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I thought the durability neg was pain manip, is that something different?
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Baki Hanma vs Ikki Kurogane
- Thread starter Schnee_One
- Start date
- Status
- 20,509
- 1,589
Pain manip sure.BakiHanma18 said:
But the "minor dura neg" i mentioned is him having a sword. Which by nature has dura neg because it applies the force is less area basically increasing the pressure. But he can also cut really well with that sword (cut metal with paper). So 1 shot is all he needed to KO Stella (had it not been for her regen which eventually brought her to her senses.
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That changes... a lot... I was under the impression that Baki could tank the onslaught and use some of his special techniques to tag Ikki or throw him off guard, but now I'm starting to see why Baki can't really do anything...
It pains me to do this to my boy, but I don't actually think Baki has any chance of winning, timer or not. They aren't that far apart in skill, but Ikki is definitely more skilled, so it's not really possible for Baki to avoid getting hit once
It pains me to do this to my boy, but I don't actually think Baki has any chance of winning, timer or not. They aren't that far apart in skill, but Ikki is definitely more skilled, so it's not really possible for Baki to avoid getting hit once
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That's 5-0 I believe
Or 5-2 i don't know if the baki votes count right now
Or 5-2 i don't know if the baki votes count right now
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I don't know if my vote was counted in that, but I'll change my vote in favor of a stomp. I pictured this fight going very differently
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4-0/2 then
- 15,918
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A sword technically give you some kind of durability negation since slashing damage > punching damage
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- Thread starter
- #129
Moritzva literally everybody who voted Baki is saying this is a stomp.
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..eh? I read the earlier posts in depth and they made sense but then it started to go on, and on, and on, in typical Ikki Debate fashion, then went off topic about semantics at some point.
Kinda became hard to follow where the debate went after your early post regarding the facts of the fight, imo.
Kinda became hard to follow where the debate went after your early post regarding the facts of the fight, imo.
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- Thread starter
- #131
True but that doesn't really excuse not reading th rest of the reasons, especially if you're voting for said reasons.
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- Thread starter
- #134
You read through half of the reasons, if you don't want to read the rest and save yourself a headache, don't vote.
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When did it become like that? The only thing off-topic were the "english classes" and those were like 5 posts.
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That was, admittedly, one of the most hilariously off-topic derails in a moment. I had to pause for a moment just to go through.Ionliosite said:
But seriously, don't blame me for getting confused when the debate gets muddied. I'll reread it thoroughly before voting stomp or otherwise, but I'm doubtful of stomp based on what I have seen.
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- Thread starter
- #137
Oh I don't blame you for getting confused, I blame you for getting confused yet voting blindly anyway.
Read the reasons in full before voting, don't want to read don't vote.
Read the reasons in full before voting, don't want to read don't vote.
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Can you chill? All I did was see reasonable, clear-cut opinions at the beginning, followed by garbled, hard-to-follow mess, and the opinions at the beginning won out. I didn't murder your wife.Schnee One said:
XSOULOFCINDERX
They/Them- 19,297
- 7,688
Can you chill? All I did was see reasonable, clear-cut opinions at the beginning, followed by garbled, hard-to-follow mess, and the opinions at the beginning won out. I didn't murder your wife.
What the **** kind of Fallacious comparison is that?
What the **** kind of Fallacious comparison is that?
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I personally am not seeing how Baki can win anymore. My one hope was that he could tank some of Ikki's stuff and realize that he's gotta bust out something like Imagine Style, Illusions, or Cockroach Tackle to avoid Ikki and let him burn himself out rather than engage him, but Earl already said Ikki oneshots, so Baki doesn't stand a chance
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- Thread starter
- #141
@Moritzva I'm not sure where you're getting the idea I'm not Chill.
I haven't insulted you, nor used Caps, nor used exclamation points, not even as much as an ellipsis.
I simply pointed out what actually happened, you didn't fully read the reasoning fir both sides by your own admission and voted anyway
That's exactly what happened. I'm not sure why you're telling me to chill.
