̶B̶̶D̶̶E̶̶2̶ ̶R̶̶i̶̶m̶̶u̶̶r̶̶u̶ ̶T̶̶e̶̶m̶̶p̶̶e̶̶s̶̶t̶ (Closed)

[Catpija]

I just realized something, how does Rimuru not have BDE while having Transduality over the Great Spirits, which houses the Great Spirit of Sky and Great Spirit of Time therefore already being independent and transcendent of space and time?

Thats exactly what my points are. I'm glad someone did catch on.

 

[Robo432343]

I ain't readin all that

bro conceded

 

[Catpija]

You yourself said NEP exist as nonexistent then you claim bde don't need it despite the main thing for it is lacking it and being superior/independent of it. Instead of simply being superior/independent. Read the page.

Well the page did mention about having independence is enough, maybe we should wait for staff's opinion

Beyond-Dimensional Existence on this wiki refers to the state of being of characters who exist outside, and are independent of, space and its dimensions. This is different from Zero-Dimensionality in that a zero dimensional thing is still spatial in nature, but simply lacks more than zero extension in any dimension.

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

Well the page did mention about having independence is enough, maybe we should wait for staff's opinion

Type 2: Characters whose nature is defined by lacking spatiotemporal features and being superior to them

You need to prove rimuru lacks spatiotemporal feature in his level of existence which isn't the case here because one of his tiers relies on how imaginary space has infinite 4D space

if you're going to give him bDE type 2 that would be equivalent to disqualifying his imaginary space because it will be nonexistent and instead his ratings will scale on the level that he is superior to and not what he has

 

[Catpija]

You need to prove rimuru lacks spatiotemporal feature in his level of existence which isn't the case here because one of his tiers relies on how imaginary space has infinite 4D space

What does Imaginary Space has to do with this? Its not a part of his body like i said before, its another separate pocket dimension.

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

What does Imaginary Space has to do with this? Its not a part of his body like i said before, its another separate pocket dimension.

it's literally his stomach. it doesn't need to be directly connected to his body to be part of his existence. just because his stomach is a pocket dimension doesn't mean it is not part of him. and that stomach alone proves he possesses spatiotemporal features albeit he is independent of said stuff.

Giving him BDE Type 2 contradicts the narrative given in the story. and idk why you guys bother so much with this ability when it grants the same thing as his TD type 1 with just a minor difference of BDE refers to completely lacking it as extra

 

[Bahaha]

You yourself said NEP exist as nonexistent then you claim bde don't need it despite the main thing for it is lacking it and being superior/independent of it. Instead of simply being superior/independent. Read the page.

Yeah, Rimuru has never been said to lack spatiotemporal features rip.
Other than the Holy Spirit preceding the Great Spirits, there is no feat that signifies anyone lacking spatiotemporal features.

Also drop scans

Scans for?
Most of the stuff I said was from Rimuru's transduality justification.
For Veldora, since I forgot how to insert images, I'll use the text.
"So even if the world was destroyed, Veldora would be returned to his dimension without feeling any effects from it.
Even in a world without energy—in other words, where time had stopped—Veldora would be able to move without any problem."
- Chapter 399

 

[Lesser_Goddess_Alexia]

it's literally his stomach. it doesn't need to be directly connected to his body to be part of his existence. just because his stomach is a pocket dimension doesn't mean it is not part of him. and that stomach alone proves he possesses spatiotemporal features albeit he is independent of said stuff.

I've tried to get Large Size Type 9 with that argument, but it's rejected.

 

[Peak]

You need to prove rimuru lacks spatiotemporal feature in his level of existence which isn't the case here because one of his tiers relies on how imaginary space has infinite 4D space

if you're going to give him bDE type 2 that would be equivalent to disqualifying his imaginary space because it will be nonexistent and instead his ratings will scale on the level that he is superior to and not what he has

I think differently, stomach is just a skill that gives Rimuru access to an imaginary space, the name has nothing else linking the stomach to Rimuru's body, not that I remember


Although I think more evidence is needed than that considering the scan of great spirits fading out doesn't exist in RAWs

 

[Catpija]

Although I think more evidence is needed than that considering the scan of great spirits fading out doesn't exist in RAWs

It was just for supporting anyway, the main argument was Rimuru having qualitative superiority towards the Great Spirits

