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Blazblue tiering revisions

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Theglassman12

Theglassman12

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Now with the abilities done and out of the way for the time being, let's get down to the nitty gritty. So for starters, we had a "mountain busting" feat that we couldn't calc for the reasons being that we didn't get a good money shot of the mountain itself, and that the mountain is capable of holding a literal desert and an ocean on the higher levels, which is impossibly for any mountain to do. So we decided to give it a lowball by calcing the destruction of the Olympus Mons, the biggest mountain in the solar system and we got a much higher result than we expected. Now some of you might be thinking that this will lead to a bunch of upgrades in tiers right? Well.............. no. In fact it's the opposite. The result is much higher than a feat that was done with a stronger being in the Blazblue verse. Which makes that mountain busting feat an outlier, and everyone's 7-A tiers is from said mountain busting feat, which was put there as a huge lowball. So what it comes down to is we're ditching 7-A's for the tiering and reverting the character levels back to Low 7-B or even lower depending if they're in Remix Heart.

Now as for some other potential changes, there's a feat in Xblaze where the Black Beast in there was capable of creating a storm given how the picture looks here. So this might upgrade everyone in Xblaze from 7-C to 7-B or Low 7-B depending on which end of the storm calc is accepted here.

Next will be the Low 7-C tiers, now this feat is from Cypher being able to shake the mountain, and going off from the richter scale chart here, it might give out a 7-C or High 7-C upgrade to the Remix Heart cast.

And lastly but certainly not least. Ragna's true Blazblue key is going to be upgraded to 2-A. Originally we didn't find the evidence on his physical tier since we barely got to see much of True Blazblue Ragna, but here Terumi mentions how with the azure he can become a being that exceeds Amaterasu and that Amaterasu or Takamagahara won't be able to intervene on him anymore. Further backed up by Ragna using said azure to create the realities to where Amaterasu or Takamagahara won't intervene on it anymore.

So to summarize the changes:

1. 7-A tier will be rejected and everyone in CT/CS will go back to Low 7-B.

2. Low 7-C tiers will be upgraded given the closer look on what the earthquake was capable of damaging in Remix Heart.

3. 7-C Xblaze will be 7-B thanks to the Black Beast storm feat.

4. Ragna's final key will be flat out 2-A.
 
the high end isn't what was accepted tho. That's from Perpetual's calc, which seems to be wrong given the input Bambu gave. The low end was what's accepted.
 
I was about to make a topic about massive Blazblue upgrade and then i saw this topic, now i wonder if i should make a new topic or disscuss it here
 
I have a few issues regarding the Cipher calc. First off, it uses Olympus Mons, the volcano, instead of a city the same size. He even goes as far as to measure the crater on top of it and remove it from it's overall size. This means less hollowness, and the material used is stone, not steel. Secondly, it measures the force needed to destroy it even though it's an earthquake feat. Cipher wasn't trying to destroy the City, he was trying to kill everyone in it. And while that can be acompliclished by destroying it, the calc assumed he did it in an instant instead of over time.
 
The teacher mentioned that Torifune was going to be destroyed and there wasn't any indication that it was going to happen over a long period of time, especially given how it was going to make Burning Red in like a short timeframe

Not only that but the entire mountain of Torifune was going to be destroyed, not just the city.
 
Correction: she says it's going to collapse. That means all he has to do is destroy the lower levels and set off a chain reaction bringing the rest of the city/mountain down. That'd require a less powerfull earthquake and would just be easier overall.

Also you didn't really debunk my first point. Even if he destroyed the whole thing the hollowness and materials in the calc are still wrong.
 
How would it require a less powerful earthquake tho? Cause the lower levels that he was in was deep underground and would have to travel far and wide to collapse the entire mountain.

I wasn't even focusing on that point to begin with. You can ask Bambu on how he did that calc if you find issues with it since he himself made it.
 
Can't really fault you for not focusing on those aspects when you didn't make the calc. That being said the calc was never accepted by anyone. You can't just say it's an outlier unless people agree the calc is legit. For what we know the feat could be lower and we just got a wrong value.

