Downgrading Ayanokouji's Intelligence

[CrimsonStarFallen]

Memory definitely helps with learning, but memory would be part of intelligence anyway.

 

[wwereymy235]

Memory definitely helps with learning, but memory would be part of intelligence anyway.

It does but memory alone wouldn’t suffice. You’d need LR for it and to apply it. Like how you can memorize what a definition for a word is but you don’t know how to apply it.

 

[Phoenks]

I don't know why his perfect memory wouldn't be an aspect of his intelligence? The ability to recall and keep knowledge perfectly is an inherent part of someone's intelligence; given how fast he's learning things, I'd definitely not dismiss it like that. That said, I don't know about him himself being an Extraordinary Genius, I'd argue he would be a low end one at best, but he's definitely a genius, you can't gloss over him learning 5 written languages at 5 because "his memory is a superpower" it's a superpower that directly aids his intelligence.

"Learning things fast" is absolutely and completely irrelevant in regards to your intelligence when you are literally born with the power to photographically absorb every piece of information ever given to you. It's a superpower that exponentially lessens the impact of many of these feats.

If you have perfect memory, you don't have to try or focus to recall things. You hear or see something once? That thing now sticks with you forever. You could glance over a dictionary a SINGLE time, and from that, come to permanently understand the meaning of every English word.

In a similar manner, learning languages is far, far easier. To the point that it hardly counts as some absurd feat of intellect, even for a four year old. Most of learning a language is repetition in order to master all the meanings, grammar, and vocalization of words and sentence structure. For Kouji, having perfect memory, such repetition is unnecessary. He could go over language principles and meaning a single time and he'd be able to learn the language.

NOT because he is smarter or more intelligent than normal people, no, but because he was just born with an unfair, supernatural advantage. It makes everything significantly easier.

That isn't to dismiss the knowledge gained by memory, which is still impressive and definitely a big factor of overall intelligence,, but the issue is Kouji's "knowledge" feats aren't really anything special. Having "immeasurable knowledge" and "knowledge of various fields" is extremely vague and could honestly be said for a lot of people.

 

[Dinozxd]

This isn't a mistake in the profile's wording, though. He's just indexed as a tier he shouldn't be index as, so this revision is to change that.

I mean, you said this;

Not to mention, what matters is what is on the profile, not what is in another thread.

There's a possibility that the thread which upgraded him to EG could be legit, but it was worded badly on the profile which might've resulted in a misunderstanding of the tier.


Though I don't see anything that makes him an EG on the thread. I just refered to a possibility.

 

[wwereymy235]

"Learning things fast" is absolutely and completely irrelevant in regards to your intelligence when you are literally born with the power to photographically absorb every piece of information ever given to you. It's a superpower that exponentially lessens the impact of many of these feats.

If you have perfect memory, you don't have to try or focus to recall things. You hear or see something once? That thing now sticks with you forever. You could glance over a dictionary a SINGLE time, and from that, come to permanently understand the meaning of every English word.

In a similar manner, learning languages is far, far easier. To the point that it hardly counts as some absurd feat of intellect, even for a four year old. Most of learning a language is repetition in order to master all the meanings, grammar, and vocalization of words and sentence structure. For Kouji, having perfect memory, such repetition is unnecessary. He could go over language principles and meaning a single time and he'd be able to learn the language.

NOT because he is smarter or more intelligent than normal people, no, but because he was just born with an unfair, supernatural advantage. It makes everything significantly easier.

That isn't to dismiss the knowledge gained by memory, which is still impressive and definitely a big factor of overall intelligence,, but the issue is Kouji's "knowledge" feats aren't really anything special. Having "immeasurable knowledge" and "knowledge of various fields" is extremely vague and could honestly be said for a lot of people.

The thing is Ayanokoji doesn’t automatically learn something. He goes through a process. He starts out a bit slow compared to other students in the whiteroom. But then with a little more experience in the field he explodes into much higher heights.




Ayanokojis perfect memory doesn’t work like that. His memory works like a drawer. In that drawer there’s are cabinets for each and every memory he has. When the drawers are closed, he isn’t constantly thinking about all the information he has. Though whenever he needs that information, he has 100% flexibility and access to find that information instantly. Opening the cabinet that has the information he needs.

