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- #81
Ohh, so her current strength is with the amps? Alright, so she still has AP and speed, right?
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Bull vs Dragon - Yami Sukehiro vs Stella Vermillion
- Thread starter Milly_Rocking_Bandit
- Start date
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- #83
Yami still has OP precog, accelerated development, range, stat amps and forcefields, etc.
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Precog and range is balanced out by speed. I think Stella has a forcefield in her first Ikki fight but it might just be related to Rakudai's magic mechanics.
Her speed amps are better. His don't even have a set amount for his so it hardly matters.
This fight will be over too quickly for AD to be a factor. Her bigger nuke vs his slash.
Her speed amps are better. His don't even have a set amount for his so it hardly matters.
This fight will be over too quickly for AD to be a factor. Her bigger nuke vs his slash.
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- #85
Not really, Yami's precog can sense things unpredictable and faster than him, like vs Patry.
Sure, that's fine.
Yami's AD is incredibly fast, as simply watching a fight made him stronger.
Sure, that's fine.
Yami's AD is incredibly fast, as simply watching a fight made him stronger.
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- #87
I mean, reinforcement magic+AD?
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- #88
And once more, Stella's personality is what is gonna bring her down in this fight.
A somewhat hot-blooded, reckless, impulsive, and prideful teenager, Never researches her opponent's abilities, Kalsariteo Salamandra requires a few seconds to activate, Not willing to use Bahamut Soul in one-on-one duels, destroying Lævateinn deals enough mental damage to knock her out, the flames from Empress Dress limit her field of Vision
Yami is an incredibly smart fighter, being able to pick out entire fighting styles with so much as a glance, which is made even easier with his precog. Given the fact that she is hot-blooded, reckless, impulsive, and prideful, Yami has no problems easily provoking her, something he does because he has a big mouth. Given the fact that Salamandra requires a couple seconds, Yami has more than enough time to compensate and interrupt her, or hit her with Dimension Slash before she can use it.
He possesses more experience, more tactical, range, precog, smarts, etc.
A somewhat hot-blooded, reckless, impulsive, and prideful teenager, Never researches her opponent's abilities, Kalsariteo Salamandra requires a few seconds to activate, Not willing to use Bahamut Soul in one-on-one duels, destroying Lævateinn deals enough mental damage to knock her out, the flames from Empress Dress limit her field of Vision
Yami is an incredibly smart fighter, being able to pick out entire fighting styles with so much as a glance, which is made even easier with his precog. Given the fact that she is hot-blooded, reckless, impulsive, and prideful, Yami has no problems easily provoking her, something he does because he has a big mouth. Given the fact that Salamandra requires a couple seconds, Yami has more than enough time to compensate and interrupt her, or hit her with Dimension Slash before she can use it.
He possesses more experience, more tactical, range, precog, smarts, etc.
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Accelerated Development, ya'll looking down on stella aren't ya?
They were improving each other at terrific speed just now.
They just made decades worth of progress walking a path in an instant.
In her fight against Ikki she developed ^^ this much in every clash. So in terms of reactive evol, he ain't outdoin stella.
Anyway stella Bahamut Howl nukes with more ap than he can handle i guess. If that doesn't work, she uses Katharterio Salamandra.
But @Mily
>OP Precog
Stella has a similar version of it, under the name danger sense.
>AD
Stella has a better versio
>Range
Stella has more range
>Stat amp
Stella has a better versio
>Forcefields
Stella has a better versio
Like outside of the precog you literally mentioned 4 things that stella already has and better as arguments for Yami kek.
They were improving each other at terrific speed just now.
They just made decades worth of progress walking a path in an instant.
In her fight against Ikki she developed ^^ this much in every clash. So in terms of reactive evol, he ain't outdoin stella.
Anyway stella Bahamut Howl nukes with more ap than he can handle i guess. If that doesn't work, she uses Katharterio Salamandra.
But @Mily
>OP Precog
Stella has a similar version of it, under the name danger sense.
>AD
Stella has a better versio
>Range
Stella has more range
>Stat amp
Stella has a better versio
>Forcefields
Stella has a better versio
Like outside of the precog you literally mentioned 4 things that stella already has and better as arguments for Yami kek.
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Decades worth of making progress, that's amazing. And did she actually defeat him or something? Yami completely improves during the battle and crushes his limits to go equally against opponent that was earlier destroying him (mainly that was against opponents with hundreds of years worthy experience and more physical prowess than himself, exactly like Asta).
As I have already said, her "danger sense" won't sense Space Slash, as Asta couldn't and he has exactly the same precog, and out there there were many other mages that can sense magic, still couldn't see that coming even from a damn kilometer.
As I have already said, her "danger sense" won't sense Space Slash, as Asta couldn't and he has exactly the same precog, and out there there were many other mages that can sense magic, still couldn't see that coming even from a damn kilometer.
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Well yes and no. Ikki was also making the same decades worth of progress, but she did end up beating him (until he became a desperado but oh well). And hundreds of years of experience doesn't mean much against feats. Pretty sure in terms of feats Stella is far more skilled.
