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BAN-KAI! Bleach General Discussion

Arc7Kuroi said:
What do yall think are the optimal speed and AP tiers for Bleach characters per arc (Substitute, SS, Arrancar, SAFWY, Fullbring, TYBW, CFYOW)?
Click to expand...

Substitute - Up to Island level and Sub Rel with menos/lieutenants

Soul Society - Up to Continental and FTL with stronger captains

Arrancar Arc - Up to Universal+ and MFTL with Yamamoto and Base Aizen and the Bleach Sannin....Low Outerversal and Irrelevant speed with Transcendent Ichigo and Aizen

SAFWY - Up to Stellar tier for Kenpachi/100% Cien and Bankai Azashiro

Fullbring - Who cares?

TBYW and CFYOW - Up to Low Multiversal with S0...Outerversal with transcendents

And ofc the Reio being boundless with samsara scaling since Bleach uses Buddhism themes
 
Real answer for a second

I honestly do believe FP S0 members are probably Low Multi given the way Senjumaru says they have to be careful to not exert themselves even more than just the minimum when released implies they will destroy or at the very least heavily damage all 3 worlds

And if you believe each realm to be a Low 2-C realm ofc
 
AnimesFreak2 said:
Real answer for a second

I honestly do believe FP S0 members are probably Low Multi given the way Senjumaru says they have to be careful to not exert themselves even more than just the minimum when released implies they will destroy or at the very least heavily damage all 3 worlds

And if you believe each realm to be a Low 2-C realm ofc
Click to expand...
I have this same thought. Plus to support that: Each realm has it's own time cycle, meaning it would count for a space time continuum, since it is an infinite space, operating on it's own time.
 
AnimesFreak2 said:
tfw when Kubo has Cour 3 and 4 confirm that the Garganta is like a 1-A realm beyond dimensions void of time or space
Click to expand...
Smt and Nasuverse supporters watching their favorite character get stomped by 1-A layered soul crush:
Screen_Shot_2018-10-25_at_11.02.15_AM.png
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
What do yall think are the optimal speed and AP tiers for Bleach characters per arc (Substitute, SS, Arrancar, SAFWY, Fullbring, TYBW, CFYOW)?
Click to expand...
Uh, I honestly have no idea. This will probably just be spit balling. I also could go into specifics, but I won't because I'm lazy and no one else is doing it either.

Substitute Soul Reaper arc: Maybe 7-C and hypersonic (I honestly don't remember the feats from the Substitute Soul Reaper arc very well).

Soul Society arc: 6-C (Low 2-C because of the Sokyoku being stated to destroy the Soul Society) and hypersonic to FTL (genuinely, the only speed feat I remember from that arc is Uryu out-speeding his own shadow).

Arrancar arc: High 6-A (I want to say 5-B, but I don't know why) and maybe MHS+ to FTL (actually, when does Memories of Nobody take place, whenever that happens 2-C and MFTL+/Infinite/Immeasurable for everyone), with Post- Dangai Ichigo and Monster Aizen being 2-C and MFTL+ (maybe higher).

Bleach: Spirits are Forever with You: I haven't read Spirits are Forever with You so I genuinely don't know, vaguely higher than the Arrancar arc I guess (Low 2-C/2-C for Kenpachi and Azashiro nearly destroying the Dangai, which apparently didn't happen).

Fullbring arc: Vaguely around Bleach: Spirits are Forever with You, I guess, with some characters being higher and others lower (and Ichigo is 2-C with immeasurable speed because regaining his Soul Reaper powers put him on a higher level than his Post-Dangai/Mugetsu form).

Thousand-Year Blood War arc: Vaguely higher AP than the Fullbring arc for most characters with MFTL speed for scaling to Liltotto dodging Auswahlen (hm... though several of these characters might have scaling to Gremmy or people who scale to him), 3-B and MFTL for people who scale to and above Gremmy, 2-C AP and MFTL/Infinite/Immeasurable speed for anyone scaling to and above Squad 0's true strength.

Bleach: Can't Fear Your Own World: Vaguely similar to the Thousand-Year Blood War arc (some might be higher, some might be a bit lower thanks to the Stern Ritter losing access to their Voll Stern Dich's), 2-C and MFTL/Infinite/Immeasurable speed for Kenpachi, Hikone, and Ikomikidomoe after absorbing pieces of the Soul King from Hikone.
 