 

[Nierre]

I think Genius is fine FRA

 

[Worthless]

The beginning alone shows you that the OP doesn't know the verse he is digging. It's honestly painful to read. Man has achieved feats that most geniuses on this site haven't been able to do at the same age, such as extraordinary problem solving, critical thinking, manipulation, prediction, strategic thinking, and the ability to instantly adapt, among many others that require more than just memorization. He even realized as a baby that crying wouldn't do shit

 

[HelloThere1089]

So you decided to waste a comment on whining instead of providing counter arguments? I saw nothing specific in your comment.

 

[Tatsumi504]

No insult nor slight on one's person intended but OP needs to touch some grass. You gotta know you've been powerscaling overtime for too long when you see some of his feats and downplay it as merely "gifted".

I am an intelligence connoisseur and I will not stand for this!

Sorry but I think otherwise and will outline why.

Ayanokouji does not exceed the real world's upper limits in anything but his perfect memory, which is an ability, rather than intelligence.

He actually does, having perfect memory doesn't disqualify everything he has shown. Perfect memory is still close to photographic memory and calling it a supernatural ability all the validates my jab about needing to touch grass, downplaying.
I had a friend from junior to senior secondary, up to university who can basically be said to have photographic memory. It very much exists to different extents in different individuals.

This means nothing by itself so can be discarded. "Genius" as a word can mean a lot of things and is often used incredibly loosely. The wiki's definition of "genius" is also much higher than what it is typically used for, encompassing individuals who are practically at the peak of human intellect in specific fields.

The white room's aim is to create a curriculum able to mass produce geniuses in the true sense of the word, geniuses who would surpass what is currently seen in outstanding individuals in different fields.

This is impressive for a child but just being able to do complex math equations is not even close to peak human level's of knowledge or intelligence. Anyone gifted in modern mathematics would be capable of this much. Especially someone who was literally trained from birth to be capable of such things.

Name multiple children between the ages of 2-6 actually capable of this. "Not close to peak human level" it is for a literal toddler. Whether he was trained to do so or not is irrelevant. Sit any child down and try to make them understand even basic highschool math and see how well that goes.

This isn't... impressive? At all? Like, this might be the least impressive thing here because that just means he is on the same level as an average 20-30 year old mentally.

Yes, for some reason, having the mental faculties of, displaying thinking, learning and reasoning capabilities of 20-30yr olds while only 10-13 yourself is not impressive at all.
It's one thing to want to downplay but making stuff like this seem like they're not even worth mentioning for one's agenda is plainly wrong.

This is due to his ability, which is perfect memory. This has nothing to do with intellect. It's a supernatural capability.

Having perfect memory doesn't invalidate his feats. Thinking and reasoning are not dependent on one's ability to recall. You could know every textbook back to back but without the ability to apply what's in them, you'd be unable to solve problems presented to you in a different way.

Being gifted in chess is a hyper-specific area of human endeavor and being smart in chess does not equivalate to intelligence in other areas. This is perhaps best represented by real-world Grandmaster Hikaru Nakamura having an average IQ (102) despite being the #2 ranked player in the world.

Yea it's a single field but it's not his only field. Oznce again, "gifted in chess"? Merely gifted? Outperforming a supercomputer that surpasses the likes seen in the real world is only "gifted"? Last I checked, outperforming supercomputers is actually one of the ways to get an EG rating.

What kinds of measurements do they even have access to and why are they relevant? Also, "trouble" doesn't really mean much. In the real world organizations have trouble measuring IQs over 160, but that doesn't really... mean anything in particular for that person's overall intelligence.

Stop pushi pushing the idea that this is some vague hype statement. The white room like I've said aims to surpass the level of genius in the true sense witnessed in the world. Their standards are compared to the best of the best in other words, despite being able to measure the level of real world geniuses, they are unable to do so with Ayanokouji

All of this is definitely impressive for a child but none of it is really anything more than gifted intellect, especially considering he is literally gifted with perfect memory. He's just exceptionally prodigious.

Once again, perfect memory doesn't help with problems one hasn't encountered. Just change a few variables, the thing one is solving for, reversing a question such that one needs to obtain initial values from the final or midway point and you have an entirely new difficult thing to solve (literally been there myself, no amount of cramming saved me when the sequences were flipped and before one tries to invalidate this point by bringing up one's intelligence level, the point is about perfect memory)

Being knowledgeable in various fields isn't anything special. This is really vague as well. Again, not a supporting feat for Extraordinary Genius.

