Character's Unfair Outliner

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

Why is Roshi Moon Level feat an outliner? And Kaguya Moon level isn't?

When Roshi clearly destroy the moon. Kaguya on the other hand didn't destroy a planet.

Even if Roshi took time to charge the kamehameha but he did acomplish the feat and kaguya didn't.

Also the excuse that "It's considered an outlier since characters who are stronger than him haven't demostrated any feat as close to that in the DB series" is Nul since in the Naruto series there's no other character that have demostrated any feat as close to destroy the Earth or a Planet. (Madara, Naruto, Sasuke, Hagoromo, and momoshiki otsutsuki.) So, Kaguay should be an outliner as well.

Becuase "Kaguya Ōtsutsuki used the Shinju to absorb chakra from all the people trapped inside the God: Nativity of a World of Trees technique to create a maximised Truth-Seeking Ball"

Her only planet level feat is this and it cannot be use in VS matches as well for the sole reason that:

Her expansive truth seeking ball technique is based on the description of all 5 chakra natures and how she needed all the chakra on Earth to create it.

Unless she is put in the Naruto-verse her Expansive TSB can't be use for anything.

So, both should be treaded as outliner or none. Also answer rationally.

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

We JUST had a thread locked about this....

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

Exaclty why i'm talking about this...should we or should we not put Kaguya Planet Level feat as an outliner then? Or should we remove Roshi outliner. Is either both or neither.

Since Roshi outliner has feats > while Kaguya doesn't have feats to back it up.

 

[Illuminati478]

This is not an argument, roshi's feat is an outlier because clearly stronger characters only busted cities with their best attacks, kaguya was calculated to be planet leve via one of her feats, and that feat is consistant as she the god of the verse and its her best attack...again this is not an argument, stop this, its getting annoying...

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

I wonder what feat? She only created a "ball" literally nothing more. There was no force or impact to calculated you just calculate the size and mass. While Roshi did destroy the moon and guess what Piccolo (stronger than Roshi) also destroyed the moon in the beginning of DBZ. Which mean is not an outliner because Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z is the same thing. Since there was only "ONE" manga and it was name Dragon Ball.

So, it did happen. The show has different names like Naruto and Shippudden put its all the same manga. So, there's the proof that its not an outliner or either Kaguya's will be too.

 

[Valar_Melkor_2]

Kaguya can use Expansive Truthseeking Orb outside of the Narutoverse. She didn't take chakra from the Earth she just took back chakra from everyone else since it all originated from her anyway.

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

She took the chakra that belong it to her, which was in the Naruto verse, unless you can proof that her "other" dimensions have the dbz verse included in it. Also she needs to have a high amount of chakra to use it, that's why she was absorbing all the chakra in the planet to do it. Which was once hers.

 

[Non-Bias]

You do realize that all the chakra in the Naruto world was originally Kaguya's right?

 

[Valar_Melkor_2]

You're not making any sense. Kaguya will have access to all her chakra in a VS match so she won't need to take it back from anyone to make the attack.

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

Cool. Kaguya is Planet Level with one feat, which needs to have all of her chakra back, that would mean as of minimun one ball. Because if she had infinite chakra to create alot of them, she wouldn't have run out of chakra at the beginning with Sasuke and Naruto.

Roshi did destroy the moon and guess what Piccolo (stronger than Roshi) also destroyed the moon in the beginning of DBZ. Which mean is not an outliner because Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z are the same thing. Since there was only "ONE" manga and it was name Dragon Ball.

So, it did happen. The show has different names, DB and DBZ just like Naruto and Shippudden put its all the same manga.

Also if she absorb every las drop of chakra wouldn't everyone be dead?

 

[Illuminati478]

Listen, this is not a debate. Kaguya has a consistent planet level feat, therefore she is planet level, roshi feat was inconsistent, therefore he isn't moon level. It doesnt matter how the feat was done or what conditions had to be reached for her to be able to preform the feat, as long as its a consistant feat, she will recieve the planet level stat, end of story.

 

[Valar_Melkor_2]

Kaguya would only need to use the attack once to beat most characters below planet level. And Roshi's Moon busting is considered an outlier because nobody else in part 1 Dragon Ball did anything close to that level and in the arc after it happened Roshi was nervous about taking on the whole Red Ribbon Army (of which the strongest member is only Building level) which would make no sense if he was a moon buster.

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

So, why isn't Roshi feat consistent, remind me again? Becuase it doesn't seen to look that way.

Also P.S:

The wiki says that, Kaguya Ōtsutsuki used the Shinju to absorb chakra from all the people trapped inside the God: Nativity of a World of Trees technique to create a maximised Truth-Seeking Ball."

I don't remember the power been hers, since she stole the fruit in the first place. "In Boruto: Naruto the Movie, it is revealed that many trees have existed throughout various realms and ages, the Earth's Shinju being only one of them. Another such tree also existed whereMomoshiki and Kinshiki hail from."