That seems like a weakness to the precog. Stella's danger sense works just by seeing the opponent, she just sees him and notices whether he's a strong or a weak one. It worked on her just being watched at (which would mean getting AZ'd) from behind etc, it worked on Ikki who was gonna reflect her etc. If it worked on these i don't see a reason a slash to dimensions wouldn't just ring the danger sense.
That seems like a weakness to the precog. Stella's danger sense works just by seeing the opponent, she just sees him and notices whether he's a strong or a weak one. It worked on her just being watched at (which would mean getting AZ'd) from behind etc, it worked on Ikki who was gonna reflect her etc. If it worked on these i don't see a reason a slash to dimensions wouldn't just ring the danger sense.
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I mean, Ki in Black Clover is the same exact thing, and they can already sense strength in relation to their own, and they still counldn't even detect Dimension Slash. The thing in Black Clover that has consistently evaded supernatural detection is A, the dimension slash, and Asta (no magic).
Iirc, Stella's key comes from amps, so Yami can amp himself to at least reduce the gap. Accelerated Development not as in skill, but as in strength. Like I said, merely watching a fight made him stronger. Which doesn't get around the fact that Yami still can get into her head without any problems (sorta like another swordsman Stella lost to), comprehend her fighting style and fight accordingly, and dodge most of her attacks until she has to use her strongest.
Speaking of which, what stops her attack from being absorbed by his Black Hole (not a real one)?
Iirc, Stella's key comes from amps, so Yami can amp himself to at least reduce the gap. Accelerated Development not as in skill, but as in strength. Like I said, merely watching a fight made him stronger. Which doesn't get around the fact that Yami still can get into her head without any problems (sorta like another swordsman Stella lost to), comprehend her fighting style and fight accordingly, and dodge most of her attacks until she has to use her strongest.
Speaking of which, what stops her attack from being absorbed by his Black Hole (not a real one)?
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They don't do it via ki. It's danger sense.
Reduce the gap, but it'd still be over 2x greater. Yeah stella does get stronger and faster during fights. Stella's pretty skilled herself boyo.
Hmm, idk, is it in character?
Reduce the gap, but it'd still be over 2x greater. Yeah stella does get stronger and faster during fights. Stella's pretty skilled herself boyo.
Hmm, idk, is it in character?
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I know, I was referring to Black Clover character's doing it.
I'm aware, she is Ikki's gf, can't be useless if you wanna date the skill king.
It is in character, Yami uses it very often. It's even capable of absorbing spatial magic that can erase you.
I'm aware, she is Ikki's gf, can't be useless if you wanna date the skill king.
It is in character, Yami uses it very often. It's even capable of absorbing spatial magic that can erase you.
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Ok, but it's false equivalency was my point. Cus rakudai characters feel danger through other means, so BC not sensing danger doesn't mean Stella won't either.
Yeah, so we can debate Stella vs Yami in skill if ya want.
Hmm, there is still the question of whether he'll do it in time for Bahamut Howl.
Yeah, so we can debate Stella vs Yami in skill if ya want.
Hmm, there is still the question of whether he'll do it in time for Bahamut Howl.
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- #96
Black Clover's ki is really no different from danger sense, just Ki senses more, and it couldn't detect it.
Nah, I'm sure Stella skill stomps.
How long does it take for her to do this? Black Hole is thought-based.
Nah, I'm sure Stella skill stomps.
How long does it take for her to do this? Black Hole is thought-based.
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It is, rakudai can sense magic too. But this is completely different. One is sensing specifically just danger due to having fought hard battles before, one is sensing Ki.
Then why mention Yami's experience?
Same for Bahamut Howl, she thinks fire just yeets the place.
Same for Bahamut Howl, she thinks fire just yeets the place.
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I mean Ki sense intent, danger, feelings, emotional state, air, smell, etc.
It was a previous wincon.
So, what stops Black Hole from absorbing it, and he dimension slashes?
It was a previous wincon.
So, what stops Black Hole from absorbing it, and he dimension slashes?
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Yes, but its all through Ki. If something lacks Ki, it can't sense it. A weakness that doesn't apply to danger sense.
I mean fair enough BH will absorb it, he DS' stella dodges. Stella goes invisible or trackless steps stella uses an attack from a blind spot or just closes the gaps and yeets him in h2h combat.
I mean fair enough BH will absorb it, he DS' stella dodges. Stella goes invisible or trackless steps stella uses an attack from a blind spot or just closes the gaps and yeets him in h2h combat.
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I believe Stella sure as hell has life force lol
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Invisibility and Trackless Step is negged by Ki sensing.
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By the way, yeeting Yami in H2H combat? I'd like to see that, is she a skill lord like Ikki too?
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Not to the extent of Ikki, but she has feats like, instantly learning a move which took Yui Tatara months to learn (and yui tatara is an assasin that has trained since she was a child).
Even when trying to make mistakes she subconsciously cannot do so, even ikki states that her swordsmanship doesn't have any wasted movement (and praise for ikki ain't no average stuff in terms of skill).
Learned trackless step. etc.
Even when trying to make mistakes she subconsciously cannot do so, even ikki states that her swordsmanship doesn't have any wasted movement (and praise for ikki ain't no average stuff in terms of skill).