As for Torifune's collapse, i will admit i did not know about the underground levels. Can you please offer a source for that. Not doubting you, just curious.
 
Thanks. I'll look into it myself later but for now i don't have anything against the the earthquake destroying all of Torifune.

That being said, the calc itself still hasn't been approved by anyone so it's too soon to call it an outlier. I have no issues with the Xblaze and True Blazblue upgrades but i can't agree with the Remix Heart stuff.
 
Why not? The Low 7-C tiers are from the earthquake shaking Torifune feat to begin with, not the actual destruction of Torifune.
 
the final key for ragna i agree and the tier 7 changes seem to be fine as well
 
I'm mostly fine with it though I want to add additional tiering changes to the table after the tournament I participated in is over.
 
How about we won't use that 6-B calc as Torifune busting feat? We forcibly make unquantifiable feat quantifiable and doesn't use much safer option of just using the baseline.
 
Actually, if we just drop the calc and just take it as a baseline feat, this shouldn't be an outlier anymore. 7-A should be fine.

Not to mention upon more research, Torifune is really inconsistent in terms of size. It's still far smaller than Indonesia and the picture explaining it is only has 10 cloud layers. That 6-B calc is just us forcing to make something quantifiable.
 
I suppose that this seems to probably be fine.

You should ask the experienced members listed in the BlazBlue verse page to comment here though.
 
Mostly agree with the proposed changes.

And I definitely agree that Torifune is widely inconsistent in regards to size.
 
Are there any staff members that you can ask?
 
I doubt we need em since the supporters who knows the verse mostly agreed but okay.

Aside from obvious replacement for 7-A for Low 7-B, we agreed that we drop the earthquake feat too and go back to baseline 8-C as it was before.

RH Mai tho should have different tier. It should be:

8-C normally. High 8-C with Pure Grimoire

She fought Cypher who drained 8 people that are comparable to Jin so I multiplied it by 8 and it was 2 tons which is the baseline High 8-C.

As for 7-B, I'm okay with turning all 7-C people to 7-B, except for Es. Es was overwhelmed by Freaks before she used Phantom Grymoire to debuff his power greatly. Though I don't know if this scales to her AP, but she also delivered the finishing blow so, I think At least Low 7-B, possibly 7-B should be fine.

There should be two XBlaze characters that should get Lost Memories key. Those being Kuon and Mei. They fought damaged weakened Freaks after he got weakened by Phantom Grymoire. Els should get the tier as well but we just remove the 8-B and replace it with new tier because she completely lacks any feat at Code Embryo and thus the profile should focus on Lost Memories instead where she has feats, at least barely. They should be Low 7-B as well.

Agree or not?
 
Also we talked about Nine and Relius being Low 5-B physically. 2-A with prep.

Nine is fairly simple. She created Requiem who has PI that can destroy universes.

Relius has various times when he said that he is able to make the likes of Izanami, Amaterasu and Noel completely obsolete with his plan, creating a new universe with him being the creator, not the Gods like Amaterasu.
 
Sugesstion, Izanami, Nine and Mu should be full 2A, not just with hax and prep time, because Izanami manage to damage the Amaterasu unit in CS (mistranslation made it sounds like she's destroy it though) and manage to fight the master unit in the boundary while using phenomena intervention to made the world become more agressive only seem to be a bit tired according to Hazama in CP, Nine manage to kill Takamagahara in CP and Mu for having the capability to destroy even the master unit which makes Terumi ordering her to kill the master unit in CS
 
Izanami was trying to accomplish it by Doomsday, it's Hax.

Izanami is fighting her with PI in CP, that's also with Hax.

She meant is to destroy the system, not the entirety of Takamagahara. As proof, Takamagahara was completely intact in CF. Takamagahara isn't affected by time loop in CF.

It's more of killing Saya than Master Unit. Noel and other Murakumo can kill Saya because they are the same person. Plus there are many durability negation within her arsenal.
 
