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Bleach Misconception Question
- Thread starter TheFinalOrder
- Start date
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- bleach
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So now you want to accept Occam's Razor? You dont get to say everything is identical to normal fodder ones based off of Urahara's prototypes when they have multiple extra functions and are explicitly made to be different and are custom built for each user.
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Since Kiki is using bleach wiki,this whole thing should be closed
Souls can leave Gigais by a variety of methods, but the fastest appears to be using a Gikongan to replace the soul within, allowing it to freely leave the Gigai; in the case of a Shinigami, this is done so they may fight at their full strength while ordering the replacement soul to keep the Gigai out of harm's way.[4] It seems leaving the Gigai without this method can be troublesome for a Shinigami.[5]
Although Iam not sure what the duck is this gigai point
Souls can leave Gigais by a variety of methods, but the fastest appears to be using a Gikongan to replace the soul within, allowing it to freely leave the Gigai; in the case of a Shinigami, this is done so they may fight at their full strength while ordering the replacement soul to keep the Gigai out of harm's way.[4] It seems leaving the Gigai without this method can be troublesome for a Shinigami.[5]
Although Iam not sure what the duck is this gigai point
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lolProfessorKukui4Life said:
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Am tired of this and I'll just call a mod, this is going nowhere.
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It doesnt because only Sennas is the unique gigai where she can freely move her soul out of it without a soul candy, a badge or any other alternate assistance. The bleach wikia even notes this. The Vizords and Isshins unique gigais are nothing like this in the slightest. Just because they can use their powers inside their gigais doesnt debunk my claim of them being bound to the gigais like a human soul would be.
They don't note "She can freely leave it" they note "It turns into leaves" This is the second time you've tried to twist wording to fit your narrative. This notion that they are talking about freely leaving is false as well.
>It seems leaving the Gigai without this method can be troublesome for a Shinigami.[5]
Since when was this applicable only to Isshin?
Since Isshin's is the only one that has his soul bound to both it and Masaki's. No one else, the only one even remotely similar is Rukia's 1st Gigai that was slowly draining her Spirit Energy and binding her soul to it to make her a normal human girl. You're argument is on the basis that all Gigai are like this, which is unfounded.
They don't note "She can freely leave it" they note "It turns into leaves" This is the second time you've tried to twist wording to fit your narrative. This notion that they are talking about freely leaving is false as well.
>It seems leaving the Gigai without this method can be troublesome for a Shinigami.[5]
Since when was this applicable only to Isshin?
Since Isshin's is the only one that has his soul bound to both it and Masaki's. No one else, the only one even remotely similar is Rukia's 1st Gigai that was slowly draining her Spirit Energy and binding her soul to it to make her a normal human girl. You're argument is on the basis that all Gigai are like this, which is unfounded.
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Fair enough. Im tired of this too and am getting a headache, so im just gonna concede to this.
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You just contradicted yourself here.
If a body is Damaged or Destroyed and Soul is included in this, the Soul Wouldn't go to SS still. If for example Shunsui decided to Kill Ichigo while he slept with his Zanpakuto, Ichigo's Soul Would go to SS (This is the current Mechanism Presented in Bleach). If a Soul is Killed, it gets reincarnated back to Earth (This has also been presented).
So, if you are going with the Logic that Zanpakuto can harm souls even within a body, if you kill said body or person, the soul is killed and thus, doesn't go to SS.
You guys are trying to give these characters abilities they have not shown to have inspite of lack of feats and inspite of logic and mechanics of the verse.
This is what I want to know. It feels like this whole system is contradictory
If a body is Damaged or Destroyed and Soul is included in this, the Soul Wouldn't go to SS still. If for example Shunsui decided to Kill Ichigo while he slept with his Zanpakuto, Ichigo's Soul Would go to SS (This is the current Mechanism Presented in Bleach). If a Soul is Killed, it gets reincarnated back to Earth (This has also been presented).
So, if you are going with the Logic that Zanpakuto can harm souls even within a body, if you kill said body or person, the soul is killed and thus, doesn't go to SS.
You guys are trying to give these characters abilities they have not shown to have inspite of lack of feats and inspite of logic and mechanics of the verse.
This is what I want to know. It feels like this whole system is contradictory
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@Zzsax ^ProfessorKukui4Life said:
EDIT: All of the deleted replies above are mine for reference. Nuking them out of this thread for dropping the argument. Dont want any further involvement in this topic. My apologies for my replies crowding up the discussion.
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- Thread starter
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Except the fact that Ginjou, Giruko and Tsukishima literaklly prove this, yet you guys refused to acknowledge it for literally no good reason.Zzsax said:
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Not really, unless you wanna ignore those three being in SS for the uptenth time.
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You keep trying to use my own point against me but no, it doesn't work like that. Those three disprove your notion and you have no proof otherwise. Come with something else.AnonymousBlank said:
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You're trying to say a Soul Killed in WoTL goes to the SS Which is not the case for anything except Hollows.Zzsax said:
- When the Flesh is Killed, The Soul Remains in that World (Facts)
- When A Soul is Killed, it reincarnates into the next world (Facts)
You're Logic essentially asserts that, If Ichigo was killed, no biggie, he'll just reapper on SS like nothing happened, which is laughable and goes against what ACTUALLY happens when Souls are killed in Bleach.
