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DC Hold back revision
- Thread starter Amelia_Lonelyheart
- Start date
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They're free to, in fact Firestorm was on the discussion as well, and Confluctor states he'll do Captain Atom hence he's staying
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The 2-C scaling happened literally the issue after that. That comic could literally be seen as a limit break comic of sorts.
He actually wasn’t knocked out.
And since the fight happened in a nanosecond or so, they would be moving slower than when Superman fought RF. By the way Wally’s page is currently worded (which should be the exact same way Reverse Flash’s page should be worded within 3D AP) his dura would be 4-B when fighting Supes. As such Supes has casual 4-B scaling. Do with that info what you want, but what is currently on the speedsters’ pages is worse than before.
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I remember scaling from Convergence wasn’t even allowed iirc.
This can and has been calced before. Your opinion on it being dumb has no place here.
Oh this works, this was sorta already accounted for. You see it’s just RF’s dura = Wally’s relativistic punches << Wally’s RMP. His casual punches are 8-C btw, it’s just that he’d use stronger punches when fighting league-level opponents because they are more durable than say his everyday Rogue. So it’s just downscaling from that one time they highlighted how strong he was punching, since he did punch stronger than he ever had up to that point. The highlight of the feat would be because Wally was pissed by Barry dying and needed 1 move to stop Reverse Flash from getting that gem and due to Wally falsely believing that Reverse Flash wouldn’t die due to time travel stuff he could pull out said punch. In short the highlight of the punch doesn’t contradict Eobard tanking the punch without getting knocked out, he had enough Negative Speed Force in him to survive it. Whatever happens after that is free game though (such as Supes scaling). Also the RMP doesn’t even take charge up time, he can pull it out whenever and Hunter Zolomon did exactly that against Wonder Woman and she still tanked those punches.
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@Firestorm808 @Elizio33
What do you think that we should do? Should the speedster pages be adjusted from their current states?
Also, cross-scaling Wonder Woman between different continuities still seems very unreliable.
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From what I’ve seen it’s mostly Wally that’s relevant here, which is do-able due to him not getting retconned. But was more of a question.
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This is being knocked out, his irrelevant glance a second later is also just contradicted by basic plot, page afterwards,
Unless Zoom just decided to sleep on the way, I don't see why he didn't revolt ONCE.
In general I think him tanking IMP here is VERY weird, they seem to imply Zoom has some bizarre immunity to death because of time travel.
this statement will 100% not make sense with the "2-C is his peak" narrative, UNLESS Zoom genuinely just can't die in this state, so I think it implies Zoom resists death by some external or verse mechanic, rather than sheer durability.
Why
My opinion on it being inconsistent, is. Address that.
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Theres no indication that Flashpoint (NOT Post-Flashpoint) Wonder Woman is stronger or weaker then regular Wondy. She fights POST CRISIS Wally, and endures his explicitly 5-A attack. It should scale to regular Wonder Woman. In DC, other-universe incarnation of characters are usually shown to be equal to their mainline counterparts unless it's another piece of media, a reboot, or explicitly mentioned otherwise. It's why the Crime Syndicate are (almost) equal to the JL, or why OTHER FLASHPOINT characters are depicted as being rough equals to their mainline counterpart.
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My apologies, but we do not automatically scale different versions of Marvel and DC Comics characters from different timelines to each other. It is too unreliable for our standards. They usually differ drastically in terms of demonstrated power scales. As such, the Wonder Woman scaling genuinely needs to be corrected.
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Anyways to reiterate, Professor Zoom tanking the Infinite Mass Punch looks like fatehax armor by verse mechanic, unless you REALLY want to argue 2-C Wally West can't do shit by his own admission, to Zoom because of RAW PHYSICALS, but somehow Infinite Mass Punch still knocks him out so hard he can't fight back his arch-nemesis at all.
This isn't even that hidden imo, and I know this kinda shit is revisited, so, weird of you to not note this.
Any refutations to this? I think this is more apparent fatehax than say something like, Sonic
This isn't even that hidden imo, and I know this kinda shit is revisited, so, weird of you to not note this.
Any refutations to this?
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Impress seems to make sense to me about Zoom.
However, the issue of cross-scaling between continuities for Wonder Woman is still absolutely not acceptable, so I would greatly appreciate if that can be corrected.