Nine didn't destroy Takamagahara, they were completely intact in CF as shown in Amane's arcade mode. Also Izanami being full on 2-A contradicts her statement of holding off a bomb physically that would atomize the planet and the moon. Mu can kill the Master Unit cause she's the closest to the perfect clone for Amaterasu, they explain this in CF on top of her Successor to the Azure on how she of all people is capable of killing Amaterasu despite numerous other characters in BB being stronger than her.
 
Takamagahara has been destroy by Nine, but they get restored by Amane in his Arcade act2 and Izanami probably says it as a sarcasm or mockery toward Ragna gang which is pretty in character thing for her to do since she's always mock all of the cast, there's also Takemikazuchi almost destroying the Amaterasu unit at the climax of CP Screenshoots for proof: Amane rebooting Takamagahara: https://gyazo.com/ceab2f7a60ca17d5c58860c741f1de57 Takemikazuchi attacking master unit https://gyazo.com/2373fb45a926ac996856d75a9583d29d
 
Rebooting doesn't mean he rebuilt Takamagahara.

There's little to no reason to assume she's mocking them as that's never been part of her character unlike Terumi.

The same giant that couldn't scratch the master unit. And again, Nine herself even said that Noel is the only person who's capable of killing Amaterasu due to her powers, the same girl who invented Take Mikazuchi doubt that any of her stuff is capable of killing Amaterasu.
 
Nah mockery is pretty in character for her since when she's fight Ragna, she always say "Saya is happy", "Brother let's play", "Saya will stay with you", she's also fight the other with condescending and mocking tone, she's called Takemikazuchi a filthy Giant instead of it's name, in the beginning of CP she's even mockingly pretend to be Saya just to piss Ragna off and in gag reel (although is not canon it still has some element from the canon plot) she's mock Jin on every chance she's got even till the end of the gag reel As for Takemikazuchi, it still would be a pretty nonsensical for Izanami to order it to shoot the master unit if the master unit just tank it, the reason why master unit is safe is because Rachel deploy the Tsukuyomi unit in time to block the laser and Tsukuyomi is the absolute defense in BB and it was never state how much it can tank, but it can protected someone from even the 2A influence of the boundary
 
You mean the time she tried to convince Ragna to join her? Or when the actual Saya was waking up a bit to try to speak to Ragna to ask him for help.

Gag reels aren't canon.

The thing that Nine herself invented, she even stated that nothing she had would be able to kill Amaterasu. Izanami barely knows much about Take Mikazuchi aside from it being a NN.
 
Take-Mikazuchi capable of killing Amaterasu is huge outlier. So Susano'o can't damage Master Unit, which is confirmed in the story mode. And BB Ragna fought evenly against Susano'o. Take-Mikazuchi, even at it's full power was defeated by BB in PS3.

So Weakened Take-Mikazuchi>Susano'o=BB Ragna=BB>Full powered Take-Mikazuchi

???? This breaks the scaling.
 
Considering that Izanami should know Ragna to some extent thanks to her having a memory of Saya, she's probably already know that it will be futile to convince Ragna to join her in the first place and she probably know saying that word will only piss him off but she's said it anyway and i was reffering to their VS mode quotes when you use her to fight Ragna, plus if it really Saya who says the quote it will be weird cause she was saying "Brother let's play" if you use her DD which doesn't make sense if it was Saya saying it While gag reels aren't canon, some aspect of it still get brought up to the canon like Hazama cat alergy While Nine state that she can't kill the Master unit, she does manage to make something that can replace the master unit and it should be at'least somewhat comparable to master unit considering it was make to replace the master unit in the first place
 
Considering that Susanoo and Tsukuyomi purpose was to protect the Amaterasu unit, both probably still comparable in terms of power and the reason why Susanoo cannot damage the master unit is probably because it was design to protect it, that's why even though it comparable to master unit, it can't kill it just like how Black beast need the power of order to kill, plus master unit was protected by the Tsukuyomi unit and no Susanoo should still more powerfull than Takemikazuchi, it just can't kill it cause it probably get design to not be able to kill it despite being comparable Plus when Izanami fighting master unit she's not using the PI to the master unit, she's use it toward the world to makes the people in the world become more agressive and she's fight her while she still has no full control of Saya and she's still manage to damage it without Takamagahara at the end of CS
 
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