Bleach God Tiers for real this time

[Arc7Kuroi]

Bleach Cosmos and God Tiers [Outdated]

docs.google.com

Arc7Kuroi/Sandox BleachGodTiers

vsbattles.fandom.com

Both of the above should be the same thing (the google doc might be more up to date than the sandbox). The images may be hard to see on the google doc and if you don't want to click control+ then the images should be clearer in the sandbox.

It's a lot and I want to preface one thing: Muken's size is not at all pertinent to my scaling, I originally included it because it was, but it turned out that none of the ratings I derived come from Muken. I kept it in the doc for ***** and giggles, but it turns out to be a supporting feat at best. So I'd appreciate it if the discussion on Muken's size take the least amount of precedence among everything else in the doc.

I'll say it again, none of the God Tiers in my doc get their scaling from Muken. I say this so I don't get people coming in like "Muken can't be infinite therefore I'm not gonna read anything else".

Have at it peoples.

Current Progress:

• Destroying the Garganta + Dangai + the Three Realms of Existence + Everything Connected = At least 3-A, possibly Low 2-C.
• Almighty Yhwach (and his stronger forms), TS Merged Hollow Ichigo (and his stronger forms), EoS Aizen, Soul King, and Orihime’s shields scale.

Shoutout to this post: https://vsbattles.com/threads/bleach-god-tiers-for-real-this-time.110861/post-3493449

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

At least Low 2-C to 2-C Bleach? HOO BOY, now this is gonna be fun to see

 

[00potato]

I mean the HST isn’t allowed to be this strong ok?

 

[Nerd1435]

 

[Ped2018]

Low 2-C Bleach?? Lets ******* gooooooooooo​

On a serious note, this looks pretty good, but i don't know Bleach enough to tell if it's wrong or not

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Im staying out of this for now until I analyze that google doc thoroughly.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

I appreciate the willingness to thoroughly analyze it! After putting months into this, that's all I ask lol.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

One thing I ask though is do you have another way of posting those scans? Its as you said, they are hard to see in the google doc.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

I already addressed the sound thing a thousand times already, the text doesn't make it infinite at all.

Stuff like names being taken literally is also extremely silly when names just representing what something is isn't evidence for size or anything.

Nothing implies Soul Society is universal in size this is all just extreme extrapolation from unrelated scans.

 

[Ehnkr2beboh]

I don't even really like the idea of Bleach being this high, but it seems extremely consistent. I'm a very casual fan so I'll wait until potential counter arguments until making a final stance, but at the moment I'd say I agree.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

One thing I ask though is do you have another way of posting those scans? Its as you said, they are hard to see in the google doc.

Can you not see them in the sandbox?

 

[StrymULTRA]

Boi this will be good

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Can you not see them in the sandbox?

Oh my bad, I kinda just went straight to the google doc. I'll check the sandbox then.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

I don't even really like the idea of Bleach being this high, but it seems extremely consistent. I'm a very casual fan so I'll wait until potential counter arguments until making a final stance, but at the moment I'd say I agree.

There's no evidence of universal in the Google Docs actually it's all circunstancial.

 

[Ehnkr2beboh]

Even in the blog a lot of the scans are pretty small and hard to read.

 

[Rikimarox2]

2-C Ichigo

Tfw Ichigo might be able to stomp all of DBS...

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

The biggest argument is that Muken can be translated to be "an infinite hell" and there was a whole thread where this was agreed to be metaphorical and not literal.

Also one scan that says that the three realms are "like planets".

The Realm of the Living is literally Earth. The Novels are very clear when they recount the Creation Myth that the Soul King isn't responsible for creating the universe.

 

[Ped2018]

Even in the blog a lot of the scans are pretty small and hard to read.

Can't you just click in the image to make them bigger?

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Even in the blog a lot of the scans are pretty small and hard to read.

Go to the sandbox to see the images better as I am.

 

[Damage3245]

The Realm of the Living is literally Earth. The Novels are very clear when they recount the Creation Myth that the Soul King isn't responsible for creating the universe.

One thing I would like for sure is more proof that "Realm of the Living" refers to the entire observable Universe.

