Danny Phantom vs Will Vandom (Redux 2-A Version) (Concluded)

[LordGriffin1000]

Decided to redo this match since their previous match is outdated and now that Danny is 2-A, I can put Will at her full power.

Match Rules

• Both in Character
• Speed is Equalized
• 2-A Versions (A Glitch in Time Danny vs Magic Sovereign Will)
• SBA (Everything else)

Danny Phantom: 1 (Mickey1940,

Will Vandom

Inconclusive: 7 (LordGriffin1000, Peppersalt43, XSOULOFCINDERX, Jamesthetaker, Robo432343, TheRustyOne, Lloydblitzed,

 

[LordGriffin1000]

Guess I'll do the usual...

Danny's Advantages/Win Conditions

In terms of power, Danny scales to about 100x basline 2-A and Will's scaling chain isn't close to that so Danny holds the power advantage and could easily knock her out cold in a single hit. Various forms of durability negation which include possession are win conditions as well, however I doubt Danny would go for the kill so he'd more than likely try to incapacitate her so his go to methods would be knocking her out, freezing her in a block of ice, or possession as she no way of overcoming them if they land.

Danny's ghost physiology makes him almost impossible for Will to beat down as she lacks feats of affecting characters with Danny's level of abstract existence (Type 1), and while she can interact with his formed body when he becomes tangible, she'd cause him no actual harm. Abilities such as duplication give him the numbers advantage, and forcefields can block/reflect physical and energy attacks.

I doubt Danny would even think of using his Ghostly Wail but he can blind her temporarily (though she can sense energy, the flash would momentarily catch her off guard). While outmatched in stamina, Danny can go for hours unless pushed to use more energy and his physiology should prove tricky in combat as he can escape any hold Will puts him in.

Will's Advantages/Win Conditions

While outclassed in power, Will still holds the lifting strength advantage (Infinite compare to Danny's Class K) so she can throw him around effortlessly, and tie in her hand to hand martial arts that is on the level of Hay Lin who is decribed as an expert martial artist with counters. Will should have no trouble avoiding Danny and countering in close combat, plus her Lamia acts instinctively so Danny wouldn't only be fighting will. Then she possesses better sensing capabilities which would instantly tell her the power Danny has is no joke, putting her on high alert from the start while Danny would still be overconfident.

Will's win condition lies in her stamina, which far exceeds Danny's as in a far weaker form, she scales to Taranee who survived one to two weeks in a cage that was constantly stealing her life energy. In this form, Will has even more stamina and an infinite supply of magic energy which means she can outlast Danny until he passes out without issue. This task won't be too complicated as I mentioned above Will can avoid Danny's attacks without much issue unless surprised, but Will also has invisibility and while Danny has this too, Will is the only one of the two that can sense energy and danger so he wouldn't no where she is. Her forcefields can also be used to reflect his beams back at him twice as hard unless he makes them phases trough it.

Will also has multiple teleporting options and the massive range advantage which she can implement by sniping Danny from universes away (this isn't something she'd immediately go for) as her enhanced sight allowed her to see her boyfriend from a completely different universe and with her control over space she threw a piece of cake to his location despite being a universe away (said universes are infinite in size mind you). Even though i doubt she'd go the that distance, she has shown the Willingness to use range to her advantage and the moment she realizes she holds this over him and, she'd go for it as she can monitor him and attack him not matter the distance.

My Vote

I'm going to go inconclusive.

Danny's method of winning requires him to make contact, be it with a punch, energy/ice attack or possession, and while not an impossible task, it will be a difficult one given Will has many ways of avoiding his attacks and if she decided to turn invisible or use her super sight + range advantage, he'd have virtually no counter.

Will's win method focuses on trying to outlast Danny but this is difficult given he's still capable of actively using his powers for hours before returning to his human form and a single hit immediately is game over and Danny's body control, intangibility, and duplication could catch her off guard. His physiology counters many of her abilities as well.

 

[LordGriffin1000]

Bump.

 

[Peppersalt43]

Incon FRA

 

[Mickey1940]

I have several questions

1. What are their starting moves?
2. Does Will have any answer to getting blasted in the face with near subzero ice, deconstruction, or sleep manip?
3. Does Danny have any answer to emp manip, absorption, or EE?

 

[LordGriffin1000]

I have several questions

1. What are their starting moves?
2. Does Will have any answer to getting blasted in the face with near subzero ice, deconstruction, or sleep manip?
3. Does Danny have any answer to emp manip, absorption, or EE?

1. On Danny's profile is a standard tactics section that tells you what he does in character but if you want the short answer, he'd either start with close combat (punches and kicks), energy blasts and since it's post season 3 Danny, he'd use ice attacks. Will uses close combat (punches and kicks) and energy beams just like Danny.

