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I mean before Vegeta showed up. I recall Goku hiding behind a jellybean looking thing only to get slashed along with it by Janemba's sword
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Dragon Ball Super: Super Hero | 2-C Goten, Trunks, Gotenks, and Majin Buu
- Thread starter Sir_Marvulous
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They all follow the same principles, so there's hardly a reason to just discard it
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I think if we accepted that, we can open the floodgates to all series on the wiki being able to do the same. Using examples from other canons of a series to help with their CRT about the main canon (Just one random example; using Archie for Game scaling CRT purposes). Which I think is a no-no. But maybe that's just me. Just find it kinda irking.
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Also yeah the wiki doesn't do cross continuity scaling without fair reason
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My fair reason is that it reinforces something visible in the main canon
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- #86
Doesn't reinforce much of anything considering its just Veku getting completely toyed with for 30 minutes without Janemba even at least using the Dimension Sword, something he used on Goku
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Nobody should be using things from the Z Movies. Full stop. I don't know why this is even being brought up when we don't even tolerate the DBS manga and DBS anime having cross-continuity scaling. Along with that, I'm getting this impression some people don't know that Android 18 is 2-C. So any statement or scaling with her is...well, it's with a 2-C character.
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That's my thing. I don't believe Goten and Trunks scale to 18
Also there's no scaling between them at all. Just a recognition of patterns across Dragon Ball media
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Veku getting toyed with for 30 minutes is not the same as Fat Gotenks being unharmed by hits from serious 2-C characters
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You don't believe. Which is the entire reason people refuse to accept this revision. Because the entire idea that Goten and Trunks are 2-C is too difficult to accept. If you look at the logic objectively, it all holds up. I don't blame you for struggling to accept it because it is stupid but that's the nature of DBS powerscaling.
As for the latter half, nope. We can't do that at all. 'Patterns' across DB media has never been accepted as logical basis for a revision. If we could use that, the entire verse would look very very different on the wiki.
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Also if it was Gamma 1's strength then why even use Gotenks as a projectile at all? Cell Max was off guard so Gamma 1 very well could've shot at his weak point if he's strong enough to damage it, as you've been saying
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No it's legit just unsupported. You'd be better off trying to make Krillin 2-C and have Goten and Trunks scale above him. This is giving very holier-than-thou vibes
Also a lot of power scaling is subjective so don't even try that "objectively" stuff
I'm not even gonna lie. That's ridiculous
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Because it's a gag that's why, the whole moment is a gag and Gotenks was being ping-ponged around the whole time
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- #94
Considering it resulted in the damaging of Cell Max's weak point, it was very clearly not just a mere gag
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Did you forget that people in Dragon Ball gaining the upper hand or even winning through some form of a gag is far from new?
Even as recently as the Tournament of Power, Krillin eliminates that one blind Universe 4 dude by throwing his stinky shoe at him
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The movies are stated and accepted to other MWI timelines since theyre stated to be “parallel worlds” which is also what timelines in the manga are called
though it is different here since Janemba was toying with Veku whereas cell max wasn’t
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Even that was Krillin using a clever tactic against an enemy who had a keen sense of smell they used to fight. Also, that did n it eliminate him. Go next
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- #98
That's for the cosmology
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He was toying with SSJ3 Goku too so my point stands
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...Okay?
That's still a gag moment, clever or not. Gotenks being launched by Gamma 1 into Cell Max was a clever move as well, doesn't mean it's not a gag
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- #101
Being toyed with and then getting finished off by a dura neg sword is not the same as getting toyed with for 30 minutes without the same sword. There's no scaling there
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- #102
If the 'clever move' is using Gotenks as a projectile...as opposed to just using one's own strength which you suggest is enough
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Between the fusion happening, the shock of the fusion failing, and the added shock of fat Gotenks being unable to go Super Saiyan, literally everyone had stopped moving. Everyone started attacking again when Gotenks got launched by Cell Max
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- #104
And in that would be an opportunity for one of the Gammas to just shoot at Cell Max's weak point since he was off guard. But they don't, as using Gotenks was the viable option there, as suggested by Piccolo
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It isn't unsupported. You can see the fight, you can see how the characters fair and you can see how every single one of them is 2-C barring Krillin, who is depicted as out of his element. The logic you are using to argue against it is from a non-canon Z movie and you are now trying to argue we should dismiss it because you think it's just a gag (Where did we hear that from before? Oh right, Freeza vs Broly.)
I unironically, genuinely, think you just can't accept the scaling because of how stupid it is.
Well, I can't think of a single instance where we used patterns in the DB franchise in a revision and it was accepted. Do you have any examples?
And we still don't get revisions passed on the premise of cross-world feats, scaling, patterns, etc. I've seen multiple threads be rejected because that logic isn't accepted.
Either way, I'm tuning out for a day. Clover is already debating multiple people as it is and I want to see what other arguments can be made.
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Same, I'm getting tired of this
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I'll be the judge of that
What's there to see? Them getting bodied by Cell Max? The "proof" involves:
- 18 supposedly about to be killed by Cell Max (cannot be proven)
- Confidence scaling (bad metric)
Supposedly they do better than 18 but again, that's not supported. Just because Cell Max didn't make the exact same motion toward Goten and Trunks that he did to 18, doesn't mean they did better
I find it dumb that you can't do this but if that's the case, fine, be my guest
That's actually not what I'm arguing at all. It being a gag was my response to Sir Marvelous's question of "Why didn't Gamma 1 just attack Cell Max himself?" The answer is that the whole gag is them knocking Gotenks around.
The fact remains that Gamma 1 knocking Gotenks hard enough to crack Cell Max's weak point is a feat for Gamma 1, not for Gotenks
Think what you want, but that's not exactly a way to just dismiss any counterarguments.
This isn't even mentioning how Gotenks has zero AP feats that would put him at a comparable level to his durability (especially given he just taunts Cell Max for most of the fight afterwards)
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Gotenks as i said doesn't scale and him doing anything to Cell max was simply a Gag feat outlier
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Wait a minute, they’re being scaled to GoD tier and two Macrocosm combined GoD tier 2-C?
I’m all for arguing 2-C him and her by scaling to BoG Base Goku, but to the GoDs?
I’m all for arguing 2-C him and her by scaling to BoG Base Goku, but to the GoDs?
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Yeah I agree with this
Base Goten and trunks scaling above 18 is fine
and Buu being 2-C for Piccolo thinking the gammas would be tough to beat without Goku and Vegeta even though he’d still have 18 and Gohan
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Bump
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I think maybe it's like on Namek, where the person who had their Potential Unleashed continued to grow and grow until a set level.
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Seems like this hasn't been concluded yet.
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