire powers look very different and are specific to him in appearence but it could be his native divinity tempering with the Giant lineage). Regardless, Messmer seems to have been the first of Marika's children.
 
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There's a sidequest with a character named Ymir, a Glintstone Sorcerer. At the end of the quest, you have to fight a boss named Metyr, Mother of Fingers. If the name tips you off, it's normal. The remembrance reveals she's the origin of the various Fingers entities throughout the game and was birthed by the Greater Will and sent as a shooting star in the LB along with the Elden Beast. Btw, Ymir wants to become the new Mother of Fingers himself and you fight him after her.

St Trina is the Marika to Miquella's Radagon, essentially being his alternate identity and ego. For some reason, Miquella separated her from him in his quest for godhood. You find her after defeating the Putrescent Knight and she outright begs you to kill Miquella, saying godhood would be a prison for him.

The skeletal old man impaled in the trailer is called Midra. He's impaled by a weapon named Greatsword of Damnation, a sword designed to create barbs that impales its victims from within to ensure eternal suffering. He goes down like a chump in like three strikes in his boss fight. That is, for his first phase. Then he rips his own head off and he gets a new boss title: Midra, Lord of the Frenzied Flame. His head is exactly like the head of the Tarnished's in the FF ending, replaced with an orb of Frenzy fire. You can get this as an incantation and it says he actually failed at becoming a proper Lord.

Two things I've red so I'm not sure if that's confirmed but: The Greater Will is apparently the direct creator of the Lands Between and stopped interfering after sending the Beast and Metyr. Also, spells and items found in the DLC implies Messmer and Melina are direct siblings.
 
I'm gonna say it because it needs to be said: Marika is like one of the most ruthless, vicious pragmatists I've ever seen and one hell of a shitty parent. Seriously, literally EVERYTHING in this lore can be tracked down to her
 
I don’t understand people complaining about the difficulty of the DLC honestly. And I think some people overrated how hard it was.

I mean, sure, each experience is different and some people may defeat some bosses easier than others, but ****, you’re stuck at Rellana for hours? Be for real how tf did you beat Mohg? Stuck at the Lion? Nah. At this point it’s not that the DLC is hard, you just suck at the game.

Any optimized build + summons makes the game stupidly easy and even easier in the DLC with the new upgrades.

I doubt these people even know how to make a decent build.
 
M3X_2.0 said:
I don’t understand people complaining about the difficulty of the DLC honestly. And I think some people overrated how hard it was.

I mean, sure, each experience is different and some people may defeat some bosses easier than others, but ****, you’re stuck at Rellana for hours? Be for real how tf did you beat Mohg? Stuck at the Lion? Nah. At this point it’s not that the DLC is hard, you just suck at the game.

Any optimized build + summons makes the game stupidly easy and even easier in the DLC with the new upgrades.

I doubt these people even know how to make a decent build.
Click to expand...
I personally beat the Lion without any summon but I had to summon both Leda and my Mimic Tear for Rellana. Tried Messmer, got absurdly obliterated, tried Romina, she just pisses me off, tried the Putrescent Knight, got wrecked, though in all honesty my summon isn't at the top. Overall, the DLC isn't that hard in general (I don't have any particular problem with random or normal enemies except the Furnaces) but the bosses are really mixed (the hippo was easy af). I guess it depends on people.
 
And now time for some dibs to put (for now, since I've noted done everything in the DLC)

  • Messmer (blog is already made but I have to add some stuff)
  • Rellana
  • Leda
  • Ansbach

Optional: Miquella of the Trap, The Sus Brainwasher
 
And I never told anyone to play this exact way, they can play whatever they want, but bitch about the difficulty when the game gets waaay easier when you actually use what it gives you but you still refuse to use is bullshit.

Complaining about the DLC when you don’t actually engage with the DLC itself, using base-game items, not upgrading with the new system, using a +7 weapon against idk, Messmer, you obviously suck.
 
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