2. Basic dodging. Danny's attacks aren't invisible and his ice attacks and deconstruction beams are only a little bigger than a person's head, I mentioned in Will's section that she has the hand to hand martial arts skill that would allow her to dodge Danny's attacks without to much issue, she also has teleporting techniques so yes, she has an answer for getting blasted and it's a simple one using her skill and teleporting techniques to avoid the attack. Also, sleep manipulation? Danny doesn't have sleep manipulation... if you're talking about what is mentioned in his season two tabber, it clearly mentioned in the description that it's resistance to sleep manipulation and has a link, it's right after his resistance to corruption.

3. On the Ghost Physiology page it's mentioned in the resistance section that ghosts have resistance to mind/empathy manipulation and we've got a blog on the verse page explaining how it's layered (with Danny being up to 5 layers in season 2 onwards) so Will's empathy manipulation isn't doing anything given it's baseline, absorption was used once but it was accidental and she never used it again unless you count the two times with the Heart of Kandrakar when she needed to absorb the energy of the town to give it back to it's rightful owner or when she used it to absorb the seal of Phobos (all three times were non combat situations spread out over the course of at least 3 years of her story) and in combat she's never opted to use it even against stronger opponents. Plus, their is no evidence she'd be able to handle Danny's level of energy as we've seen too much power in the W.I.T.C.H. verse can cause you to explode, Will would sense his massive power and not attempt to absorb it. Finally, Existence Erasure was used once and not for combat, plus she has no feats of affecting abstract entities so she'd only erase his body which wouldn't stop him from making a new one.

In my analysis of the fight I pretty much go over everything worth mentioning, if I didn't cover it then it had no factor in the fight. Anymore questions?

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Incon FRA.

I'm a bit confused though, if he's an abstract then how can she hit him without the proper NPI?

 

[Mickey1940]

1. On Danny's profile is a standard tactics section that tells you what he does in character but if you want the short answer, he'd either start with close combat (punches and kicks), energy blasts and since it's post season 3 Danny, he'd use ice attacks. Will uses close combat (punches and kicks) and energy beams just like Danny.

2. Basic dodging. Danny's attacks aren't invisible and his ice attacks and deconstruction beams are only a little bigger than a person's head, I mentioned in Will's section that she has the hand to hand martial arts skill that would allow her to dodge Danny's attacks without to much issue, she also has teleporting techniques so yes, she has an answer for getting blasted and it's a simple one using her skill and teleporting techniques to avoid the attack. Also, sleep manipulation? Danny doesn't have sleep manipulation... if you're talking about what is mentioned in his season two tabber, it clearly mentioned in the description that it's resistance to sleep manipulation and has a link, it's right after his resistance to corruption.

3. On the Ghost Physiology page it's mentioned in the resistance section that ghosts have resistance to mind/empathy manipulation and we've got a blog on the verse page explaining how it's layered (with Danny being up to 5 layers in season 2 onwards) so Will's empathy manipulation isn't doing anything given it's baseline, absorption was used once but it was accidental and she never used it again unless you count the two times with the Heart of Kandrakar when she needed to absorb the energy of the town to give it back to it's rightful owner or when she used it to absorb the seal of Phobos (all three times were non combat situations spread out over the course of at least 3 years of her story) and in combat she's never opted to use it even against stronger opponents. Plus, their is no evidence she'd be able to handle Danny's level of energy as we've seen too much power in the W.I.T.C.H. verse can cause you to explode, Will would sense his massive power and not attempt to absorb it. Finally, Existence Erasure was used once and not for combat, plus she has no feats of affecting abstract entities so she'd only erase his body which wouldn't stop him from making a new one.

In my analysis of the fight I pretty much go over everything worth mentioning, if I didn't cover it then it had no factor in the fight. Anymore questions?

So essentially:

Danny's options to avoid Will's 1 shot hax are either having resistance to them or Will very rarely uses them

Will's options to avoid Danny's 1 shots are... dodging...

unlike Will's hax, Danny's are extremely spammable and in character. If Will gets hit a single time she's fuked. It's highly unlikely Will can dodge Danny forever, especially since this is S3 Danny who spams ice in character

Danny gets my vote

 

[LordGriffin1000]

Incon FRA.

I'm a bit confused though, if he's an abstract then how can she hit him without the proper NPI?

Ghosts true selves are abstract beings, but in that state they can't interact or be interacted with by the physical world so they make tangible bodies for themselves which are the things we see in the verse. These bodies can be touched, they just won't feel any pain unless hit by someone with the proper non-physical interaction. Basically, anyone can touch Danny Phantom's body when it's tangible, they just can't hit his abstract self, thread was made about it here talking about how they are abstract but need tangible bodies to interact with the world.

So that's why Will can still touch him an outlast last him.