Prior to this I've always taken that term to just be another word for the Earth.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Also the blog lies about translations. "その音の如く無限に等しき広さを持つ” does not mean "“Like the sound of its name suggests, it holds an equivalent size to infinity". This is selective translation meant to pretend something is not.

It's actually either saying that the sound is infinite or that it is "infinitely similar" to the sound.

 

[DTG499]

Oh jeeez.

 

[Ehnkr2beboh]

Can't you just click in the image to make them bigger?

Go to the sandbox to see the images better as I am.

While they are bigger in the blog/sandbox, most of them still look like this on my screen and are hard to read.

 

[DTG499]

I’ll agree to this on one condition. Get rid of soul crush.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Also doing stuff like

"This guy named all phenomena, this unrelated thing not ever referenced among the phenomena should count among the phenomena so it scales" is pure headcanon and not valid.

As is arguing that Soul Society has galaxies in it because... Characters know that the concept of galaxies exist? This is not how you argue cosmology this is just "I must connect the dots".

You are starting with the conclusion and desperately trying to find any shred of evidence to support it.

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

This going to be something else

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Also I love this part:

• Garganta (黒腔) translates to “black cavity” or “void” and the Garganta is a void of reishi and darkness that encompasses everything in Bleach.
• Dangai (断界) translates to “severance world” and as noted by Isshin, Dangai is a timespace separated or “severed” from the WotL and SS.
• Seireitei (瀞霊廷) translates to “imperial spirit court” or “spirit government” which is exactly what the Seireitei is.

... As if the only possible interpretation of the name Muken is that it is literally physically infinite in size when the whole point is that it's empty darkness. This is the World of Void deception but done again.

 

[TOAAPRESENCE1]

Also gonna call imade since he is the bleach lore master

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

I already addressed the sound thing a thousand times already, the text doesn't make it infinite at all.

You used google translate... but Muken doesn't affect how I scale the god tiers so I don't care to discuss Muken with you.

Stuff like names being taken literally is also extremely silly when names just representing what something is isn't evidence for size or anything.

I assume this is related to Muken? If so I'll debate you more on that after the more important stuff is discussed.

Nothing implies Soul Society is universal in size this is all just extreme extrapolation from unrelated scans.

Can you provide evidence of such?

There's no evidence of universal in the Google Docs actually it's all circunstancial.

I disagree but I'll wait for your counter-evidence.

Even in the blog a lot of the scans are pretty small and hard to read.

I will work on making them more accessible.

The biggest argument is that Muken can be translated to be "an infinite hell" and there was a whole thread where this was agreed to be metaphorical and not literal.

The thread was prematurely closed.

Also one scan that says that the three realms are "like planets".

The Realm of the Living is literally Earth. The Novels are very clear when they recount the Creation Myth that the Soul King isn't responsible for creating the universe.

Can you provide evidence of such? I've provided numerous pieces of evidence to state the opposite within the doc.

It's actually either saying that the sound is infinite or that it is "infinitely similar" to the sound.

Literally comes from google translate, but as the OP suggests I'd rather discuss Muken last.

While they are bigger in the blog/sandbox, most of them still look like this on my screen and are hard to read.

I can see that clearly, but I'll compose a blog that's just all the scans but bigger.

As is arguing that Soul Society has galaxies in it because... Characters know that the concept of galaxies exist? This is not how you argue cosmology this is just "I must connect the dots".

It's a piece of supporting evidence to back up the claim that the realms are universal in size. Can you provide evidence to say the contrary?

... As if the only possible interpretation of the name Muken is that it is literally physically infinite in size when the whole point is that it's empty darkness. This is the World of Void deception but done again.

Uhhhhhhh Muken for last please, it's not relevant to my scaling.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Also using stuff like scenes where a guy in Ichigo's classroom says "Oh infinite universe" is not valid argumentation to say the World of the Living is infinite in size holy shit. This is a completely unrelated scene where the concept is never being addressed. The universe being infinite isn't even processed in real life accurately.

Actually, here's the thing:

Show me a single scan where a character says directly that the Living World or Soul Society is infinite in size / the size of a universe.

I'll believe you if you can do it.

