Composite Human vs. Thunder McQueen.

[Wokistan]

Why would McQueen know CH even existed if there's no reason to think he's there? There's a reason that no threads end up with "Incon due to both not knowing of the other" and it's that SBA adjusts to the max range for characters. Stuff like this almost never comes up in the first place unless its prepped or characters are invisible by default, and characters that are invis by default usually have some way to negate someone else's invis themselves, or OP decides to change SBA. SBA's a suggestion that gets put into place if nothing else is being used, not an absolute rule. Here, CH is prepped. CH can hide underground with 10 days of prep in a manner that McQueen wouldn't notice before killing himself, and McQueen is suicidal anyways and would kill himself regardless.

 

[DMB_1]

So even if CH aired a killer to kill Thunder, he would still die because the stand targets him.

And I imagine that HWTH can also target souls, so it would be impossible for CH to escape being targeted.

 

[Wokistan]

He probably wouldn't die to a hitman, but that's just not allowed. Has McQueen ever bitten his tongue off to choke himself to death in canon? Because while people have tried that before, I don't think you're allowed to assume McQueen would think of that unless its a thing he did.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

The SBA kind of messes up a bunch of fights if you actually stop to thing about it. Just because that's the character's attacks can reach this far, doesn't mean they can see that far. In fact, why do we ignore this in every thread? The character not knowing of each other's presence could change the result of a bunch of fights.

 

[Wokistan]

Because its never come up where neither one knows of the other, and if it does all it takes it a small modification by the OP to fix it. Also, most characters have far greater than 4km range.

 

[Wokistan]

Any fights in particular where two characters could feasibly be within SBA range and not notice each other that were added?

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Yeah, and most character who have greater than 4 km range can't see this far. Range is the distance the character's attacks can cover, not as far away as they can see, how would they even know who they have to attack?

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Seriously, literally everybody who doesn't have enhanced eyesight or some type of extrasensory perception would not know where the opponent is, how are they supposed to fight like this? The SBA kind of makes no sense if you overthink it.

 

[Wokistan]

Characters with feats of shooting that far generally can see that far, or have some other sort of perceptive abilities. That's part of why 4km is the SBA max, as normal people can still barely see someone else at around that distance.

 

[Wokistan]

One character having an advantage due to having the prep time to exploit not being seen is also not the same thing as a match that never happens due to both characters not knowing of the other. Besides, stands are considered invisible in vs battles all the time since that's usually how they are to non stand users. I fail to see how using your prep time to hide is any different in the regard.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

I'm not talking about this match in specific, I'm just wondering how the hell the characters were supposed to get around this starting distance in SBA if they don't know where the opponent is.

 

[Wokistan]

If someone brings it up, OP can modify it, but even real people can see farther than 4km without stuff like binoculars, and characters who can't see that far usually don't have the range to match so they aren't locked to 4km anyways. If all else fails, OP specifies a range.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Normal people can see 4 km away? Wtf? I can barely see things that are on the end of my street. Maybe it's a problem with my glasses, it's been some months since I last changed the lenses.

 

[JustSomeWeirdo]

I doubt that you can actually recognize another human being from an entire 4 kilometets away

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

in general i think it is best to assume the characters at least know they are in a fight and know they are gonna end up killing an enemy that they can recognise so long as no abilities interfeer

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Then why are we assuming that McQueen doesn't even know that CH exists?

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

Voting inconclusive now. I change.

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

I hope the OP can keep track of all these votes

 

[Mand21]

I vote CH on the grounds he's more perceptive than any normal human by joining the senses and instincts of everybody. If his enemy does not know about his presence at the beginning, he'll be assassinated.

 

[DMUA]

... if he has 10 Days of prep he could get a telescope or some other method of long ranged detection.

 

[Mand21]

... if he has 10 Days of prep he could get a telescope or some other method of long ranged detection.

...plus, he could even manipulate some people and hack some stuff in order to be able to use artillery weapons, not to mention he has access to extremely long ranged weapons, some of which can shoot from several kilometers away.

Also, if Composite Human has the money and resources of all of humanity combined, he only needs TWO HOURS FLAT to throw a small nuclear bomb at thunderdude.