See I know the dangai can be argued Low 2-C but the way SAFWY interpreted it, Kenny and Azashiro nearly destroying it was like planetary tier

And it would seem to make more sense in that context given Gremmy could fight a MUCH stronger Kenpachi yet himself needed to amplify himself with 8 clones to the max to perform what was at best a 3-C feat

Even if you wanked it to 3-A somehow that is still literally beyond infinitely weaker
 
ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn said:
Uh, I honestly have no idea. This will probably just be spit balling. I also could go into specifics, but I won't because I'm lazy and no one else is doing it either.

Substitute Soul Reaper arc: Maybe 7-C and hypersonic (I honestly don't remember the feats from the Substitute Soul Reaper arc very well).

Soul Society arc: 6-C (Low 2-C because of the Sokyoku being stated to destroy the Soul Society) and hypersonic to FTL (genuinely, the only speed feat I remember from that arc is Uryu out-speeding his own shadow).

Arrancar arc: High 6-A (I want to say 5-B, but I don't know why) and maybe MHS+ to FTL (actually, when does Memories of Nobody take place, whenever that happens 2-C and MFTL+/Infinite/Immeasurable for everyone), with Post- Dangai Ichigo and Monster Aizen being 2-C and MFTL+ (maybe higher).

Bleach: Spirits are Forever with You: I haven't read Spirits are Forever with You so I genuinely don't know, vaguely higher than the Arrancar arc I guess (Low 2-C/2-C for Kenpachi and Azashiro nearly destroying the Dangai, which apparently didn't happen).

Fullbring arc: Vaguely around Bleach: Spirits are Forever with You, I guess, with some characters being higher and others lower (and Ichigo is 2-C with immeasurable speed because regaining his Soul Reaper powers put him on a higher level than his Post-Dangai/Mugetsu form).

Thousand-Year Blood War arc: Vaguely higher AP than the Fullbring arc for most characters with MFTL speed for scaling to Liltotto dodging Auswahlen (hm... though several of these characters might have scaling to Gremmy or people who scale to him), 3-B and MFTL for people who scale to and above Gremmy, 2-C AP and MFTL/Infinite/Immeasurable speed for anyone scaling to and above Squad 0's true strength.

Bleach: Can't Fear Your Own World: Vaguely similar to the Thousand-Year Blood War arc (some might be higher, some might be a bit lower thanks to the Stern Ritter losing access to their Voll Stern Dich's), 2-C and MFTL/Infinite/Immeasurable speed for Kenpachi, Hikone, and Ikomikidomoe after absorbing pieces of the Soul King from Hikone.
Click to expand...
I pretty much share the same opinions for AP

I'm not knowledgeable on Bleach speed, and I don't watch the anime - but for me nobody reaches mftl until Aizen/Mugetsu, S0, Kenpachi etc etc etc
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
What do yall think are the optimal speed and AP tiers for Bleach characters per arc (Substitute, SS, Arrancar, SAFWY, Fullbring, TYBW, CFYOW)?
Click to expand...
I'll just do speed since the speed meta has been on my mind a lot recently:
Substitute Shinigami: Idk probably subsonic/supersonic/hypersonic or whatever.
Soul Society: MHS+ from Ichigo's lightning speed statement in the databook using a less lowballed version of his Senbonzakura calc as support.
Arrancar: Sub-Rel to Rel+ for the low end espada depending on how you handle the Aaroniero stuff and multipliers from SS. For the high end espada, FTL via some sort of Ulquiorra blitz calc (or multipliers from the Aaroniero stuff), might get into the low FTL+ ranges, not really sure.
SAFWY: I can't read it so I have no idea.
Fullbring: The only notable speed feat here might be some kind of calc for Ichigo's reiatsu blowing up Yukio's dimension (I think reiatsu travel speed < combat speed), all the other scaling comes from other arcs iirc.
TYBW: Whoever doesn't get scaling from past arcs would either be MFTL from Liltotto dodging Auswahlen or far into MFTL+ via scaling to or above Senjumaru's reiatsu. I think Infinite speed for the god tiers is reasonable but needs a couple more arguments, hoping we'll get those in cours 3 and 4.
CFYOW: Just use speed feats from other arcs.
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
What do yall think are the optimal speed and AP tiers for Bleach characters per arc (Substitute, SS, Arrancar, SAFWY, Fullbring, TYBW, CFYOW)?
Click to expand...

