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Huh? Where's stated that superman was in hypertime?
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DC Comics Crisis Cosmology Scaling
- Thread starter The_2nd_Existential_Seed
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Hypertime was created by World Forger.
That Vandal Savage managed to send Superman into Hypertime.
Superman went through an unknown number of realities/universes, Some where he had to face other versions of himself.
In the end we simply see Superman breaking free like this.
Source:
Action Comics (2016) issue #1000
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He is moving through Time itself. You got my vote.
NeonTxme
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Finally! So when's the time for the changes to be applied?
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It would need to be a seperate revision
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This thread is for character revision, along with argument and scans.
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Bump
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hmn dunno, cause he later says every timeline in the end led him home
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I didn't know whether my argument was right or wrong, but Goofy agreed
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From what Superman says he didn't escape thanks to his speed tho, it's just the power of love that brought him home
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This could mean something else, that Superman keeps going and fighting because of his love for his family, and that's the only reason he's back home. We can't just ignore Superman's struggles with other versions of himself in different time periods and reduce it to simply 'the power of love.'"
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If what Entity said is true then it's not speed. Can you disprove that?
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I just checked the scan. Is there something missing about the “power of love?” it genuinely seemed like it was just metaphorical. That he did need to break out by traveling speed.
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wasn't it the doing of Vandal's machine?
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I just read the comic, Superman is transported from one version of himself to the other, his body become their, then there is one single scan of him fighting previous versions of himself and at the end he breaks out and says that thing to his family, no other context. I think it is too vague and more scans of Superman's immeasurable speed are required if someone wants to upgrade him
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Vandal sends Superman into Hypertime, and on the next page, we see Superman fighting other versions of herself in different time periods. It also shows multiple Supermen attempting to escape Hypertime as he tries to break free.
But I still can't figure out what this "power of love" is. Even if it is real, you can't ignore the fact that Superman escaped from Hypertime using his own speed.
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That's not really the next thing we see, we see Superman being transported in the body of his past versions and fight those old versions' villains, be it the mafia or nazis, then he is transported in a fight against some versions of himself and escapes hypertime, the loop created by Vandal Savage, in some unknown way and at the end he states that he escaped thanks to Vandal's mistake, the fact that every time stream brought him back to his family (which isn't literally the power of love, just wanted to call it that way, just to make myself clear). What escapes is not even different versions of Supes, it is the same Superman turning back to his actual version. The feat is vague and to upgrade Superman I think it is necessary to bring more feats and statements, I remember one from Pre-crisis Superman involving time
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I don’t really see how that escaping required some sort of “love” power to do so. The fact that he did escape is quite implicit in that the event happened unless the whole fight was some sort of illusion. Given that Hypertime already is time itself, it's hard to see that him breaking through it wasn't a matter of speed because even moving through it by fighting himself instills some sort of movement.
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We can say that Superman travels through other timelines and interacts with different versions of himself. But the question is, how did he escape from Hyper Time? I can only attribute it to speed
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that was Vandal transporting him from one time to another
Yes, but the whole fact is almost unknow as the comic shows very little, if the feat should be used for something is to support the immeasurable speed only if there are some other feats which are less vague, so not to risk to wank everything a bit too much
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That is Vandal's work
Assuming, it is unkown in the comic as it shows very little, if you want to use this feat then use it to support other feats, that would be better
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Transportation doesn't matter here at all when we clearly see him moving in the hypertimeline Itself and trying to escape.
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That's fine then. More information would be good.
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The fact is that in the comic you don't see him moving at all, just fighting guys without knowing how he ended up there and the fact is it is Vandal who moves Superman from one time to the other, inside the body of his older versions. Again, the comic is too vague to be used alone, if you want to use it, use it as a supportive feat for other feats
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I just want to make sure Superman exit from hypertime is speed,
But...,
We don't need speed, we don't even need Superman escaping from hypertime، because Superman can move in hypertime.
It counts as a feat for speed.
it is a "Superman Rebirth"
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he doesn't
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Logically we could scale White Lanterns to be very much near Nekron who is 1-A. After all, the ring is connected to Life itself and could control all of time and space while existing in a voidless dimension of no space and time. (Batman: Universe Vol.1 #6)
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That Hypertime feat Superman performed encompassed all Timeline, universes, dimensions, and everything that has ever existed, exists, or will exist—essentially (infinite) worlds, realities, timelines, and dimensions.
When Superman got trapped in Hypertime, he flew at such an unimaginable speed that he effortlessly traversed all those infinite realities and even outpaced the other Supermen within Hypertime.
Note: Superman crossed the Infinite Timeline so he could escape Hypertime, otherwise she would have been trapped in Hypertime forever.
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assumptions over assumptions, I read the comic for this feat and Superman did nothing of what you're saying, you didn't bring any scan to prove that. In the comic he is brought inside the body of his old versions, losing heat vision and flight and becoming as strong as those versions (stronger than a train and faster than a bullet) as he got in the body of his early golden age self, so unless you want to give early golden age Superman immeasurable speed he did not travel through the hypertime, you do not even see him travel at all and when he fights his other selves he says that it was Vandal's doing, even the way he escaped is unknown and the only mention was Superman saying it was due to Vandal's mistakes. Bring other feats for the immeasurable speed, this is not enough
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You have to show evidence that Superman escaped Hypertime with speed, otherwise you're just making assumptions about something the comic doesn't show or imply.