 

[LordGriffin1000]

So essentially:

Danny's options to avoid Will's 1 shot hax are either having resistance to them or Will very rarely uses them

Will's options to avoid Danny's 1 shots are... dodging...

unlike Will's hax, Danny's are extremely spammable and in character. If Will gets hit a single time she's fuked. It's highly unlikely Will can dodge Danny forever, especially since this is S3 Danny who spams ice in character

Danny gets my vote

Vote counted.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Ghosts true selves are abstract beings, but in that state they can't interact or be interacted with by the physical world so they make tangible bodies for themselves which are the things we see in the verse. These bodies can be touched, they just won't feel any pain unless hit by someone with the proper non-physical interaction. Basically, anyone can touch Danny Phantom's body when it's tangible, they just can't hit his abstract self, thread was made about it here talking about how they are abstract but need tangible bodies to interact with the world.

So that's why Will can still touch him an outlast last him.

I see.... That's really weirdly confusing but alright.

 

[Mickey1940]

I see.... That's really weirdly confusing but alright.

TLDR Will has non-physical interaction

 

[LordGriffin1000]

I see.... That's really weirdly confusing but alright.

Guess the short/simple version of ghosts would be to explain their true form and avatar/body separately.

True Selves: Ghosts are manifestations of pure emotions, a concept which predate the Ghost Zone/Human world and is the primordial source of all ghost/ectoplasmic energy, without emotions ghosts will lose their literal identity and become unrecognized, they lack a true physical form, and cannot be interacted with from anything in the real world and vice versa. This grants them Abstract Existence Type 1 (and Conceptual Type 1 in nature).

Avatar Bodies: These are the forms we mainly see them as when they are in the human world, these forms are manifestations of the ghosts ectoplasmic energy and post human consciousness, these forms are physical and can be interacted with but feel no pain as they are just solid ectoplasm, they can also change the density/structure of their body which is why Danny is a complete solid at one point (ocasionally with a skeleton) but then he's a semi solid and can be split in half by a casual book toss from Sam. They need to activate their intangibility or revert themselves back to their true state to become intangible.

Hope that helps, if it doesn't I don't know a better way to explain it.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Guess the short/simple version of ghosts would be to explain their true form and avatar/body separately.

True Selves: Ghosts are manifestations of pure emotions, a concept which predate the Ghost Zone/Human world and is the primordial source of all ghost/ectoplasmic energy, without emotions ghosts will lose their literal identity and become unrecognized, they lack a true physical form, and cannot be interacted with from anything in the real world and vice versa. This grants them Abstract Existence Type 1 (and Conceptual Type 1 in nature).

Avatar Bodies: These are the forms we mainly see them as when they are in the human world, these forms are manifestations of the ghosts ectoplasmic energy and post human consciousness, these forms are physical and can be interacted with but feel no pain as they are just solid ectoplasm, they can also change the density/structure of their body which is why Danny is a complete solid at one point (ocasionally with a skeleton) but then he's a semi solid and can be split in half by a casual book toss from Sam. They need to activate their intangibility or revert themselves back to their true state to become intangible.

Hope that helps, if it doesn't I don't know a better way to explain it.

So with Danny at least you don't actually need conceptual NPI to beat him if you can manage to avoid getting your ass kicked long enough, got it.

 

[Mickey1940]

So with Danny at least you don't actually need conceptual NPI to beat him if you can manage to avoid getting your ass kicked long enough, got it.

think about it like Obito

If you don't have NPI, Danny can dodge whatever he wants by becoming intangible in that instance, while still being able to punch you in the face

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

think about it like Obito

If you don't have NPI, Danny can dodge whatever he wants by becoming intangible in that instance, while still being able to punch you in the face

That's a bad example as Obito can't fight while he's Intangible at all.

 

[Mickey1940]

That's a bad example as Obito can't fight while he's Intangible at all.

i mean yeah that's kind of my point

Danny can't punch you in the face if his fist is intangible, so he makes his fist tangible when he punches you in the face, but he's intangible when he is being punched in the face

 

[Peppersalt43]

Anyway, bump

 

[LordGriffin1000]

Bump.

 

[LordGriffin1000]

Bump.

 

[LordGriffin1000]

Bump

 

[Jamesthetaker]

Incon FRA

 

[Peppersalt43]

Cool

 

[Peppersalt43]

Huh, 3 more votes to grace!

 

[Robo432343]

incon fra

 

[LordGriffin1000]

Bump.

 

[Jamesthetaker]

Incon FRA

 

[LordGriffin1000]

Incon FRA

You voted already...

 

[Jamesthetaker]

Oops, I forgot

 

[TheRustyOne]

Snip

Wow, this is pretty detailed.

I'll also vote Inconclusive for the reasons above.

 

[Peppersalt43]

Cool

 

[Peppersalt43]

Huh, 1 more vote to grace!

 

[Lloydblitzed]

Incon FRA

 

[LordGriffin1000]

Added the match, closing.