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DBZ Toei: More Downgrades
- Thread starter Vizer04
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He and Vegeta fight clones of equal power inside of Buu after Vegito defused.
Since when were we scaling SSJ2 to Kid Buu?
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Nappa scales to Goku, who only needed a 3x amp to overpower Vegeta, after he calmed down and powered up to his full strength.
Should I close this.
Nullflowerblush
He/Him- 9,791
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In "Inside Buu", Goku and Vegeta encountered doppelgangers of Gohan, Gotenks, and Piccolo. Considering that Buu absorbed the three, he should and would be able to replicate their power in the form of clones, and the Daizenshuu 7 confirms that the doppelgangers are identical to their originals. As Super Saiyans, Goku could take on Gohan, and Vegeta could take on Gotenks and Piccolo.
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I see.
Btw, I still think it's absurd for SSJ2 Goku to scale to Buu since SSJ2 Goku and Vegeta got stomped by Kid Buu
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He doesn't. Super Saiyan 2 and 3 are both multi-solar system level, but Super Saiyan 3 scales to Buu.
The manga page has the same set-up.
The manga page has the same set-up.
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Not even gonna touch Boohan vs Pure Boo, but is Super Vegetto being scaled below Pure Boo? I think Vegetto should scale above him for having numerous guides stating him to be the strongest character in the series.
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Agree, plus SSJ Vegito is stated to be >= Baby Saga SSJ4 Goku.
On a related note, since GT Base Goku shook hell in a matter similar to SSJ3 Fusion Reborn Goku, would it be fair to accept the feats as being comparable without needed to make a whole other calc for GT Goku?
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Guide statements such as?
That statement is objectively wrong. GT base Goku already scales above kid buu who base vegito is not stronger than.
Perhaps.
Nullflowerblush
He/Him- 9,791
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In Fusion Reborn, Goku shook all the way to the Grand Kai's Planet. In GT, he only shook up to King Yemma's Palace, which is in the center of Other World. The latter feat is smaller in scale. But again, this is not a GT thread.
Nullflowerblush
He/Him- 9,791
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What exactly does Vegito scale to?
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Clapped buuhan silly in base and stomped him in super saiyan. Unlike the manga where vegito immediately goes SSJ.
FantaRin_The_First
Username Only- 4,068
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Just to be clear, in the Toei-verse. Vegito is not stronger than Kid Boo. Kinda weird, ngl. Ultimate Gohan and Gotenks were always a bit of a jobber, in my eyes, so I can agree Goku and Vegeta being stronger than them due to the whole thing with the clones inside Buu. Anyhow, I always thought Kid Buu was the strongest Buu, even before I came across VSBW, so count me in the folks that agree to it
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Such as:
Son Goku Densetsu
Dragon Book
Note that this section in the Dbook takes place after the Pure Boo sections, and is basically just covering the series overall.
Movie 12 Animanga
Note that this Daizenshuu covers both anime and manga, and it's in the section for covering abilities, which isn't covering things in chronological order.
Kyogan Battle Collection 02
Dragon Book
Note that this section in the Dbook takes place after the Pure Boo sections, and is basically just covering the series overall.
Movie 12 Animanga
Daizenshuu 7
Note that this Daizenshuu covers both anime and manga, and it's in the section for covering abilities, which isn't covering things in chronological order.
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Base Vegetto is kinda weird. Some sources treat him as equal to Boohan, some treat him as significantly above, some treat him as slightly above. However, I will admit that the Dragon Book is likely in reference to Base Vegetto, as the image of him is right under the caption, and that same guide treats Base Vegetto as above Boohan.
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well the sources say that once goku and vegeta merge they become the ultimate power, implying that even base vegito is the "ultimate" power they're talking about
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It doesn't really matter whether or not base Vegito (even though the guides don't even specify base) is the strongest in the universe. He powered up more to stop Buuhan's attack, despite already having the advantage over Buuhan by a very noticeable margin.