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Bump.
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You just say it's not enough, and it's vague, I sent the required scans.
Hypertime has an infinite timeline, and it requires immeasurable speed to get out of Hypertime, and if it's not speed
how did Superman escape Hypertime? Why couldn't other versions of Superman escape Hypertime?
Superman flew and went through hypertime.
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the feat itself is vague and he didn't fly through the hypertime and I do not really care what the hypertime is, I read the comic you're using to scale Superman, I told you to bring other feats to support his immeasurable speed
Vandal's mistake and the other versions did not escape, if you want to scale early golden age Superman immeasurable speed make a crt
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I wasn't focused on that part since I had posted something about the white lantern rings possibly being 1-A. With that being said, @Entity seems to have a more favorable view about Superman’s not receiving that immeasurable speed thingy based on the scans.
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The empty hand is the right hand of great darkness,will the empty hand tier be upgrade?
NeonTxme
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Alr this argument is pretty much going out of hands with y'all running around a circle.
1. "Vandal moved Superman, not the other way around."
Wrong. Vandal starts the loop yes, but Superman is the one who breaks it. He literally says Vandal tried to use the past against him, but it only made him stronger. He escapes because of that; and Vandal doesn’t release him.
If someone sets a trap, and the target escapes by using the trap's own logic against them, the escape is their own achievement. Superman wasn't rescued. He freed himself.
2. "He was in weaker bodies, so it doesn't count."
This argument misses the entire point of metaphysical feats ngl.
Yes, his body was Golden Age-limited at times. BUT! his current mind, will, and essence were fully present. He still fought through Hypertime, made decisions, and in the end, acted outside of his bodily restrictions.
Escaping Hypertime doesn't require strength, it requires will and awareness. He literally shattered the loop created by a being who manipulates infinite timelines.
3. "There's no visible movement = no speed!"
... That's just some surface-level thinking. Not every comic panel shows Superman flying with motion blur.
But he clearly travels across multiple timestreams, fights through versions of himself, and ends up escaping the totality of Hypertime (which includes infinite alternate timelines and temporal layers. That’s not vague) that's literal multiversal time traversal.
The narration directly supports this:
"Every timestream brought me back to my family."
He didn’t just sit around, he moved through infinite time branches.
4. "He only escaped because of Vandal’s mistake"
Nope. Vandal made a mistake yeah sure, therefore Superman exploited it. That's called agency. That's the same as Batman beating someone when they leave an opening. It's not passive, but rather a decisive action.
5. "The feat is vague, don't use it alone."
Please don't talk about something you don't know and don't cause disruptions
Since the texts and scans are very simple and easy to read.
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No. “Right Hand” is metaphorical. A fraction of the power corrupted by Pariah claiming it was the Darkness was far stronger than the Empty Hand.
Would anyone like to dispute this. I think that's a reasonable explanation, particularly for points three and four.Alr this argument is pretty much going out of hands with y'all running around a circle.
1. "Vandal moved Superman, not the other way around."
Wrong. Vandal starts the loop yes, but Superman is the one who breaks it. He literally says Vandal tried to use the past against him, but it only made him stronger. He escapes because of that; and Vandal doesn’t release him.
If someone sets a trap, and the target escapes by using the trap's own logic against them, the escape is their own achievement. Superman wasn't rescued. He freed himself.
2. "He was in weaker bodies, so it doesn't count."
This argument misses the entire point of metaphysical feats ngl.
Yes, his body was Golden Age-limited at times. BUT! his current mind, will, and essence were fully present. He still fought through Hypertime, made decisions, and in the end, acted outside of his bodily restrictions.
Escaping Hypertime doesn't require strength, it requires will and awareness. He literally shattered the loop created by a being who manipulates infinite timelines.
3. "There's no visible movement = no speed!"
... That's just some surface-level thinking. Not every comic panel shows Superman flying with motion blur.
But he clearly travels across multiple timestreams, fights through versions of himself, and ends up escaping the totality of Hypertime (which includes infinite alternate timelines and temporal layers. That’s not vague) that's literal multiversal time traversal.
The narration directly supports this:
"Every timestream brought me back to my family."
He didn’t just sit around, he moved through infinite time branches.
4. "He only escaped because of Vandal’s mistake"
Nope. Vandal made a mistake yeah sure, therefore Superman exploited it. That's called agency. That's the same as Batman beating someone when they leave an opening. It's not passive, but rather a decisive action.
5. "The feat is vague, don't use it alone."
Please don't talk about something you don't know and don't cause disruptions
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I asked the thread members about Superman with 1-A scale, I don't think there is any objection, As for speed, it's better to ask Goofy.So what do we currently need to do here and what are the staff conclusions so far?
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