Except his knowledge in various fields is already at the peak. Real life geniuses are only knowledgeable in specific fields, sometimes only one and may branch off to a few others but his basically encompasses all of science and arts

Another vague hype-statement that doesn't really mean anything in of itself.

It's not vague, as I said before the wr works off the standards for real life geniuses, aims to surpass them. Their main goal isn't even creating geniuses but a steady curriculum that can.

An explanation of Photographic Memory, which is an ability, not an aspect of his intellect.

Sorry but photographic memory isn't an ability, it's actually real to varying degrees

Impressive for a child, no doubt, but again, this is simply prodigious levels of intelligence, and is heavily, heavily aided by him having perfect memory. It's another gifted feat on its own.

Self proclaimed intelligence conniseur, no child is mastering many martial arts at the age of 4. Even real world masters spend their lifetime be peerless in only one (maybe a few).
Perfect Memory isn't aiding anyone in mastering martial arts. Sure you can know all the forms but now let's see you perform them and put it into practice. How does perfect memory help the physically challenged master martial arts? Other factors such as hand-eye coordination, good motor skills, reflexes etc are necessary to learn martial arts than one's ability to recall.

Further support for gifted combat intelligence. He is beating other gifted fighters and has a lot of knowledge in fighting, but none of this really transfers over to general intelligence ratings nor is any of this exceptionally impressive in the realm of martial arts. The average shounen protagonist has 10000x better feats than this lmao.

You see, there's the bullshit I'm talking about. Talks about real world standards, a story about school life then proceeds to compare it to shounen anime. Needless to say, it's an ass comparison COTE isn't a shounen with building level and above characters.
Also, Naruto vs Ayanokouji, both at peak human level, no powers, just hands and Naruto is getting whooped so bad his parents gon feel it from beyond the grave. You're shounen protagonists have a long history of L's, multiple losses to the same opponent, this schoolboy dominates forever after pulling ahead. You might as well have compared him to Re:zero skill go

Overall, I went through the entire intelligence section and ended up with practically nothing that supports him having intelligence that surpasses the real-world upper limits of humanity, nor him being comparable to supercomputers in processing, or even having exceptional knowledge in multiple fields of science. Not to mention, the stuff he does have is HEAVILY, HEAVILY aided by him having a supernatural ability, that being PERFECT memory. That in of itself takes away from a lot of these feats even more.

Honestly, I am inclined to say Ayanokouji is just high into Gifted, maybe Genius at the absolute most. But Extraordinary Genius intellect is in another dimension from him entirely.

Even looking to the examples of EG listed on the Genius page, you can immediately tell Koji has NO PLACE next to these people. Seriously, putting t a guy who has "learned various fields" and "mastered languages at 4" in the same category as Aizen, Batman, Bulma, and Iron Man? LOL. I mean, that's just blatantly ridiculous, isn't it? Doesn't take a genius to see the HUGE difference between Koji and the others in that Extraordinary Genius category.

Overall you went over it and found nothing that doesn't put him above real life geniuses so you decided to wank the downplay and compare him to mf's who are leagues away from even being comparable to real life as well as compare him against said mf's with literal superpowers.

Gtfo here with this bs and put some respect on the lads name. He's at least a genius even of he doesn't qualify for EG.

I apologize once again for the tone I'm adopting, the venom carried in my words but anyone seriously offended is welcome to make a report. I'm less here to defend Ayanokouji than I am to shit on a prime example of downplay. I've said my piece and that'll be all from me, argue amongst yourselves.

 

[DaReaperMan]

No insult nor slight on one's person intended but OP needs to touch some grass. You gotta know you've been powerscaling overtime for too long when you see some of his feats and downplay it as merely "gifted".

 

[Worthless]

So you decided to waste a comment on whining instead of providing counter arguments? I saw nothing specific in your comment.

Sorry but I had no intention of being that guy who provides scans as if they have all the time in the world, as I always do

 

[Zabazab]

He's called a genius, so genius rating should be fine.

 

[HelloThere1089]

No insult nor slight on one's person intended but OP needs to touch some grass. You gotta know you've been powerscaling overtime for too long when you see some of his feats and downplay it as merely "gifted".

Sorry but I think otherwise and will outline why.

