Bleach Bankai General Discussion Thread 23

[USklaverei]

thanks

 

[Ovy7]

No problem!

 

[LordWhis]

I don't think so, I think it would only be for Full Hollow Ichigo, Dangai Ichigo, Hogyoku Aizen, True Shikai Ichigo and a few others.

It should scale to Starrk and Yammy and from them to most of the captains.

I've heard one of the novels basically confirms that Unohana was >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> VL Ichiho ?

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Lanza scales to only Ulquiorra, Zangetsu, Dangai Ichigo and Hogyoku Aizen.

Ulquiorra's Cero Oscuras scales to Espada 3-0 though.

Resurreccion Cero is 10 times lower than Cero Oscuras and scales to the Resurreccion Cero of Espada 3-0.


The novel has an unconfirmed and untranslated portion that apparently scales Cien to Zangetsu, but we need the Kanji and to translate it before discussing it.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

So will they scale to the Lanza and cero all around, or only with said attack?

 

[LordWhis]

It should scale to Base Aizen too shouldn't it since he was stronger than his espada ?

Also since Aizen knew about Ulq's 2nd release he was ranked correctly. Even if he wasn't I HIGHLY doubt he was stronger than Starrk- Starrk was the perfect Espada.

Aizen built Wonderweiss to take on Yama because he obviously knew Ulq wasn't up to the job so he scales too.

Isshin, Yoruichi and Urahara should somewhat scale too.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

Didnt ulq say that not even Aizen know about his release?

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Espada 3-0 scale to Resurreccion Cero that is 10 times lower than Cero Oscuras. That is their casual power level.

Espada 3-0 scale to Cero Oscuras when using Cero Oscuras as their's should be stronger than Resurreccion Ulquiorra's Cero Oscuras.

Espada 3-0 will likely not scale to Lanza due to it not being known about and a Stage that was not taken into account for the Espada scaling. However, this is up for debate because Aizen does hint that he knows about Segunda Etapa. So when the Lanza calc is done, we will have a CRT to discuss that.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

Why do we scale it to their casual power if it's only a certain technique that's showcased that kind of power?

 

[Ovy7]

Because their casual power is 10x lower than said technique.

Cero Oscuras is 10x the power of a normal Cero, acording to the databook.

Edit: Their Key should basically be: Low 6-B, 6-B with Cero Oscuras

Low 6-B being their casual power.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

Yeah, but why do we scale their normal power to a cero?

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

That's like saying why would we scale Naruto's normal power to a Rasengan.

You understand now.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

That's like saying why would we scale Naruto's normal power to a Rasengan.

You understand now.

We dont scale his regular AP and Durability to his Rasengan. Look at his Part 1 profile.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

Also according to the Bleach wiki (not sure how accurate it is) it says the ceros power varies on the user. So scaling it across the board for people who can use it is inaccurate.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

That's like saying why would we scale Naruto's normal power to a Rasengan.

You understand now.

We dont scale his regular AP and Durability to his Rasengan. Look at his Part 1 profile.

Now look at his other profiles for Teenage and Adult years. His AP scales from Rasengan and Bijuudama.

>Also according to the Bleach wiki (not sure how accurate it is) it says the ceros power varies on the user.

It's not.

>So scaling it across the board for people who can use it is inaccurate.

Maybe that's why I said it only scales for Espada 3-0.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

Naruto scale to his bijuudama, not Rasengan. Since he has been shown to tank it in multiple occasions and hurt people who can also tank it, its logical to scale that way. Has anyone in Bleach tanked a ceeo?

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Obviously or we wouldn't be discussing Cero in the scaling.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

Also for the Rasengan justification, he tanked the explosion of both his rasengan and sasukes chidori, so its evidence for scailing. Though I'm not sure why that's the justification for it.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

I'm not sure to understand how cero and power works Itachi. I'll break it down for you.

Cero is a standard attack for a hollow, the calc is for Ulquiorra's cero who is Espada number 4.