He's not in the equation when it comes to scaling, whether it's above or below Kid Buu in base.
He's not in the equation when it comes to scaling, whether it's above or below Kid Buu in base.
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Alright sure, makes sense. He can scale to kid buu's value.Such as:
There are also like, 5 more statements for him being the strongest in the Universe, but this are the most blatant.Son Goku Densetsu
Kyogan Battle Collection 02
Dragon Book
Note that this section in the Dbook takes place after the Pure Boo sections, and is basically just covering the series overall.
Movie 12 Animanga
Daizenshuu 7
Note that this Daizenshuu covers both anime and manga, and it's in the section for covering abilities, which isn't covering things in chronological order.
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But will he scale only with SSJ or in Base too?
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SSJ but his base will downscale 50x times.
Nullflowerblush
He/Him- 9,791
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The Movie 12 snippet is both invalid for scaling and is untranslated.Son Goku Densetsu
Kyogan Battle Collection 02
Dragon Book
Note that this section in the Dbook takes place after the Pure Boo sections, and is basically just covering the series overall.
Movie 12 Animanga
Daizenshuu 7
Note that this Daizenshuu covers both anime and manga, and it's in the section for covering abilities, which isn't covering things in chronological order.
The Daizenshuu statement appears hyperbolic.
Everything else is valid, though.
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What do you mean? I have the translation right under it. If you can't see it for some reason, it says:
Could you also clarify why it's invalid for scaling? It's not like it's about the M12 continuity, it's just a part of the M12 Animanga that covers anime events.
I think it's possibly the most literal one if anything. It's using Vegetto being strongest and best ki user to explain why he's able to use the barrier, it being exaggerated/false would be counter-intuitive to making an easy to understand example for the reader.
Bet
Vizer04
He/Him- 5,233
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- Thread starter
- #70
I don't think that's enough proof to say Vegito is stronger than Kid Buu.Such as:
There are also like, 5 more statements for him being the strongest in the Universe, but this are the most blatant.Son Goku Densetsu
Kyogan Battle Collection 02
Dragon Book
Note that this section in the Dbook takes place after the Pure Boo sections, and is basically just covering the series overall.
Movie 12 Animanga
Daizenshuu 7
Note that this Daizenshuu covers both anime and manga, and it's in the section for covering abilities, which isn't covering things in chronological order.
Nullflowerblush
He/Him- 9,791
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Kid Buu exists. Databooks states that Vegito is the strongest. The Kyogan Battle Collection even states that Vegito was the strongest in Z in general.
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Unless someone calc's GT's afterlife shake, we'll sadly have a jump from 4-A to 3-A in GT. Unless scaling and multipliers bump them up.
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There's another Afterlife shake in DBGT that's not a movie?
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Goku shakes most of Hell while fighting Cell and Frieza.
But I don't see why this would really scale to anyone from Z. Base Gohan's Super Kamehameha and even the fodder Super Saiyans were far more of a threat than Majuub to suppressed Super 17 in this arc, and SS Goku puts up a better fight than them.
At the very least, the gap between base Trunks here and SS3 Goku in the Buu Saga (let alone Goku himself) is way greater than the gap between SS3 and Super Saiyan.
But I don't see why this would really scale to anyone from Z. Base Gohan's Super Kamehameha and even the fodder Super Saiyans were far more of a threat than Majuub to suppressed Super 17 in this arc, and SS Goku puts up a better fight than them.
At the very least, the gap between base Trunks here and SS3 Goku in the Buu Saga (let alone Goku himself) is way greater than the gap between SS3 and Super Saiyan.
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I only brought up that feat for GT scaling, although this crt isn't for GT so ignore that for now.
Vizer04
He/Him- 5,233
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- Thread starter
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I'll assume it's both, correct me if i'm wrong.
So, does anyone know how to calculate the feat of Goku shaking Hell in DBGT? Is it higher or lower than Fusion Reborn's feat?
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Surely it can't be much lower than the Fusion reborn feat?
And is there anyone willing to calc it?
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