He actually does, having perfect memory doesn't disqualify everything he has shown. Perfect memory is still close to photographic memory and calling it a supernatural ability all the validates my jab about needing to touch grass, downplaying.
I had a friend from junior to senior secondary, up to university who can basically be said to have photographic memory. It very much exists to different extents in different individuals.

The white room's aim is to create a curriculum able to mass produce geniuses in the true sense of the word, geniuses who would surpass what is currently seen in outstanding individuals in different fields.

Name multiple children between the ages of 2-6 actually capable of this. "Not close to peak human level" it is for a literal toddler. Whether he was trained to do so or not is irrelevant. Sit any child down and try to make them understand even basic highschool math and see how well that goes.

Yes, for some reason, having the mental faculties of, displaying thinking, learning and reasoning capabilities of 20-30yr olds while only 10-13 yourself is not impressive at all.
It's one thing to want to downplay but making stuff like this seem like they're not even worth mentioning for one's agenda is plainly wrong.

Having perfect memory doesn't invalidate his feats. Thinking and reasoning are not dependent on one's ability to recall. You could know every textbook back to back but without the ability to apply what's in them, you'd be unable to solve problems presented to you in a different way.

Yea it's a single field but it's not his only field. Oznce again, "gifted in chess"? Merely gifted? Outperforming a supercomputer that surpasses the likes seen in the real world is only "gifted"? Last I checked, outperforming supercomputers is actually one of the ways to get an EG rating.

Stop pushi pushing the idea that this is some vague hype statement. The white room like I've said aims to surpass the level of genius in the true sense witnessed in the world. Their standards are compared to the best of the best in other words, despite being able to measure the level of real world geniuses, they are unable to do so with Ayanokouji

Once again, perfect memory doesn't help with problems one hasn't encountered. Just change a few variables, the thing one is solving for, reversing a question such that one needs to obtain initial values from the final or midway point and you have an entirely new difficult thing to solve (literally been there myself, no amount of cramming saved me when the sequences were flipped and before one tries to invalidate this point by bringing up one's intelligence level, the point is about perfect memory)

Except his knowledge in various fields is already at the peak. Real life geniuses are only knowledgeable in specific fields, sometimes only one and may branch off to a few others but his basically encompasses all of science and arts

It's not vague, as I said before the wr works off the standards for real life geniuses, aims to surpass them. Their main goal isn't even creating geniuses but a steady curriculum that can.

Sorry but photographic memory isn't an ability, it's actually real to varying degrees

Self proclaimed intelligence conniseur, no child is mastering many martial arts at the age of 4. Even real world masters spend their lifetime be peerless in only one (maybe a few).
Perfect Memory isn't aiding anyone in mastering martial arts. Sure you can know all the forms but now let's see you perform them and put it into practice. How does perfect memory help the physically challenged master martial arts? Other factors such as hand-eye coordination, good motor skills, reflexes etc are necessary to learn martial arts than one's ability to recall.

You see, there's the bullshit I'm talking about. Talks about real world standards, a story about school life then proceeds to compare it to shounen anime. Needless to say, it's an ass comparison COTE isn't a shounen with building level and above characters.
Also, Naruto vs Ayanokouji, both at peak human level, no powers, just hands and Naruto is getting whooped so bad his parents gon feel it from beyond the grave. You're shounen protagonists have a long history of L's, multiple losses to the same opponent, this schoolboy dominates forever after pulling ahead. You might as well have compared him to Re:zero skill go

Overall you went over it and found nothing that doesn't put him above real life geniuses so you decided to wank the downplay and compare him to mf's who are leagues away from even being comparable to real life as well as compare him against said mf's with literal superpowers.

Gtfo here with this bs and put some respect on the lads name. He's at least a genius even of he doesn't qualify for EG.

I apologize once again for the tone I'm adopting, the venom carried in my words but anyone seriously offended is welcome to make a report. I'm less here to defend Ayanokouji than I am to shit on a prime example of downplay. I've said my piece and that'll be all from me, argue amongst yourselves.

Cool meltdown. Do you know the meaning of upper limit or peak human tho?

 

[AyeZ2]

No insult nor slight on one's person intended but OP needs to touch some grass. You gotta know you've been powerscaling overtime for too long when you see some of his feats and downplay it as merely "gifted".

Sorry but I think otherwise and will outline why.