0-3 > 4 So they scale, it's that simple.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

I'm not sure to understand how cero and power works Itachi. I'll break it down for you.

Cero is a standard attack for a hollow, the calc is for Ulquiorra's cero who is Espada number 4.

0-3 > 4 So they scale, it's that simple.

I can understand if they scale with just cero, but i dont understand why you are trting to scale it to their physical stats as well.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

Because it's their own energy lol.

 

[USklaverei]

Do I need to get scans from Hierro's description, where they put their Reiryoku to strengthen their skin?

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

Because it's their own energy lol.

So? They also have to charge it up as well for it to have that destructive power.

 

[Damage3245]

Wrath of Itachi appears to be right here. I don't see how a charged energy beam can be comparable to their ordinary physical strikes.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

Charge what up??? You literally just extend your arm out and shoot. Even if it does need to be charged would you also argue Gogeta doesn't scale to his own Big Bang Kamehameha?

 

[Damage3245]

@Siguard; well, I'm pretty sure charged energy attacks in DBZ are superior to their ordinary physical strikes.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

Charge what up??? You literally just extend your arm out and shoot. Even if it does need to be charged would you also argue Gogeta doesn't scale to his own Big Bang Kamehameha?

My knowledge on DBZ is kinda.hazy, but im pretty sure characters have feats of tanking said attacks, which doesnt seem to be the case for bleach. If you can provide a scan of someone tanking or surviving a cero, ill agree to scailing it to them.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Bijuudama has to charge too, but it scales to ratings for the same reason Cero will:

>Naruto scale to his bijuudama, not Rasengan. Since he has been shown to tank it in multiple occasions and hurt people who can also tank it, its logical to scale that way. Has anyone in Bleach tanked a ceeo?

Just change the wording and it's the same for Bleach.

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

Ichigo's Getsuga Tenshou is also basically a Cero when Hollowfied, Ichigo also survived a Cero from Ulquiorra in their first batte. There's a lot of Cero tanking in the Arc

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

That's true, but Naruto has also tanked a charged up bijuudama as well, and so have the other Biju, which doesnt seem to be the case for Bleach.

 

[Damage3245]

@IMade; the charged Bijuudama's don't scale to their striking strength.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

That is the case for Bleach

 

[HST_Master]

Also according to the Bleach wiki (not sure how accurate it is) it says the ceros power varies on the user. So scaling it across the board for people who can use it is inaccurate.

It wouldn't scale to everyone that can use Cero, less we'd have Low 6-B Fishbone D. It'd scale to those that are above Ulq, as he used it in his Initial Released State, so it's easier to scale from. Lanza would only scale to FH Ichigo/Dangai Ichigo, Hog Aizen and FH/Merged Zangetsu.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

This ridiculous Ôÿá´©Å

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

@IMade; the charged Bijuudama's don't scale to their striking strength.

The small Country class striking is entirely based off a Charged Bijuudama.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

The Naruto series is currently going through a huge revision. The AP and LS will be delt with once the Speed thread is concluded.

 

[Damage3245]

The small Country class striking is entirely based off a Charged Bijuudama.

I fixed that for a couple of the profiles, but I believe someone undid it for the Naruto Uzumaki profile which I'll have to fix soon.

 

[AstralKing7]

Isn't this about physicals and durability?

If espada 4 to 0 can put the same amount of energy in a punch then why in the heck would they even use the energy attack which would take more time to charge and more energy?

Also the comparison with Naruto is unneeded on a bleach thread tbh.

Scaling one of the strongest energy attacks to a character physicals without any direct statements or a solid feat is jsut wrong.

Btw I guarantee Gogetta would not tank a Big Bang Kamehameha and be alright.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

Anyways, their striking would scale to Cero and sometimes even above Cero since we have instances of Physical > Cero.

Durability is fine thanks to all the tanking of Cero and such in the arc.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

The Naruto series is currently going through a huge revision. The AP and LS will be delt with once the Speed thread is concluded.

Where?