Every instance of a Soul Being killed in Bleach has resulted in it being reincarnated anew in WoTL, not SS in the same form as it had previously. Nonsense...
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Again, those three being in SS is proof that Zanpakuto doesn't harm souls. Souls Killed = Reincarnated back on Earth, not SS in the same form as previous with Memories included.LSirLancelotDuLacl said:
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Except it does prove our claim.
So far we have proved that souls get harmed by Zanpakuto even while in gigai (Hiyori and Gin). This means that when a living human get killed by a Zan, they go to SS like we've been saying. If you are so adamant that those three were not harmed and that the cycle is wrong, prove Hiyori wasn't in a gigai.
This entire argument is so dumb. The battles are between reiatsu, living humans can get reiatsu crushed by souls, ie their reiatsu interacts with another being's reiatsu the same way as 2 spirits would. Care to explain why reiatsu doesn't function the same and harm the opponents soul despite the main proponent of fights otherwise working the same and even a soul in a gigai getting harmed.
You seem to forget that Ichigo is already dead. During his Shattered Shaft training, his body and soul were separated from each other by Kisuke. Every point after that, he is inhabiting his old body which people even call dead when he isn't inside it.
So far we have proved that souls get harmed by Zanpakuto even while in gigai (Hiyori and Gin). This means that when a living human get killed by a Zan, they go to SS like we've been saying. If you are so adamant that those three were not harmed and that the cycle is wrong, prove Hiyori wasn't in a gigai.
This entire argument is so dumb. The battles are between reiatsu, living humans can get reiatsu crushed by souls, ie their reiatsu interacts with another being's reiatsu the same way as 2 spirits would. Care to explain why reiatsu doesn't function the same and harm the opponents soul despite the main proponent of fights otherwise working the same and even a soul in a gigai getting harmed.
You seem to forget that Ichigo is already dead. During his Shattered Shaft training, his body and soul were separated from each other by Kisuke. Every point after that, he is inhabiting his old body which people even call dead when he isn't inside it.
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Except it doesn't....
When a soul dies in Bleach, it doesn't go to SS, it reincarnates on earth. Thus everything else you're saying is bsseless noise that you cannot seem to get over.
The very fact their souls exist in SS in the same form as when Alive is blatant evidence you refuse to acknowledge and are trying to twist it to support your otherwise baseless claims in addition to trying to give Bleach abilities it quite clearly doesn't have.
Zanpakuto don't harm Souls in a body. If it did, Ginjou and Co would've been reincarnated on earth, not SS because as proven time and time again, WHEN SOULS DIE IN BLEACH, THEY REINCARNATE ON EARTH!
But of course you don't intend to budge from your stance no matter how faulty, so whatever. My question has been quite clearly answered by all of your responses. A blatant disregard for and the twisting of the facts, supported by evidence in an attempt to wank.
When a soul dies in Bleach, it doesn't go to SS, it reincarnates on earth. Thus everything else you're saying is bsseless noise that you cannot seem to get over.
The very fact their souls exist in SS in the same form as when Alive is blatant evidence you refuse to acknowledge and are trying to twist it to support your otherwise baseless claims in addition to trying to give Bleach abilities it quite clearly doesn't have.
Zanpakuto don't harm Souls in a body. If it did, Ginjou and Co would've been reincarnated on earth, not SS because as proven time and time again, WHEN SOULS DIE IN BLEACH, THEY REINCARNATE ON EARTH!
But of course you don't intend to budge from your stance no matter how faulty, so whatever. My question has been quite clearly answered by all of your responses. A blatant disregard for and the twisting of the facts, supported by evidence in an attempt to wank.
- Can you give me a single Instance of a Soul Being killed and reincarnating on SS? No, because no such thing exist.
- You'll try to use Ginjou, Giruko and Tsukishima as proof, but then again, you don't have proof Zanpakuto Harm Souls in Bodies and this notion is further debunked by the first bullet point.
- Desperate, you'll try to use Hiyori as a counter saying "She's in a gigai", but then the first 2 bullets debunk that notion and lines with the fact, Gigai can be taken off, which is more than possible here.
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Except they were alive and died on earth, thus they go to the next world as is the established cycle.
You keep saying I ignore stuff but I address everything you bring up while you refuse to afford me the same courtesy. You have yet to address Hiyori getting split in half and about to die if not for Unohana despite being in a gigai, gigai being built to function like a human body as it has been shown to do. Also baseless? Its like you aren't even reading any of the answers you receive. Why even ask the question when you ignore those given by the people who know about Bleach?
You keep claiming they would reincarnate on earth but you have yet to show a single example of such occuring.
Why would I budge when I am correct? Yes your question has been answered, you simply refuse to accept said answers.
Are you daft? Reincarnate is to be reborn in another body. They are in new bodies made of completely different matter in a completely different dimension.