He actually does, having perfect memory doesn't disqualify everything he has shown. Perfect memory is still close to photographic memory and calling it a supernatural ability all the validates my jab about needing to touch grass, downplaying.
I had a friend from junior to senior secondary, up to university who can basically be said to have photographic memory. It very much exists to different extents in different individuals.

The white room's aim is to create a curriculum able to mass produce geniuses in the true sense of the word, geniuses who would surpass what is currently seen in outstanding individuals in different fields.

Name multiple children between the ages of 2-6 actually capable of this. "Not close to peak human level" it is for a literal toddler. Whether he was trained to do so or not is irrelevant. Sit any child down and try to make them understand even basic highschool math and see how well that goes.

Yes, for some reason, having the mental faculties of, displaying thinking, learning and reasoning capabilities of 20-30yr olds while only 10-13 yourself is not impressive at all.
It's one thing to want to downplay but making stuff like this seem like they're not even worth mentioning for one's agenda is plainly wrong.

Having perfect memory doesn't invalidate his feats. Thinking and reasoning are not dependent on one's ability to recall. You could know every textbook back to back but without the ability to apply what's in them, you'd be unable to solve problems presented to you in a different way.

Yea it's a single field but it's not his only field. Oznce again, "gifted in chess"? Merely gifted? Outperforming a supercomputer that surpasses the likes seen in the real world is only "gifted"? Last I checked, outperforming supercomputers is actually one of the ways to get an EG rating.

Stop pushi pushing the idea that this is some vague hype statement. The white room like I've said aims to surpass the level of genius in the true sense witnessed in the world. Their standards are compared to the best of the best in other words, despite being able to measure the level of real world geniuses, they are unable to do so with Ayanokouji

Once again, perfect memory doesn't help with problems one hasn't encountered. Just change a few variables, the thing one is solving for, reversing a question such that one needs to obtain initial values from the final or midway point and you have an entirely new difficult thing to solve (literally been there myself, no amount of cramming saved me when the sequences were flipped and before one tries to invalidate this point by bringing up one's intelligence level, the point is about perfect memory)

Except his knowledge in various fields is already at the peak. Real life geniuses are only knowledgeable in specific fields, sometimes only one and may branch off to a few others but his basically encompasses all of science and arts

It's not vague, as I said before the wr works off the standards for real life geniuses, aims to surpass them. Their main goal isn't even creating geniuses but a steady curriculum that can.

Sorry but photographic memory isn't an ability, it's actually real to varying degrees

Self proclaimed intelligence conniseur, no child is mastering many martial arts at the age of 4. Even real world masters spend their lifetime be peerless in only one (maybe a few).
Perfect Memory isn't aiding anyone in mastering martial arts. Sure you can know all the forms but now let's see you perform them and put it into practice. How does perfect memory help the physically challenged master martial arts? Other factors such as hand-eye coordination, good motor skills, reflexes etc are necessary to learn martial arts than one's ability to recall.

You see, there's the bullshit I'm talking about. Talks about real world standards, a story about school life then proceeds to compare it to shounen anime. Needless to say, it's an ass comparison COTE isn't a shounen with building level and above characters.
Also, Naruto vs Ayanokouji, both at peak human level, no powers, just hands and Naruto is getting whooped so bad his parents gon feel it from beyond the grave. You're shounen protagonists have a long history of L's, multiple losses to the same opponent, this schoolboy dominates forever after pulling ahead. You might as well have compared him to Re:zero skill go

Overall you went over it and found nothing that doesn't put him above real life geniuses so you decided to wank the downplay and compare him to mf's who are leagues away from even being comparable to real life as well as compare him against said mf's with literal superpowers.

Gtfo here with this bs and put some respect on the lads name. He's at least a genius even of he doesn't qualify for EG.

I apologize once again for the tone I'm adopting, the venom carried in my words but anyone seriously offended is welcome to make a report. I'm less here to defend Ayanokouji than I am to shit on a prime example of downplay. I've said my piece and that'll be all from me, argue amongst yourselves.

Calm down a little bro. Although I agree with some of the things you are saying, it’s not really all that serious. He should definitely atleast be Genius though, that much is for sure imo.

 

[Tomfer]

No insult nor slight on one's person intended but OP needs to touch some grass. You gotta know you've been powerscaling overtime for too long when you see some of his feats and downplay it as merely "gifted".

Tutorial on how NOT to start a reply.