"On the brink of insanity, Kaguya combined with the Shinju itself to create the infamous Ten-Tails when she discovered much to her anger that her two sons, Hagoromo and Hamura, inherited her powerful chakra and unique dōjutsu."

This is just for does who beleive that Kaguya and the Senju were the same being before all this happen.

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

Kaguya would only need to use the attack once to beat most characters below planet level. And Roshi's Moon busting is considered an outlier because nobody else in part 1 Dragon Ball did anything close to that level and in the arc after it happened Roshi was nervous about taking on the whole Red Ribbon Army (of which the strongest member is only Building level) which would make no sense if he was a moon buster.

There is no part 1 of Dragon Ball, that just based on the anime. And so, anime is not canon. Manga is, and guest what? The manga runs throught the entire series all the way to Majin Buu. Piccolo destroy the moon as well. So, this is proof.

Not able to destroy Red Ribbon Army, is becuase like Kaguya; Roshi only Moon Level feat is a power up Kamehameha which takes time. Like Kaguya only Planet Level feat is the ExTSB that takes time to do.

 

[Valar_Melkor_2]

Roshi's feat is inconsistent because he was nervous about fighting people much weaker than Moon level, and lost to King Piccolo who was only a City buster. Also even 23rd Budokai Piccolo was only Island Level with his strongest attack. And yes Kaguya got chakra from the Shinju originally and then when she got revived and fought Team 7 she absorbed the chakra from people on Earth which was originally hers when she was at full power anyway. In a VS battle she will have access to that chakra anyway.

 

[Sheoth]

Roshi busted the moon.

King Piccolo busted Cities at his max and was visibly exausted.

King Piccolo>>Roshi in the Manga

Is your question answered?

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

King Piccolo>>Roshi? He never fought Roshi head on. He use the MaFu-Ba giving his own life to seal King Piccolo and he missed.

Roshi Full Charge Kamehameha>>King Piccolo (Which never happen)

Did you expect King Piccolo to stand there, while Roshi powers up his Kamehameha?

 

[AllanSaiyan]

Roshi busted the moon.
King Piccolo busted Cities at his max and was visibly exausted.

King Piccolo>>Roshi in the Manga

Is your question answered?

But roshi never went with his Max form in that fight against King Piccolo

 

[Sheoth]

But roshi never went with his Max form in that fight

But it wouldn't make sense for him to hold back against a threat to humanity now would it?

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

But roshi never went with his Max form in that fight

But it wouldn't make sense for him to hold back against a threat to humanity now would it?

King Piccolo>>Roshi? He never fought Roshi head on. He use the MaFu-Ba giving his own life to seal King Piccolo once and for all again and he miss his chance getting exhausted rapidly after.

Roshi Full Charge Kamehameha>>King Piccolo (Which never happen)


Did you expect that Roshi wouldn't know that King Piccolo will not aloud him to stand there, while he powers ups his Kamehameha? Right?

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

His profile should be updated and put as"At least Moon Level with Full Charge Kamehameha" his durability remains the same.

 

[Sheoth]

King Piccolo>>Roshi? He never fought Roshi head on. He use the MaFu-Ba giving his own life to seal King Piccolo once and for all again and he miss his chance getting exhausted rapidly after.

Roshi Full Charge Kamehameha>>King Piccolo (Which never happen)


Did you expect that Roshi wouldn't know that King Piccolo will not aloud him to stand there, while he powers ups his Kamehameha? Right?

He resorted to the Mafuba because he stood no chance head on. If his MAX Kamehameha was actually moon level, then his most basic blasts would logically be city level in the very least, which King Piccolo was only capable of at full power.

Also Lord Kavpeny expressed that he wasn't going to change it, so this is a dead topic.

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

King Piccolo>>Roshi? He never fought Roshi head on. He use the MaFu-Ba giving his own life to seal King Piccolo once and for all again and he miss his chance getting exhausted rapidly after.

Roshi Full Charge Kamehameha>>King Piccolo (Which never happen)


Did you expect that Roshi wouldn't know that King Piccolo will not aloud him to stand there, while he powers ups his Kamehameha? Right?

He resorted to the Mafuba because he stood no chance head on. If his MAX Kamehameha was actually moon level, then his most basic blasts would logically be city level in the very least, which King Piccolo was only capable of at full power.

Also Lord Kavpeny expressed that he wasn't going to change it, so this is a dead topic.

So, it ends like any other Vs battle topic. The character will loose because the other one will just stand there for 3 minutes until the other one launches his attack and hits him. I don't think that your logic makes sense at all. Of course that Roshi was no match for him. He also knew that he was not going to have the time to charge the Full Power Kamehameha. That its way he resolted to another attack.

If that would to happen it would have ended like this:

Roshi powers up, charges the Kamehameha. King Piccolo stops and kill Roshi on the spot.

I don't know about you put if i know that i can't reloate my weapon in time to react to the enemy, i would use another plan. Isn't that simple?

