Doom Eternal Revision Thread

[DeadButDreaming]

Normal plasma railguns can be fired at 5-200 km/s.

Let's just use 5 km/s, gives a good speed upgrade.

Not like speed matters because speed is always equalized anyways and yes I'm kinda salty about that.

Dude, that's so true. Every single time without fail speed is equalized

 

[Jaften]

Isn't that speed around High Hypersonic?

We should default to 5 km/s (Hypersonic+) but maybe we can say "Hypersonic+, possibly High Hypersonic reaction/combat speed"?

 

[Armorchompy]

If speed didn't get equalized, the debate would always be:

"Does a character have passives?"

> No

"Can both hurt each other^"

> Yes

"Who's faster?"

> Character X

"X FRA"

 

[Jangles211]

plasma propulsion engines don't really fit the design of the Ballistas firing mode, it is a controlled straight beam of energy with no discernable limit of range.

 

[Jaften]

plasma propulsion engines don't really fit the design of the Ballistas firing mode, it is a controlled straight beam of energy with no discernable limit of range.

Sure, but neither does a literal particle beam.

We're on to plasma railguns now I think, what do you think of using them?

 

[DeadButDreaming]

We should default to 5 km/s (Hypersonic+) but maybe we can say "Hypersonic+, possibly High Hypersonic reaction/combat speed"?

I can get behind that

 

[Jangles211]

Even the term "particle beam" doesnt necessarily entail relativistic speeds. They USUALLY have relativistic muzzle velocity. Now you may object that I'm making an assumption by assuming this particle beam deviates from the norm. But I'm pretty sure that assuming a character can move at relativistic speeds is more of a hefty assumption that a futuristic weapon that carries particles that have been SHOWN to impart high amounts of damage WITHOUT high speeds having a low muzzle velocity. There is no reason for the weapon to have high muzzle velocity, not even theoretically.

the ballista is being noted as a marksmans weapon, the faster your weapon the less you have to lead a target from a distance, so Id disagree there is no reason for it to have a high velocity.

 

[Armorchompy]

That can make sense. Wasn't something said about reacting to meteors, though? Those are Hypersonic+ too iirc

 

[Jaakubb]

This is the closest real world application of high-velocity plasma. The advanced UAC should be on par if not greater than the set standard.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plasma_propulsion_engine

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plasma_railgu

I honestly dont think so. We cant just think of technological advancement is such a linear way. To make weapons or other technology better, some things have to be sacrificed in order to improve other more important characteristics. In the future, speed could very well be one of these things. Would you rather spend energy on getting more argent energy to make your weapon 10x stronger or use it to make the particles go faster for 1.05x(not exact numbers but you get the point)?

 

[Firestorm808]

If current technology can reach 200 km/s, I don't see why not the more advanced Sentinels are on par if not superior to that level.

 

[ShadowWhoWalks]

Unfortunately, the description of the "Microwave beam" kills the lightspeed upgrade. Another support for a Hypersonic upgrade is that the Chaingun is basicly a rapid-fire railgun:

The M220 Chaingun is a 7.62x51 mm AE six-barrel autocannon built for infantry deployment. Weighing over 80 lbs, the M220 was conceived as a standard issue weapon for ARC mech-soldiers fitted with exo-armor - mechanized suits capable of supporting a heavier payload. The AE cartridge uses a special electromagnetic casing designed specifically for the M220's rail system, which increases projectile velocity and reduces overheating.

For the Ion Catapult, it might be worth trying to calc the distance it launched the Doom Slayer. Otherwise, there is not much room to make assumptions; if we push it we can compare it to a space gun and place its projectiles at escape velocity, which wouldn't yield that much KE. Is there any statements about it?

 

[DeadButDreaming]

If current technology can reach 200 km/s, I don't see why not the more advanced Sentinels are on par if not superior to that level.

That's where phrases like "at least" or "possibly come in"

 

[Jaakubb]

the ballista is being noted as a marksmans weapon, the faster your weapon the less you have to lead a target from a distance, so Id disagree there is no reason for it to have a high velocity.

Whatever you'd gain from that is still much less than what you'd gain from investing that energy in your argent output considering how strong demons are.

 

[Jangles211]

Sure, but neither does a literal particle beam.

We're on to plasma railguns now I think, what do you think of using them?

hmm.

 

[Jangles211]

Unfortunately, the description of the "Microwave beam" kills the lightspeed upgrade. Another support for a Hypersonic upgrade is that the Chaingun is basicly a rapid-fire railgun:

we only know its similar tech to the BFG 10k seein as it uses the same green energy and barrel system, although it does it to launch actual physical munition, we do know that the weapon is used to destroy threatening asteroids (Stated by a dev at one point i forgot where)

 

[Jaakubb]

The hypersonic upgrade might be fine? But isnt a large amount of energy that goes into propelling the railgn projectile supplied by the railgun itself in contrast to the cartridge? Normally I'm pretty sure the muzzle energy of a gun is mostly dependent on the cartridge used, not necessarily the gun (although the gun DOES have to do with it, you dont just fire a 50 bmg from a sig sauer m17).