 

[CloverDragon03]

I don't know why his perfect memory wouldn't be an aspect of his intelligence? The ability to recall and keep knowledge perfectly is an inherent part of someone's intelligence; given how fast he's learning things, I'd definitely not dismiss it like that. Calling it a "supernatural power so it doesn't count" also doesn't really matter, to reach Extraordinary Genius intelligence you'd kind of need powers like that, since we define Extraordinary Genius as super intelligence.

That said, I don't know about him himself being an Extraordinary Genius, I'd argue he would be a low end one at best, but he's definitely a genius, you can't gloss over him learning 5 written languages at 5 because "his memory is a superpower" it's a superpower that directly aids his intelligence.

I was gonna bring up the written languages part, yeah, that's self-evidently Genius Intelligence

 

[Livinmeme]

No insult nor slight on one's person intended but OP needs to touch some grass. You gotta know you've been powerscaling overtime for too long when you see some of his feats and downplay it as merely "gifted".

Tutorial ON how to start a reply, go on my boy

 

[Worthless]

Gtfo here with this bs and put some respect on the lads name. He's at least a genius even of he doesn't qualify for EG.

This is beautiful. This is just beautiful.

But yah on serious note, it’s painful to see how the OP presents feats from ages 2 to 13 as uf it's some shit anyone can achieve and downplaying majority of them as just memorization. Not even most geniuses on this site have done the same at the same age

 

[Phoenks]

"Touch some grass" well, isn't this ironic.

I had a friend from junior to senior secondary, up to university who can basically be said to have photographic memory. It very much exists to different extents in different individuals.

Okay, so you're wrong right off the bat.

True photographic memory has never been observed to exist. The maximum humans are capable of is Eidetic Memory, which is a far cry from photographic (Notice, even this page makes a distinction and restates that photographic memory doesn't exist)

I don't give a damn what you friend says lol, it's just not a thing.

The white room's aim is to create a curriculum able to mass produce geniuses in the true sense of the word, geniuses who would surpass what is currently seen in outstanding individuals in different fields.

"Trustest sense of the word" can mean anything. Gotta be specific and bring scans, otherwise you're just yapping.

Name multiple children between the ages of 2-6 actually capable of this. "Not close to peak human level" it is for a literal toddler. Whether he was trained to do so or not is irrelevant. Sit any child down and try to make them understand even basic highschool math and see how well that goes.

William James Sidis taught himself 8 languages by age 8 without having the supernatural ability of Perfect Memory.

Yes, for some reason, having the mental faculties of, displaying thinking, learning and reasoning capabilities of 20-30yr olds while only 10-13 yourself is not impressive at all.
It's one thing to want to downplay but making stuff like this seem like they're not even worth mentioning for one's agenda is plainly wrong.

It's not. Mental age of 20-30 is not impressive by these standards. At best it is just another feat of gifted intellect.

Having perfect memory doesn't invalidate his feats. Thinking and reasoning are not dependent on one's ability to recall. You could know every textbook back to back but without the ability to apply what's in them, you'd be unable to solve problems presented to you in a different way.

His ability to recall is a supernatural and unfair advantage that he was born with. Also, I didn't say is invalidated his feats. I said that is significantly reduces their impact.

Yea it's a single field but it's not his only field. Oznce again, "gifted in chess"? Merely gifted? Outperforming a supercomputer that surpasses the likes seen in the real world is only "gifted"? Last I checked, outperforming supercomputers is actually one of the ways to get an EG rating.

Please give the SS that it was a supercomputer and also show him consistently outperforming it in multiple areas, not just chess.

Stop pushi pushing the idea that this is some vague hype statement. The white room like I've said aims to surpass the level of genius in the true sense witnessed in the world. Their standards are compared to the best of the best in other words, despite being able to measure the level of real world geniuses, they are unable to do so with Ayanokouji

Again, more yapping because you aren't proving it is anything more than a hype statement. Give scans that support it being anything more than that. Please.

Once again, perfect memory doesn't help with problems one hasn't encountered. Just change a few variables, the thing one is solving for, reversing a question such that one needs to obtain initial values from the final or midway point and you have an entirely new difficult thing to solve (literally been there myself, no amount of cramming saved me when the sequences were flipped and before one tries to invalidate this point by bringing up one's intelligence level, the point is about perfect memory)

This was in regard to learning martial arts. I don't understand what is so hard to understand about perfect memory sufficiently aiding in being able to memorize a style of combat. It makes it far less impressive.

