Characters that are stars

[Gwynbleiddd]

One is this , but i'm sure there are plenty of other pages with characters that are stars or either embody the Sun.

The problem with these pages is that they are simply rated as Start level which isn't necessarily the case.

If the Star is locked in a certain orbit and hasn't shown to be moving on its own then it should be rated using the energy it produces per second, which is Multi-Continent level for our Sun.

If the Star has shown to be able to move, while using the KE of a character isn't a choise, i think rating it Star level due to sheer size is fine.

For the durability of the Star we can still use its GBE.

Now for characters that embody the Sun, again i think that we should use the energy the Sun produces which is Multi-Continent level.

 

[Ryukama]

This seems reasonable to me.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Uh, I completely disagree, specially because an embodiment shouldn't be viewed in such a scientific way.

Usually, if these characters die, so do the stars themselves. In other cases there is literally no difference between them and the stars.

>While using the KE of a character isn't a choice

Why?

If a character is incredibly massive and can move, we can absolutely use Kinetic Energy to determine its AP. It is simple logic.

The only argument I hear against Kinetic Energy is "Writers usually don't consider Kinetic Energy with these things so we also shouldn't use it". But isn't the word of the author almost universally ignored here?

 

[LordAizenSama]

I agree with the OP

 

[Gwynbleiddd]

We've had a very long discussion about Kinetic energy in fiction and here is the related page.

The link between the embodiment and the Star doesn't prove anything about its AP.

And of course there are differences between them and the Star, not to mention that what i'm proposing is that the Embodiment can control the entire energy the Star produces.

EDIT: Also usually sentient Stars move at FTL speeds so KE isn't even a choice in such situations.

 

[Thebluedash]

Makes sense to me. I agree with Gwyn.

 

[KuuIchigo]

Seems fine.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

@Gwyn

Neither of the examples of when you can't use KE correlate to saying you can't calculate the KE of a moving star.

Also:

"For example, if a character swings a mace, and it destroyed a part of a wall, but the speed was calculated to be Mach 300, the energy required to destroy part of the wall would take priority over the kinetic energy derived from speed in this case."

Why? It literally says above that you can calculate KE from swinging or pushing or carrying feats. Swinging the mace at Mach 300 would undoubtedly destroy a wall anyway. A feat is a feat.

"The link between the embodiment and the Star doesn't prove anything about its AP."

Sure it does. They are literally are the star. Saying that they can't be Star level is akin to saying that a human can't scale to his own body in terms of AP.

Besides, being the embodiment of a star implies some degree of conceptual existence, and at that point science starts breaking down.

"And of course there are differences between them and the Star"

Like what? The character you used an example is a literal sun that has a planet surrounding him, who can move his body and talk and stuff. Doesn't help your case.

Or perhaps you mean something akin to the Conceptual Embodiments of stars you see in Sandman, like Rao and Sol? In those cases they also are literally the stars, though exist in a conceptual plane rather than the physical world. Hell, Krypton only forms around the physical Rao because the conceptual Rao is convinced by Despair to create a doomed species around his orbit, and Earth is only formed around the physical Sol because the conceptual Sol thinks Dream's girlfriend is pretty and wants to create a species that looks like her.

 

[Thebluedash]

But the point is a star doesn't move?

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

The character he posted as an example does. All the other Embodiments of Stars in fiction I can think of are humanoid personifications of the star, so they can move. And it's a bog standard trope in things like this that if the Embodiment dies - so does the physical star. So their existence is clearly conceptually linked.

Another example I can think of, Ishtar from Fate Grand/Order can fire the concept of Venus is an energy attack, which is Low 5-B. If she fired the "concept of the Sun", would you argue that that's not Star level?.

 

[Gwynbleiddd]

The character i gave as an example hasn't shown the ability to freely move on his own, so the way to rate him is by the energy he can emit/produce aka Multi-Continent level.

The link between the embodiment and the Star doesn't prove anything about its AP.

Sure it does. They are literally are the star. Saying that they can't be Star level is akin to saying that a human can't scale to his own body in terms of AP.

No it doesn't, they don't have the "body" of the Star which is what can we use to rate Stars Star level.Since they don't have the body of the Star then the best thing we can say about their power is that they have at their disposal the entire energy the star produces.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

@Gwyn

Pretty sure that the character you used as an example can move his own face at the very least. Even the KE of him opening his mouth is obviously > High 6-A.

>Stuff about body

This logic doesn't follow. If you are literal the conceptual embodiment of a star, and it ceases to be without you, then you being star-sized of not is rather irrelevant. You are as much an integral part of the star as its burning core. Hell, it is very likely that such a character isn't even physical in the first place, so that makes discussions about a body size even less relevant. This is akin to saying that the concept of a Planet used as an attack isn't Planet level