 

[Sheoth]

So, it ends like any other Vs battle topic. The character will loose because the other one will just stand there for 3 minutes until the other one launches his attack and hits him. I don't think that your logic makes sense at all. Of course that Roshi was no match for him. He also knew that he was not going to have the time to charge the Full Power Kamehameha. That its way he resolted to another attack.

If that would to happen it would have ended like this:

Roshi powers up, charges the Kamehameha. King Piccolo stops and kill Roshi on the spot.

I don't know about you put if i know that i can't reloate my weapon in time to react to the enemy, i would use another plan. Isn't that simple?

Except that doesn't make sense. If Roshi at full power is Moon level, then at much weaker he should at least be city level due to the massive gap between Moon Busting and City Busting.

Anyway, I'm done arguing about this since this isn't gong to get anywhere.

 

[Davy0]

This is not an argument, roshi's feat is an outlier because clearly stronger characters only busted cities with their best attacks, kaguya was calculated to be planet leve via one of her feats, and that feat is consistant as she the god of the verse and its her best attack...again this is not an argument, stop this, its getting annoying...

Nah. WoG stated that Roshi was always holding back. He concentrated all his power into his Max Power Form, which is what he did for the castle and the moon. Its when his concentration is at its peak as it literally amplifies his entire body with ki to raise his power.

http://buzz-plus.com/article/2015/04/21/dragon-z/

Translates the first link - http://jnetworkonline.com/2015/04/2...-the-dragon-ball-series-toriyama-akira-gives/

And that's about all we need.

Don't care what Ryuu has to say. But here's my proof.

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

Well, sigh thanks David. On topic let me add this:

Just because King Piccolo is stronger than Roshi that doesn't mean that Roshi can't destroy the Moon because King Piccolo didn't show the ability to accomplish a Moon feat.

Roshi, Was at MAX power. Was using an amplified attack. Was the inventor of the Kamehameha, which his student could use to multiply his PL by 2.2

Everyone forgot, King piccolo saying he will take out 1/43rd of earth every year- he did not, because he wanted to. In fact, he also said he can destroy the world if he wanted to.

Roshis feat is legit.

Also Roshi's Max Power form is not Moon Level, he's actual Full Charge Kamehameha is Moon Level.

 

[Davy0]

(Sighs and shakes my head... Gotta go, I'll be reading from now on. But the WoG is all you need to know about why "normal" Roshi wasn't a match for Piccolo, considering he retired, he was probably banking on Goku or his disciples to get it done. But you can't discount that Toriyama stated that Roshi was always "strong" though.

 

[Hiei312]

we don't know how much roshi's max kamehameha boosts his power. it might just be an incredibly absurd multiplier like tien's shin kikoho.goku went from 400+ to like 1000 using a regular kamehameha in the start of DBZ. for all we know roshi was above that for the moon busting feat.


Roshi needs to remain stationary and charge power for a while. its not viable in actual combat. however it makes total sense to believe roshi could have easily killed king piccolo if he somehow managed to hit him with that. in terms of raw power level, it again makes sense to believe roshi's kamehameha was the highest in Dragonball.


is Tien's shin kikoho feat considered an outlier too? if not we can just say Roshi's kamehameha is a hax move with absurd PL boosting just like that.

 

[AllanSaiyan]

So is Roshi gonna get an upgrade or nah.

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

No.

 

[Viturino]

Next thread will be about Cell, ill get my umbrella for the **** storm.

 

[GreatSaiyaman90]

King Piccolo is stronger than Roshi yes BUT Master Roshi was only able to blow up the moon in his Full Power mode and it tooks time to charge up that Super Kamehameha. It's almost useless in a fight. King Piccolo would have killed him easily while charging the kamehameha.

 

[TheMozart]

Why is Roshi being able to destroy the moon an outlier? That's unfair. And Kaguya was going to destroy a dimension so you cannot really compare the two.

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

Yeah, she was "going" to destroy a dimension while Roshi actually "destroy" the moon. Is unfair that her statement is counted over Roshi feat.

 

[Aimenaltair]

holly hell the roshi moon feat always show up, imo roshi is a ligit moon buster, it was confirmed by toriyama's own studio, reason why KP was only city busting is because he was doing the AOF thing that all db characters do, and he stated he can take out the world(erasing life or busting i donno) and he stated he can one shot 1/43 of the earth which is almost 2 times the mass of the moon.

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

Of course, because he is, he should be upgraded as"At least Moon Level with Full Charge Kamehameha" his durability still remains the same.

 

[Baniesabeni]

Kaguya was going to destroy her dimension. She should be above planetary level. That's unfair.

 

[Professor_Voodoo]

The dimension you're referring to is a zone of sorts. Most alternate zones vary in size. The term of dimension we use here is uhm..

Well...

 

[Ryuuzakiscorpio]

Unfair is when a character does a "feat" and is call a outliner. When another only states something and its added immediately to his profile.

 

[Faisal_Shourov]

Why is Roshi being able to destroy the moon an outlier? That's unfair. And Kaguya was going to destroy a dimension so you cannot really compare the two.

Kaguya didn't destroy anything, she's featless.