You keep saying I ignore stuff but I address everything you bring up while you refuse to afford me the same courtesy. You have yet to address Hiyori getting split in half and about to die if not for Unohana despite being in a gigai, gigai being built to function like a human body as it has been shown to do. Also baseless? Its like you aren't even reading any of the answers you receive. Why even ask the question when you ignore those given by the people who know about Bleach?
You keep claiming they would reincarnate on earth but you have yet to show a single example of such occuring.
Why would I budge when I am correct? Yes your question has been answered, you simply refuse to accept said answers.
- I can and have, you just say "nuh uh, I don't believe it"
- Yes I will use them as they are perfect examples of my point
- You don't understand how a timeline or Occam's Razor works do you?
Are you daft? Reincarnate is to be reborn in another body. They are in new bodies made of completely different matter in a completely different dimension.
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only souls that are in soul society go to earth when they die , souls dying on earth go to soul society , it's not hard to understandTheFinalOrder said:
https://www.***********.net/bleach/46/3
so the fact that ginjo and co are in SS mean that their soul died and were sent to SS because of a zanpakuto ,end of story
when SS spirit ginjo and co will die , they will reincarnate to earth as completly different entities , not even garanteed to be humans .
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- Thread starter
- #102
Could've saved everyone a lot of trouble.Naeblis495 said:
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just the fact that rukia could affect ichigo's soul by giving him power at the start of the serie is proof enough that zanpakuto can affect souls inside a body without a doubt .
so yes , zanpakuto can damage souls inside a body and send them to SS/Hell depending the victim's crimes but if they want to "kill" them ( via reincarnation transforming them into different beings entirely) they will have to kill the soul that have been sent to SS/Hell a second time
that's why vizards even tho they are in gigai are still in danger as they are originally still souls from SS( so souls from the living world that passed to SS) inside fake bodies , if their souls die , they will reincarnate completely on earth effectively killing them.
the fact that ginjo and co were in SS instead of being wandering souls on earth waiting for the Konso ceremony to be performed is because they were killed by a zanpakuto , essentially purifying them the hard way instead of peacefully(via konso)
hollow and quincies can straight up eat/destroy the soul entirely( seen with yammi's gonzui that ripped souls of hundred of human right out of their bodies just by sucking the air).
so yes , zanpakuto can damage souls inside a body and send them to SS/Hell depending the victim's crimes but if they want to "kill" them ( via reincarnation transforming them into different beings entirely) they will have to kill the soul that have been sent to SS/Hell a second time
that's why vizards even tho they are in gigai are still in danger as they are originally still souls from SS( so souls from the living world that passed to SS) inside fake bodies , if their souls die , they will reincarnate completely on earth effectively killing them.
the fact that ginjo and co were in SS instead of being wandering souls on earth waiting for the Konso ceremony to be performed is because they were killed by a zanpakuto , essentially purifying them the hard way instead of peacefully(via konso)
hollow and quincies can straight up eat/destroy the soul entirely( seen with yammi's gonzui that ripped souls of hundred of human right out of their bodies just by sucking the air).
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only souls that are in soul society go to earth when they die , souls dying on earth go to soul society , it's not hard to understand
https://www.***********.net/bleach/46/3
so the fact that ginjo and co are in SS mean that their soul died and were sent to SS because of a zanpakuto ,end of story
when SS spirit ginjo and co will die , they will reincarnate to earth as completly different entities , not even garanteed to be humans .
Could've saved everyone a lot of trouble.
you where the only one going through all the trouble, This is bleach Basics, The question asked was answered in the first 5 post and that same answer was restructured in dozens of different wordings by several users .But you seemed to have being going through a phase of denial.
https://www.***********.net/bleach/46/3
so the fact that ginjo and co are in SS mean that their soul died and were sent to SS because of a zanpakuto ,end of story
when SS spirit ginjo and co will die , they will reincarnate to earth as completly different entities , not even garanteed to be humans .
Could've saved everyone a lot of trouble.
you where the only one going through all the trouble, This is bleach Basics, The question asked was answered in the first 5 post and that same answer was restructured in dozens of different wordings by several users .But you seemed to have being going through a phase of denial.
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What in the world did I just read...
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just to be sure , on what side of the argument are you on ?Sigurd Snake in The Eye said:
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Sigurd is pro Bleach 24/7.Naeblis495 said:
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being pro bleach doesn't mean we want to be inacurate.
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If anything we would want to make sure everything is accurate
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so , does the op still have a problem with zanpakuto damaging souls inside bodies or can this be closed ?
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Pretty sure my response to your linked post is straight forward. Can't argue with what was stated there. Can be closed.Naeblis495 said:
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sorry , i'm no native english speaker so i try to have the clearest answer possible and i wasn't sure here.TheFinalOrder said:
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Pretty sure my response to your linked post is straight forward. Can't argue with what was stated there. Can be closed.
sorry , i'm no native english speaker so i try to have the clearest answer possible and i wasn't sure here.
No problem.
sorry , i'm no native english speaker so i try to have the clearest answer possible and i wasn't sure here.
No problem.
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