I haven't insulted you, nor used Caps, nor used exclamation points, not even as much as an ellipsis.
I simply pointed out what actually happened, you didn't fully read the reasoning fir both sides by your own admission and voted anyway
That's exactly what happened. I'm not sure why you're telling me to chill.
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If I attack you with a knife I will do more damage than if I attack you with a punch, so, in certain way, they do by slashing damage. Also, Ikki can cut metal with paper, so even if it isn't, Ikki can still do this kind of stuff.
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Cutting metal with paper isn't really dura neg, its (stupid) a technique that lets him ignore friction (Via pure SKILLLLL), he's not cutting through another 7c with a single sword slash. It will do more damage then a punch (Certain characters can throw out that logic with resistance to slashing/peircing weapons but baki isn't one of them) But I have severe doubts he's killing him in one blow.
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- Thread starter
- #145
^Id personally chalk that up to simply amplifying its AP, Ikki with his fist is still 8A after all
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I'll wait for Earl to say his piece about the "sword" thing, but as long as it isn't a oneshot, I can at least provide some Hanma arguments
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Swords are not "dura neg" in the literal sense. They don't literally "negate/ignore durability". They just slash making the damage apply to less area basically increasing the effect. Not "true" dura neg. You won't go with a knife and damage a 6-A as a 9-C. But you can damage a 8-B as a 8-C. That's the idea.
Also Ikki did this exact thing. Here is what happened when ikki attacked stella with a Madoka (basically just her own attack he reflected it), since it was a sword:
Her molten fist had punched into his gut at such high speed that it ripped through his muscles and shattered his ribs into dust. On top of that the heat burned and charred his intestines. Her power far exceeded that of any normal human and the damage she caused with that one blow was evidence of that fact.
With one punch - "Geh…. ah……" - she took Kurogane Ikki's consciousness. Vomiting up boiled blood, Ikki's body hung limp. He didn't fall, but the light was gone from his eyes. His awareness was gone. It was a completely hopeless situation.
(You're mine!)
Stella moved to deliver finishing blow. In order to bring her victory in the Seven Stars, in order to for her to surpass the one she had chased for so long, this attack with her entire body would…!!!!
The blade slipped through muscle and bone with ease. The fresh blood that spurted into the air and splattered onto the white stone was a deeper crimson than the magma. The blood boiled as though it was on the verge of igniting.
"Eh………?"
It couldn't have been anyone else. It was the 'Crimson Princess' Stella Vermillion's, dragon blood.
"OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHH!!!!"
"H-He's countered! Just when you thought the match was over! Kurogane Ikki, who looked to be down for the count, has just counter-attacked!! He's sliced across Stella from bottom to top! What a reversal!!"
"It- It was 'Madoka'! He took the force of her attack and turned it back on her! I… I can't believe it! How could he manage it!"
"Gah! Haa..!!"
"Stella has knelt on the ground! Her boiling blood is flowing on the white ring arena! The amount of bleeding is not ordinary!!"
(This damage is… bad….!)
Stella groaned as she pressed her abdomen like holding her entrails from falling out. This was not a fatal wound to Stella who has the power of the dragon inside of her. But it would take time to recover from her injury even when having a dragon's vitality. She wouldn't be able to move for at least tens of seconds. If he attacked her now, she'd be utterly defenseless. Realizing this, Stella had no choice but to gather her strength and try to escape.
"Stella is retreating while staggering! She's putting some distance!"
"..!!! Aaah………!!"
But one island away Stella collapsed again. Her vision faded. She couldn't move her limbs. Her blood loss was severe. Her regenerative abilities couldn't keep up with the amount of blood flowing out. But rather than the damage to her body, the unrest in her mind was more serious. What's filling her head was a question.
How?
She was certain that he had lost consciousness. No, not in the past. In fact, even now Ikki didn't regain consciousness. And yet… he could he use 'Madoka' to counter her. It made no sense. In front of Stella who was in an inexplicable confusion, Ikki finally regained consciousness.