 

[Jangles211]

The issue that I have with using Plasma railguns is that don't Plasma railguns shoot a projectile rather than an actual beam of plasma?

 

[Jaakubb]

Really quick let's just clarify what we mean by plasma... wouldnt want this to turn into an argument about semantics.

 

[Jangles211]

"Argent Energy is produced by neutron activation of Argent plasma, a new and powerful substance that was discovered on Mars. This produces an exothermic reaction where recorded temperatures within the plasma have exceeded previously accepted theoretical limits. Through a process not yet fully understood, Argent plasma remains stable and self-contained throughout. Conventional nuclear power is obsolete. What used to take a nuclear reactor 12 months to produce can be generated in a few seconds by the Argent Tower and packaged into an Argent Accumulator no larger than Samuel Hayden's hand."


Slightly off topic but Did anybody miss this from 2016? It states that the exothermic reaction of argent plasma reaches temperatures above what was thought theoretically possible, what I know of from the theoretical limit of temperature (which I assume is what he is mentioning here) then wouldn't that make argent plasma above absolute hot temperatures?

 

[Jangles211]

Really quick let's just clarify what we mean by plasma... wouldnt want this to turn into an argument about semantics.

well the ballista seems to fire an actual pure beam of plasma, rather than a projectile.

 

[Jaakubb]

Plasma is matter. It's a projectile as well.

 

[Jangles211]

And on the topic of the Cannon Doomguy launched himself out of, the cannon was placed on one side of the crater and by the time we reach the other facility it seems we went completely across the crater itself to the opposite side.

 

[Jangles211]

Plasma is matter. It's a projectile as well.

You get what Im saying tho.

 

[Jaakubb]

No I dont. That's why I asked you to clarify. Wouldnt want to assume what you mean by plasma. I'm going by actual definitions, you're not so I have no way of telling exactly what you mean.

 

[DTG499]

Ok so how about the icon of sin's lasers?

 

[Jaften]

Those are like... magic beams or some shit, so who the **** knows what speed they move at.

 

[Armorchompy]

Same story, we don't know if they're lasers or argent energy stuff.

 

[Jangles211]

No I dont. That's why I asked you to clarify. Wouldnt want to assume what you mean by plasma. I'm going by actual definitions, you're not so I have no way of telling exactly what you mean.

Ok firstly, would a plasma railgun shoot a solid beam of energy out? Because based on my research Ive seen no reference for how the actual method of fire would look like to us. And in the MARAUDER case the firing mode seems vastly different to the way the Ballista itself is seen firing.

 

[Jangles211]

Same story, we don't know if they're lasers or argent energy stuff.

likely argent energy stuff,

 

[Jaften]

All we know about Sin's """lasers""" is that he shoots them out of pentagrams. And that they really hurt.

 

[Jaakubb]

No I dont. That's why I asked you to clarify. Wouldnt want to assume what you mean by plasma. I'm going by actual definitions, you're not so I have no way of telling exactly what you mean.

Ok firstly, would a plasma railgun shoot a solid beam of energy out? Because based on my research Ive seen no reference for how the actual method of fire would look like to us. And in the MARAUDER case the firing mode seems vastly different to the way the Ballista itself is seen firing.

Just get to the point already.

 

[Jangles211]

You need to give me evidence of Plasma rail guns working in a similar fashion to the Ballista or there Is no reason for me to not just dismiss you, lol.

 

[Jaakubb]

Wait are you talking about the hypersonic feat or the relativistic one? I'm not supporting either of them. The former seems fine but I'm still skeptical.

 

[Jangles211]

I'm talking about using a plasma railgun to scale the Ballistas speed, but as it is i still consider it to more likely a particle beam and am asking you to tell me how a plasma rail gun and the Ballista would be similar in their firing methods to justify scaling it to such rather than a particle beam.

 

[Jaakubb]

The dude showed a quote that shows the chaingun fires rounds designed for a railgun. Wasnt talking about the ballista that time. In hindsight the upgrade wouldnt work because unlike modern guns, a very large portion of the muzzle energy comes from the railgun itself in contrast to the cartridge.

 

[Jangles211]

Ahh ok

 

[Firestorm808]

For those wondering if Doomguy scales physically to the Titans, he broke the chains that enslaved Titans couldn't escape from.

 

[Foxthefox1000]

The meteors and potential Icon laser are still worth looking into

 

[Firestorm808]

I'm currently looking into the lasers of the Cyber Demon as well.

 

[Jangles211]

For those wondering if Doomguy scales physically to the Titans, he broke the chains that enslaved Titans couldn't escape from.

Ahh nice catch.