Except his knowledge in various fields is already at the peak. Real life geniuses are only knowledgeable in specific fields, sometimes only one and may branch off to a few others but his basically encompasses all of science and arts

Prove that he surpasses real life geniuses and is at the peak of those fields.

Sorry but photographic memory isn't an ability, it's actually real to varying degrees

It is not real.

Self proclaimed intelligence conniseur, no child is mastering many martial arts at the age of 4. Even real world masters spend their lifetime be peerless in only one (maybe a few).
Perfect Memory isn't aiding anyone in mastering martial arts. Sure you can know all the forms but now let's see you perform them and put it into practice. How does perfect memory help the physically challenged master martial arts? Other factors such as hand-eye coordination, good motor skills, reflexes etc are necessary to learn martial arts than one's ability to recall.

Children are capable of participating in martial arts training at age four.

What separates Kouji is his memory. Also, saying memory doesn't aid anyone is mastering martial arts is absolutely HILARIOUS. Most of combat sports, and sports in general, is literally muscle memory.

All of what you mentioned here is significantly easier to master via Perfect Memory, btw. Literally all realms of human endeavor are.




Anyway I'm not responding to the rest of this. Also, I recommend that you chill out lol. Dude is just an anime character on a scaling website. Not need to get all furious xD.

 

[CloverDragon03]

William James Sidis taught himself 8 languages by age 8 without having the supernatural ability of Perfect Memory.

Using a literal child prodigy to prove that Ayanokouji does not have Genius intelligence is not how I'd go about this...

Edit: Bro entered Harvard at 11, how is this even evidence?

 

[Tatsumi504]

Cool meltdown. Do you know the meaning of upper limit or peak human tho?

A meltdown is a step by step analysis of an argument? Cool. Find me a source on one human that's accomplished what he has shown to define said upper limit or peak human.
Those terms literally mean they are achievable for a select few.

 

[AyeZ2]

Using a literal child prodigy to prove that Ayanokouji does not have Genius intelligence is not how I'd go about this...

Bro entered Harvard at 11

 

[Phoenks]

Using a literal child prodigy to prove that Ayanokouji does not have Genius intelligence is not how I'd go about this...

Edit: Bro entered Harvard at 11, how is this even evidence?

Well, he was the only person I could think of off the top of my head, lol.

Anyway, there are probably others. I'd just have to search for them.

Though the main point I'm making is that Ayanokouji really isn't all that special nor is this some kind of CRAZY feat lmao. There are real world people who have done BETTER than him in these categories WITHOUT having PERFECT MEMORY.

That's the main point I'm making.

 

[Dinozxd]

Saying "this guy's feats aren't that impressive because he has perfect memory" is pretty much like saying "this guy's feats aren't that impressive because he is very smart" imo.

Like, memory should be regarded as intelligence too? It's not like Ayanokouji is a dumbass and his only ability is having perfect memory.

 

[CrimsonStarFallen]

Saying "this guy's feats aren't that impressive because he has perfect memory" is pretty much like saying "this guy's feats aren't that impressive because he is very smart" imo.

Like, memory should be regarded as intelligence too? It's not like Ayanokouji is a dumbass and his only ability is having perfect memory.

Agreed.

 

[CloverDragon03]

Well, he was the only person I could think of off the top of my head, lol.

Anyway, there are probably others. I'd just have to search for them.

Though the main point I'm making is that Ayanokouji really isn't all that special nor is this some kind of CRAZY feat lmao. There are real world people who have done BETTER than him in these categories WITHOUT having PERFECT MEMORY.

That's the main point I'm making.

Well William was 4 years older than Ayanokouji when he did his thing so it's not quite the same. 5 languages at 4 years old is stupid impressive no matter how you slice it, and I'm not convinced that this and other such feats (like Taylor Series equations at a very young age) wouldn't put him at Genius intelligence. Gifted is absolutely too low and not an accurate representation

Also, bro is trying to be cheeky

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Well well well. Put me as agree for now until counterarguments

 

[HelloThere1089]

A meltdown is a step by step analysis of an argument? Cool.

Yes. Because it can be both. Your "analysis" was coupled with a meltdown.

Find me a source on one human that's accomplished what he has shown to define said upper limit or peak human.
Those terms literally mean they are achievable for a select few.