 

[Ehnkr2beboh]

I will work on making them more accessible.

Thanks!

And yeah, there's a lot of talk about Muken for a thread that explicitly says it's not a major focus.

 

[Yar_R_agi_7k]

Also I love this part:

• Garganta (黒腔) translates to “black cavity” or “void” and the Garganta is a void of reishi and darkness that encompasses everything in Bleach.
• Dangai (断界) translates to “severance world” and as noted by Isshin, Dangai is a timespace separated or “severed” from the WotL and SS.
• Seireitei (瀞霊廷) translates to “imperial spirit court” or “spirit government” which is exactly what the Seireitei is.

... As if the only possible interpretation of the name Muken is that it is literally physically infinite in size when the whole point is that it's empty darkness. This is the World of Void deception but done again.

If I put a few novel scans here, can you prove them wrong,some will be from real translation

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

You used google translate... but Muken doesn't affect how I scale the god tiers so I don't care to discuss Muken with you.

Used the same software as you.

Muken is your entire argument and it's based on a lie.

Can you provide evidence of such?

Can you provide evidence of such?

I am addressing in my posts often in the same posts you are quoting you're just avoiding to quote the actual arguments.

The thread was prematurely closed.

Because everybody disagreed.

Can you provide evidence of such? I've provided numerous pieces of evidence to state the opposite within the doc.

The novel literally makes it clear that "all of existence" already existed before the Soul King came to be and the worlds were created. Every being lived in one realm and after the Soul King three realms were created within existence to separate the souls.

Soul Society is literally depicted as a planet in the movie too and the Living World is always clearly referring to Earth. All the "Evidence" you have consists of entirely unrelated scans not talking about the Living World where people randomly mention things like stars or galaxies or use the word "universe". Show me a single scan wher someone outright says that the Living World is the universe.

It's a piece of supporting evidence to back up the claim that the realms are universal in size. Can you provide evidence to say the contrary?

I already provided. This is not supporting evidence this is unrelated stuff presented as evidence and it's like your main argument.

Uhhhhhhh Muken for last please, it's not relevant to my scaling.

You literally start with Muken to argue Soul Society is infinite in size.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Also using stuff like scenes where a guy in Ichigo's classroom says "Oh infinite universe" is not valid argumentation to say the World of the Living is infinite in size holy shit

My claim is that the realms are universal not infinite. Also, if you read my doc I acknowledge that that panel is not proof that the WotL is infinite, but rather it is possible that it reflects Kubo's own beliefs. It is a piece of supporting evidence for universal sized realms. Please don't take my arguments out of context.

Actually, here's the thing:

Show me a single scan where a character says directly that the Living World or Soul Society is infinite in size / the size of a universe.

I'll believe you if you can do it.

Well like in most fiction, the author isn't obligated to tell you everything at an elementary level. For example, using this argument I could say "show me a single scan where it says character x is exactly this strong" and a lot of times there won't exist such a statement. Which is why I compiled a plethora of evidence to support a claim I believe to be the most likely interpretation of the Bleach cosmos.

 

[DTG499]

Not like this is going to change much because the only people who can resist soul crush are the same people who hax stomp all of bleach.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

The one thing im going to put on the table and get out the way right now is arguments using the whole "Buddasm inspired", Art, and poem points.

When have we ever upgraded verses that are inspired by a certain real life idea? Or from art or poems?

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Muken is your entire argument and it's based on a lie.

Ok you didn't thoroughly read my doc, because if so you'd know that I scale the God Tiers off of the Realms being separate universal space times and/or the Garganta having a statement for infinite size.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Also how is a random scene where Ichigo talks about how much he loves his mom and says that she was "the center of our universe" is valid for proving that the Realm of the Living is universal.

Or a random unrelated poem that mentions "grabbing the moon and mars"?

Or a literal title card saying "Tattoo in the sky"?

This all doesn't prove anything.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

@Matthew_Schroeder stop shotgunning me, let me respond to all your points before posting again jesus.

 

[Damage3245]

I have to agree with Matthew and ProfessorKukui on some of those points at least. ^

A lot of the circumstanial evidence presented is not a solid foundation to work from.