Learned trackless step. etc.
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Power Mimicry, is this stated that it's through sheer skill or swordsmanship? Like, Mob can do the literal same, would we call that skill?
If a swordsman is calm and good, no mistake is really made. Making no wasted movements is indeed good, but it's forte of every good swordsman in every universe.
If a swordsman is calm and good, no mistake is really made. Making no wasted movements is indeed good, but it's forte of every good swordsman in every universe.
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It's plain skill.
Yeah, but can Yami pull that off? And i specifically said "not calm". She was trying to get Ikki senpai to notice her, by trying to make wasteful movements, yet still, no waste.
Yeah, but can Yami pull that off? And i specifically said "not calm". She was trying to get Ikki senpai to notice her, by trying to make wasteful movements, yet still, no waste.
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Make no wasted movements? I don't think he has ever done something like "wasted movement", he always pulls off clean hits, parries and dodges, even having clean counters when his opponent is behind him and while his sword is broken, his precision and reflex is on point.
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A clean hit or parry doesn't mean "no wasted movement".
At first glance it might look like her swings were totally messed up, but looking carefully he could see that from her toes, to her knees and hips, her movements were completely synchronized. There weren't any useless actions at all. Stella had probably intended to mess up those swings, but because of her superhuman perception of motion, she subconsciously corrected the movements of her joints and muscles and created the most suitable form where the least energy is wasted. This was truly strength deserving of pride.
To be able to find faults with such perfect swordsmanship, was impossible for Ikki.
"As expected of Stella. Someone like me can't possibly find a fault in you."
At first glance it might look like her swings were totally messed up, but looking carefully he could see that from her toes, to her knees and hips, her movements were completely synchronized. There weren't any useless actions at all. Stella had probably intended to mess up those swings, but because of her superhuman perception of motion, she subconsciously corrected the movements of her joints and muscles and created the most suitable form where the least energy is wasted. This was truly strength deserving of pride.
To be able to find faults with such perfect swordsmanship, was impossible for Ikki.
"As expected of Stella. Someone like me can't possibly find a fault in you."
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It helps only stamina in battle, imo.
See, footwork and body movement is important, but at least for me "no wasted movement" is just keeping your stamina in check. No matter how good the body work is, there is always going to be an opening bruh, unless you have a omnidirectional shield. Yami has never really done something as actual "bad move". He uses Ki to enhance not only his reaction speed but to know how and when attack his opponent, no wasted moves doesn't mean you will always pull off good moves. He will know when to parry, he will know when to attack, he will know when to dodge. At least in my opinion, that's more useful than making no wasted movements, since it's all swordsmanship is about, and what Yami is about.
She has just Instinctive Reactions, that's probably why she can't mess shit up even when she wants to.
See, footwork and body movement is important, but at least for me "no wasted movement" is just keeping your stamina in check. No matter how good the body work is, there is always going to be an opening bruh, unless you have a omnidirectional shield. Yami has never really done something as actual "bad move". He uses Ki to enhance not only his reaction speed but to know how and when attack his opponent, no wasted moves doesn't mean you will always pull off good moves. He will know when to parry, he will know when to attack, he will know when to dodge. At least in my opinion, that's more useful than making no wasted movements, since it's all swordsmanship is about, and what Yami is about.
She has just Instinctive Reactions, that's probably why she can't mess shit up even when she wants to.
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That's just in verse doe. Of course you can make bad moves when your opponent is called Ikki. I'd like to see Yami not make any bad moves with him as an opponent.
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Did I mention Ikki though
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I did. Not making mistakes is a feat of scaling above people in your own verse. Not really a quantifiable skill feat. It's like me saying "i've never failed a math problem", it's not impressive by itself, i can be doing 1st grade level math problems, doesn't mean im better than someone who failed to solve a centry problem.
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Aight, but she has actual superhuman natural abilities that help her to fight against Ikki, her "danger sense" and instinctive reactions, blocking hits of a swordsman is not that hard as you think it is, even when your opponent is plethora more skilled than you, especially if you got that kind of abilities. I mean, his blade doesn't go intangible through her sword and tangible when it's about to reach her body or something... How do I know he didn't just swing his sword like carpet beater horizontally and vertically at her? They are still comparable physically (I guess), so is it really that big deal to just... block his sword?
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I never said any of whatever you said. What i mean is "never made a mistake" is not a quantifiable skill feat. It just means he's better than the people in his verse.
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Alright, but it was you who bring up Ikki in this argument, and I just explained some things.
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I didn't bring him up for the reasons you mentioned.
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Wait, I'm confused. You said she did go against Ikki, we all of course know who he is, and that Yami doing clean moves against guys from his own verse is not that impressive when he's up against someone from other verse, yeah?
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Depends. They can be "quantified by comparison". Example you can't say for sure how skilled "learning a move in 10 days" is, but you can say it is more impressive than "learning the same move in 20 days".
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Her going against Ikki isn't exactly a skill feat. She had every advantage known to man yet still lost.SpookyShadow said:
It was just to say "not making mistakes against people less skilled than you is not exactly impressive".
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