You said this

Name multiple children between the ages of 2-6 actually capable of this. "Not close to peak human level" it is for a literal toddler. Whether he was trained to do so or not is irrelevant. Sit any child down and try to make them understand even basic highschool math and see how well that goes.

This is not peak human. This is just peak child. Don't need scans to understand this much. The rest I don't care really.

 

[Phoenks]

Well William was 4 years older than Ayanokouji when he did his thing so it's not quite the same.

It is said he learned them by the time he was 8. That doesn't mean he did it all after turning 8. So it's not really something to be compared. Regardless, I think William's feat is exponentially more impressive since he didn't have a supernatural ability to help him do that.

and I'm not convinced that this and other such feats (like Taylor Series equations at a very young age) wouldn't put him at Genius intelligence. Gifted is absolutely too low and not an accurate representation

You have to consider that, again, he absorbs information like a sponge due to his ability, and he was also practically forced to learn these things from a young age.



Anyway, I don't really care if Genius is decided to be better. I disagree with it, but I don't mind it that much lol.

 

[HelloThere1089]

I think Genius is apt. EG is a no. (in case you are splitting votes)

 

[Dinozxd]

I agree with a full Genius rating for both his Intelligence and combat intelligence. Gifted is far too low.

 

[Livinmeme]

William James Sidis taught himself 8 languages by age 8 without having the supernatural ability of Perfect Memory.

That guy has the collective intelligence of everyone here (though it isn't very high), and he is arguably the smartest man in all of the world

 

[wwereymy235]

Well, he was the only person I could think of off the top of my head, lol.

Anyway, there are probably others. I'd just have to search for them.

Though the main point I'm making is that Ayanokouji really isn't all that special nor is this some kind of CRAZY feat lmao. There are real world people who have done BETTER than him in these categories WITHOUT having PERFECT MEMORY.

That's the main point I'm making.

I’d like to see an example of someone being better than Ayanokoji in a category.



William is no where near Ayanokoji, and it’s the truth. Languages isn’t the only thing Ayanokoji was learning. He was learning things at the college level at that age too on top of the languages he learned. (And martial arts)

 

[Livinmeme]

Anyways, he should be genius, gifted is too slow for a grandmaster in chess, and another crap (that little gary stue)

 

[CloverDragon03]

It is said he learned them by the time he was 8. That doesn't mean he did it all after turning 8. So it's not really something to be compared. Regardless, I think William's feat is exponentially more impressive since he didn't have a supernatural ability to help him do that.


You have to consider that, again, he absorbs information like a sponge due to his ability, and he was also practically forced to learn these things from a young age.



Anyway, I don't really care if Genius is decided to be better. I disagree with it, but I don't mind it that much lol.

I think it also comes down to the fact that, similar to what Crimson was saying, I don't agree with using Perfect Memory how you are as pretty much a means of dismissing damn near any intelligence feat

 

[Worthless]

He's called a genius, so genius rating should be fine.

A genius among geniuses to be specific, who possesses a vast amount of knowledge that most could only dream of. It has reached the point where every student at that facility believes he is nothing more than a myth created to make them think it's possible to achieve the impossible. There was one time when Ayanokoji jokingly said he had read hundreds of millions of books, what could he possible not know? He wondered. [1]

 

[Zabazab]

The qualifications of Gifted & Genius respectively, for reference;

Gifted: Characters who demonstrate high reasoning ability, can master difficult concepts with few repetitions, and display high performance capability or notable mastery in intellectual or specific academic fields, which makes them equivalent to real-world experts in these areas.

Genius: Individuals with an exceptional capacity for knowledge and intelligence, usually in one area of varying depth. This level of intellect is the level of real-world geniuses, polymaths, and genuinely extremely prominent intellectuals, and, in the absence of better feats, should be the default intelligence category for fictional characters with exceptional or superhuman intelligence.

 

[Phoenks]

Anyway I will change OP to genius even though I disagree with it.

 

[AyeZ2]

Using a literal child prodigy to prove that Ayanokouji does not have Genius intelligence is not how I'd go about this...

Edit: Bro entered Harvard at 11, how is this even evidence?

Wait, are you saying William entering Harvard at 11 is not evidence or do you mean something else?

 

[wwereymy235]

Anyway I will change OP to genius even though I disagree with it.

That’s better. Although Ayanokoji still outperforms every human that’s ever lived in general intelligence.