Basically a 1 shot with her own attack. Simply because of tons of bloodloss.
Also Ikki did this exact thing. Here is what happened when ikki attacked stella with a Madoka (basically just her own attack he reflected it), since it was a sword:
Her molten fist had punched into his gut at such high speed that it ripped through his muscles and shattered his ribs into dust. On top of that the heat burned and charred his intestines. Her power far exceeded that of any normal human and the damage she caused with that one blow was evidence of that fact.
With one punch - "Geh…. ah……" - she took Kurogane Ikki's consciousness. Vomiting up boiled blood, Ikki's body hung limp. He didn't fall, but the light was gone from his eyes. His awareness was gone. It was a completely hopeless situation.
(You're mine!)
Stella moved to deliver finishing blow. In order to bring her victory in the Seven Stars, in order to for her to surpass the one she had chased for so long, this attack with her entire body would…!!!!
The blade slipped through muscle and bone with ease. The fresh blood that spurted into the air and splattered onto the white stone was a deeper crimson than the magma. The blood boiled as though it was on the verge of igniting.
"Eh………?"
It couldn't have been anyone else. It was the 'Crimson Princess' Stella Vermillion's, dragon blood.
"OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHH!!!!"
"H-He's countered! Just when you thought the match was over! Kurogane Ikki, who looked to be down for the count, has just counter-attacked!! He's sliced across Stella from bottom to top! What a reversal!!"
"It- It was 'Madoka'! He took the force of her attack and turned it back on her! I… I can't believe it! How could he manage it!"
"Gah! Haa..!!"
"Stella has knelt on the ground! Her boiling blood is flowing on the white ring arena! The amount of bleeding is not ordinary!!"
(This damage is… bad….!)
Stella groaned as she pressed her abdomen like holding her entrails from falling out. This was not a fatal wound to Stella who has the power of the dragon inside of her. But it would take time to recover from her injury even when having a dragon's vitality. She wouldn't be able to move for at least tens of seconds. If he attacked her now, she'd be utterly defenseless. Realizing this, Stella had no choice but to gather her strength and try to escape.
"Stella is retreating while staggering! She's putting some distance!"
"..!!! Aaah………!!"
But one island away Stella collapsed again. Her vision faded. She couldn't move her limbs. Her blood loss was severe. Her regenerative abilities couldn't keep up with the amount of blood flowing out. But rather than the damage to her body, the unrest in her mind was more serious. What's filling her head was a question.
How?
She was certain that he had lost consciousness. No, not in the past. In fact, even now Ikki didn't regain consciousness. And yet… he could he use 'Madoka' to counter her. It made no sense. In front of Stella who was in an inexplicable confusion, Ikki finally regained consciousness.
Basically a 1 shot with her own attack. Simply because of tons of bloodloss.
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So what can Baki actually do? His being out skilled greatly is one thing, but our skilled AND oneshot? I don't think he can deal with that
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I mean it's not a stomp i believe.
XSOULOFCINDERX
They/Them- 19,297
- 7,688
Sounds like a stomp to me.
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Stomps are not that strict. This is just decisive. Stomps are when a match is completely unfair.
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How so?
Ikki has a time limit and the reason he wins here is him being significantly more skilled leading to him being capable of landing a hit.
Ikki has a time limit and the reason he wins here is him being significantly more skilled leading to him being capable of landing a hit.
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Hmm we can restrict the big amp to "unstomp" this. Im fine with it.
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Without the amp, would Baki be able to take more than one hit?
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Depends. If you mean without Ittou Rasetsu, the only thing that changes is that Ikki can't "lol 20x speed" this.
If you mean without any amp and getting ikki to 8-A. Then while he would be able to tank several hits, Ikki would lose his time limit and skill **** this.
Both are fair so i don't care, you choose.
If you mean without any amp and getting ikki to 8-A. Then while he would be able to tank several hits, Ikki would lose his time limit and skill **** this.
Both are fair so i don't care, you choose.
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