 

[Wokistan]

Normally I'd agree with iapatus, but 10 days of prep and the skills of everyone who's ever lived is definitely a skill that would interfere with that. Us, McQueen is suicidal regatdless, so CH doesn't even need to do anything as long as it stays hidden

 

[DMB_1]

bump

 

[Wokistan]

May want to update the OP with the votes.

 

[DMB_1]

They are hard to count.

 

[Wokistan]

Jman, Paulo and Iapitus voting for incon, and Mand and I are voting CH.

 

[Monarch_Laciel]

McQueen is suicidal regatdless, so CH doesn't even need to do anything as long as it stays hidde

That's... a good point. "All Damage and effects done to the user will be shared with the desired target". CH won't be a target if McQueen doesn't even know he exists. And I'm sure there'd be some unfortunate people wandering around Central Park who McQueen thinks "they'll do".

Also, I very much doubt McQueen can or will think to bite his own tongue off now, when in canon he instead apparently wandered around the prison looking for things to kill himself with instead of just biting off his own tongue.

Considering CH has prior knowledge of how HtH works, he'd know to never make himself a target, and would just stay hidden and watch as McQueen runs around looking for ways to die.

 

[Mand21]

So, can this be added already?

 

[TacticalNuke002]

The reason McQueen wandered around the prison looking for a way to kill himself was not just for the sake of killing himself, there were plenty of ways he could have gone about it. The reason he didn't commit suicide immediately whenever an opportunity presented itself was because of his desire to not die alone. Also, the person who he chooses to die with him will have to be someone special/significant to him, and not some random person on the streets.

In fact, the reason he targets Ermes is because she took his memory disc by mistake and he forgot that he had stolen her money, so when she tried to dig up info on him and followed him, he mistook her for having feelings for him. That's why he tried for the lover's suicide with Ermes and not the tons of other people he comes in contact with on a daily basis. Also, having his memory disc removed effectively removed every other good memories he may have had which coupled with the nature of his Stand turned him into a cripplingly depressed person contemplating suicide with a special someone, when he finds her.

If TMQ is having CH as his opponent(read suicide partner), it means he already has strong feelings for him/her and is likely to have activated HtH on CH already and not have interacted with anyone else(most of whom will not interact with him and those who do will not leave strong enough impressions on him). TMQ will not have seen CH for 10 days or more, so he'll not commit suicide immediately(because he needs confirmation that CH is indeed going to die with him).

Suicide watch tactics will not work. If TMQ drowns himself, CH can't CPR him if he's choking or passed out himself. If he hangs himself, CH will also be choking while levitating and unable to properly move. If TMQ electrocutes himself, CH also gets incapacitated or dies. Tongue biting is the only thing CH can possibly save TMQ from as he can heal himself first and attend to TMQ, but as someone already said, TMQ goes for conventional suicide methods(tongue biting is not something anyone can do. Its something the military personnel or secret service people might do if they're captured. Its also not instantaneous and highly painful which is why most people would rather not do it.)

I'd say inconclusive. If CH stays out of sight and waits, nothing happens leading to inconclusive. If CH tries to kill, he dies.

 

[Mand21]

Guys, what is stopping CH from sniping him out? What is stopping CH from deciding to assassinate TMQ after finding out about his skills through means that do not necessarily involve being found out and murdered?

We're talking about an Extraordinary Genius whose battle knowledges come much less from Anime Shounen-ish street fighting and martial arts gone wild and much more from military personnel being purposefully cheap.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

I simply wish to ask, does thunder need to know who he wants to die is, and not personaly, simply that they exist. If not, CH snipes before thunder realizes he even has an enemy

Answered above, so reduntant

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

If TMQ is having CH as his opponent(read suicide partner), it means he already has strong feelings for him/her

No, by sba, he doesnt even know CH exists, its random encounter

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Didn't we literally just agree that the characters know that the enemy exist in SBA?

 

[TheJ-ManRequiem]

>random encounter.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

They know that, but they dont have deep emotional connections

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

No, by sba, he doesnt even know CH exists, its random encounter.

 

[Arigarmy]

thunder mcqueen was a mistake

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Let me rephrase it then, he didnt even know ch existed until that moment, after which, i doubt hell form an emotional bond in a split second

 

[Mand21]

Voting for CH for all reasons previously stated. Who's with me?

 

[Wokistan]

Giving CH 10 days of prep is quite the departure from SBA