However, the issue of cross-scaling between continuities for Wonder Woman is still absolutely not acceptable, so I would greatly appreciate if that can be corrected.
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I mean I think this is a separate topic to be addressed, this revision has been held hostage for like, days now.
I think we'll begin applying it
I think we'll begin applying it
Eden_Warlock99
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Wasn't it already applied?
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Some of it was applied but not all of it
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Again, the Wonder Woman issue was a part of this revision, and needs to be fixed before we proceed with further drastic changes.
In addition, I would still much prefer if @Firestorm808 is willing to evaluate the suggested changes blog rather quickly.
In addition, I would still much prefer if @Firestorm808 is willing to evaluate the suggested changes blog rather quickly.
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There are also far worse offenders part of the revision.
I just don't see the point in holding this hostage when like, a separate thread can just be made in the very near future, regarding this topic, that delves into more detail, hell of anything both sides are currently underprepared to address this, this is a consistency matter which requires a NOTABLE amount of preparation to properly judge, the Post-Flashpoint scaling is not related to this revision except that is has Wonder Woman as a character affected.
We might as well discuss Speed revisions by this logic
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The Post-Crisis version of Wonder Woman is currently scaled from the Flashpoint version of Wonder Woman. I don't see why making a quick but important adjustment has turned into such a big deal to oppose. It is just about following our crossover scaling rules.
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Because it clearly has resistance against it :v
Ultimate Marvel's tiersplit was also a separate revision that had pushback, and the PS4 Spider-Man's comics scaling also has ALOT of support, it isn't as simple a matter as the standard suggests
Ultimate Marvel's tiersplit was also a separate revision that had pushback, and the PS4 Spider-Man's comics scaling also has ALOT of support, it isn't as simple a matter as the standard suggests
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We cannot change the standard without setting a very bad precedent, as even though sometimes there are statistics overlaps between different timelines, they usually differ a lot in their individual settings and are adjusted to match each others during crossovers to make the stories work.
It is also far safer to scale from the feats in their own settings for the sake of reliability.
It is also far safer to scale from the feats in their own settings for the sake of reliability.
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I know that, but it looks like something that'll just overtake this revision, you HAVE to realize, this would need ALOT of new calculations and feedback and feats.
Look, if I make a thread right now, which addresses this issue, can we move this discussion there? Nothing that disruptive, and hell it'll get renewed interest so users will help find Post-Flashpoint feats again
Look, if I make a thread right now, which addresses this issue, can we move this discussion there? Nothing that disruptive, and hell it'll get renewed interest so users will help find Post-Flashpoint feats again
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What do you mean? A separate thread just for removing the scaling to Post-Crisis Wonder Woman from her later Flashpoint version? Is there really nothing else to scale her from? She has fought Post-Crisis Superman and Captain Marvel for example.
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Pretty sure that's exactly what she had in her Post-Crisis profile.
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I think the problem is Post-Flashpoint ratings are getting challenged, no?
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Well, I think that we are making a hen out of a feather and should just scale her from something else instead.
I also thought that Amelia added the retroactive scaling during the last few days, but may have misunderstood or misremembered.
I also thought that Amelia added the retroactive scaling during the last few days, but may have misunderstood or misremembered.
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Are Rebirth DC dudes still 4-B?
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I have no real issues with the Tier 5 Rating on the speedsters.
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I'm generally fine with the current proposal. We can make any upgrades when we have all the data organized.
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So about this...
Also, can somebody come up with some alternative scaling for Post-Crisis Wonder Woman please? I think that it sets a bad precedent to scale between different continuities.
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I'll check my timeline for the new scaling.
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Also, Amelia seems to have found some Green Lantern feats that are blatantly far higher than 4-B:
vsbattles.fandom.com
Should we scale from them?
Green Lantern Power Ring
The Green Lantern Power Ring, also known as the Magic Ring to some, is an ancient and unbelievably powerful weapon created by the Guardians of the Universe in order to protect and maintain peace in the vast universe. As a lantern dies or in very rare cases, retires, their ring is passed on to...
vsbattles.fandom.com
Should we scale from them?
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Power Rings seem pretty Variable, does anyone in the JL scale to them at their strongest?