Soul Society Arc (Speed): Sub-relativistic to Relativistic, most likely Sub-relativistic.

Arrancar Arc: High 6-A, Tier 5/Tier 3 for characters like Yama, etc., and potentially Relativistic to Speed of Light. Top tiers are FTL to FTL+.

Bleach: Spirits are Forever with You: Tier 5, with speed ^.

Fullbring Arc: ^, but FB Ichigo and ginjo might scale closer to yama

Thousand-Year Blood War Arc: Overall Tier 5 for Fodder, with Gremmy ranging from 4-A to 3-A, Yama from 3-A to Low 2-C, and God tiers at 2-C. The God tiers have speeds ranging from MFTL+ to potentially infinite (Infinite only if certain scenes from the Anime unfold in a specific manner). 2-A Almighty.

Bleach: Can't Fear Your Own World: ^
 
AnimesFreak2 said:
See I know the dangai can be argued Low 2-C but the way SAFWY interpreted it, Kenny and Azashiro nearly destroying it was like planetary tier

And it would seem to make more sense in that context given Gremmy could fight a MUCH stronger Kenpachi yet himself needed to amplify himself with 8 clones to the max to perform what was at best a 3-C feat

Even if you wanked it to 3-A somehow that is still literally beyond infinitely weaker
Click to expand...
There are ways to interpret the SAFWY stuff to not mean that Aza and Zaraki can destroy the entire Dangai, which imo is the more consistent interpretation. Also, the planetary Dangai meta comes from assuming only the planets got affected in MoN (since WotL and SA got dragged in the Dangai in MoN) to argue Dangai is just vaguely above planet sized. So, it’s not that SAFWY makes the Dangai more planetary, albeit I agree that Aza and Zaraki shouldn’t scale to the entire Dangai anyway as it creates some issues.
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
There are ways to interpret the SAFWY stuff to not mean that Aza and Zaraki can destroy the entire Dangai, which imo is the more consistent interpretation. Also, the planetary Dangai meta comes from assuming only the planets got affected in MoN (since WotL and SA got dragged in the Dangai in MoN) to argue Dangai is just vaguely above planet sized. So, it’s not that SAFWY makes the Dangai more planetary, albeit I agree that Aza and Zaraki shouldn’t scale to the entire Dangai anyway as it creates some issues.
Click to expand...

SAFWY scaling is just a headache man
 
Even if we agreed each realm was Low 2-C and that the shockwaves of Senjumaru powering up somehow scaled to her combat speed...wouldn't that be Infinite speed at best anyways???

Not Immeasurable
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
No lmao, traversing spatiotemporal barriers aren’t qualified for immeasurable speed.
Click to expand...
It isn't because of that, it's because it is technically time travel because of how each realm has a separate time axis. Since the Soul Society and the WoTL are not synchronized in terms of time, you would be time traveling because of the current event in the Soul Society would be at a different time in the WoTL
 
ReaperAndBlues said:
It isn't because of that, it's because it is technically time travel because of how each realm has a separate time axis. Since the Soul Society and the WoTL are not synchronized in terms of time, you would be time traveling because of the current event in the Soul Society would be at a different time in the WoTL
Click to expand...
You’re still blatantly wrong. Hopping to different spacetimes doesn’t equate to nonlinear movement through time.
 
Don't Yhwach's feats with the Almighty against Ichigo completely doo-doo on Immeasurable speed for anyone without the Almighty at the very least? Not being able to react to attacks that move through time non-linearly sounds like a textbook anti-feat to me anyway, regardless of the stuff with Senjumaru's reiatsu.
 
TheLav69 said:
Don't Yhwach's feats with the Almighty against Ichigo completely doo-doo on Immeasurable speed for anyone without the Almighty at the very least? Not being able to react to attacks that move through time non-linearly sounds like a textbook anti-feat to me anyway, regardless of the stuff with Senjumaru's reiatsu.
Click to expand...
I would say no because the Almighty is a lot of things and not just attacking from the future
 
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