 

[Peak]

It was just for supporting anyway, the main argument was Rimuru having qualitative superiority towards the Great Spirits

what necessarily makes him qualitatively superior to the great spirits? Probably not even Veldanava is

 

[Catpija]

what necessarily makes him qualitatively superior to the great spirits? Probably not even Veldanava is

well he transcended Veldanava thats why

 

[Peak]

well he transcended Veldanava thats why

But Veldanava is not a 4D being, is he? And transcendence itself in Tensura has not been shown to mean qualitative, even spiritual beings are treated as transcendent when in fact they are just much stronger

 

[Catpija]

But Veldanava is not a 4D being, is he?

He doesn't need to be

And transcendence itself in Tensura has not been shown to mean qualitative, even spiritual beings are treated as transcendent when in fact they are just much stronger

Thats in-context tbh, Yuuki called Rimuru a Transcendent God so I don't think his level of transcendent can be compared to anyone in the verse

 

[Peak]

He doesn't need to be

Thats in-context tbh, Yuuki called Rimuru a Transcendent God so I don't think his level of transcendent can be compared to anyone in the verse

I don't think it's enough for a statement like that, first of all, Rimuru didn't just absorb turn null for years? Also, what other than Ciel's enhanced knowledge of the world and his skills makes Rimuru qualitatively superior? And when we consider that in the context Yuuki only makes this statement after Rimuru uses a skill and is trampled by Turn null, I don't see why that would mean qualitative superiority

 

[Catpija]

I don't think it's enough for a statement like that, first of all, Rimuru didn't just absorb turn null for years?

What does that have to do with this thread

when we consider that in the context Yuuki only makes this statement after Rimuru uses a skill and is trampled by Turn null, I don't see why that would mean qualitative superiority

Yuuki saw Rimuru come back from the future where the world is already destroyed including its own space-time, back to the present using time travel, then commented that wasn't possible and can only happen because he was a Trascendent God. Ciel also states that Rimuru can do this because he rules over space-time. It was pretty clear that it was implied he transcended space-time itself.

Well if it not enough, i can settle with BDE1.

 

[Peak]

What does that have to do with this thread

what I mean is that there was no transcendence while he was in the void, he just absorbed turn null

Yuuki saw Rimuru come back from the future where the world is already destroyed including its own space-time, back to the present using time travel, then commented that wasn't possible and can only happen because he was a Trascendent God.

Yes, of course, considering that Yuuki was not even understanding the situation he was in, Ciel explains that he being able to go back in time is the result of Mai's skill, with the difference that Ciel knows how to use the skill's full potential and Mai doesn't. That's why I say that a statement like transcendent God is not enough to support qualitative superiority

It was pretty clear that it was implied he transcended space-time itself.

Well if it not enough, i can settle with BDE1.

And is something supposedly implicit enough for an update?

If it exists in a place without time or space it grants BDE 1 then it might work, which I don't think is the case

 

[Catpija]

If it exists in a place without time or space it grants BDE 1 then it might work, which I don't think is the case

Rimuru shares Veldanava"s nature who precedes The Great Spirits which houses the Great Spirit of Time & Sky.

 

[Lesser_Goddess_Alexia]

Yuuki saw Rimuru come back from the future where the world is already destroyed including its own space-time, back to the present using time travel, then commented that wasn't possible and can only happen because he was a Trascendent God. Ciel also states that Rimuru can do this because he rules over space-time. It was pretty clear that it was implied he transcended space-time itself.

Yuuki who had Velda's knowledge confirmed this actually.

 

[Catpija]

Yes, of course, considering that Yuuki was not even understanding the situation he was in

Yuuki understands that Rimuru comes back from the future without time and space back to the present using Time Warp, and that is enough to validate what he said.

Ciel explains that he being able to go back in time is the result of Mai's skill, with the difference that Ciel knows how to use the skill's full potential and Mai doesn't.

and Ciel explicitly said that because Rimuru rules over space-time, he can time travel back from a place without time to the past, which is impossible since time travel involve moving in the time axis and therefore proving Rimuru can act without being limited by the boundary of time.

 

[Catpija]

Actually nevermind, I'll concede. It seems that even though Rimuru trascended space-time itself and independence of it, he doesn't actually lacks it.