Author Page Canonicity - SCP Meta Problems, Part 3/∞

[Matthew_Schroeder]

I don't agree with neither Dargoo, nor do I agree with using every single thing in SCP ever simultaneously. If there are blatant contradictions it obviously can't be done.

SCP has a loose canon in its website that can change with the time. Things are primarily written from an in-universe perspective, so that retcons and inconsistencies can be chalked up to "Unreliable Narrator" (Which isn't a practice exclusive to SCP), and depending on reception and the opinion of the site's moderators, entries can be removed and rendered non-canon.

I don't think that going solely by the standard SCP Files and no expanded stories or tales is the right way to go, in fact that runs counter-clockwise to how SCP is built and designed. But neither should we go with a "Anything goes" approach.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Agreed

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Also, what Dargoo said about The Elder Scrolls is false. The "Trial of Vivec" Forum Roleplay was done spontaneously between Bethesda Writers / Former Writers and some privileged fans. It wasn't something moderated or encouraged by heads-up at Bethesda But the presence of five different Bethesda Writers in the roleplay, as well as its later references in canonical supplementary material make it an acceptable source to use.

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

I think it's more trouble than its worth, but if Matt and Weekly think that this is acceptable, I fold. You guys can remove the canon revisions and do what you please.

That comes off as a bit blunt, so I apologize ahead of time.

 

[Agnaa]

I don't really want to turn this into an extended canon debate thread, but I realize that it's also gained the topic of "Should we delete SCP, ignore tales, or change nothing".

I appreciate the long response, but for brevity and tallying up, could you specifically answer:

What should the canonicity of operation overmeta be?

What should the canonicity of author pages in general be?

Should all SCP profiles be deleted, ignore tales, or have nothing change?

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

I don't agree with High 1-B SCP myself nor do I agree 100% with what Weekly sometimes pushes for. I think it gets a billy silly.

I'm just saying it's not a black or white situation.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

@Matt Considering its kinda flat out stated to be infinite spatial dimensions this time and even Azzy agreed that its legit...

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

At worse just do keys lol to acknowledge both interpretations.

 

[ZacharyGrossman273]

Tier 0 Swann would be too much but 1-A is legit

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

1-A isn't. I've not seen anything above High 1-B.

 

[Agnaa]

@Matt Considering its kinda flat out stated to be infinite spatial dimensions this time and even Azzy agreed that its legit...

Uhh, Azathoth still had problems with it.

I don't think Azathoth's challenges there ever got resolved, publicly at least.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

At worse just do keys lol to acknowledge both interpretations.

^^^THIS^^^

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Just to clarify, I've left the debate entirely.

You guys can figure out what to do with the verse. I have my views on it, and since they aren't shared, I'd rather allow people more passionate than I do what they want.

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Before I go though, you have my support for deleting the canon rules if that's what you please.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

I've started an SCP discussion discord to aliviate the tension here. Anyone who wants to discuss and fix what we have left is free to tell me their discord names and join the server.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I personally think that Dargoo has made sense, but I am not knowledgeable enough about SCP to argue about it.

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

Just to claify :

Who actually scales to tier 1-A IF it's accepted ? I know all the others who are above the Low Elder God Tier are going to be 1-A, but I'm more worried about those who are, per say, SCP-239 and such.

And thank you Dargoo for all you did . He attempted to do a lot for the SCP-verse and I will personally miss him discussing it.

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, I think that it will turn into a complete mess without him.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Ouch :/

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

Can anyone possibly answer my question ? I'd like to understand how far reaching the implied upgrade is.

And it does seem Antvasima is doubtful of our... ability to organize and reconstruct such a vast and complex verse such as the SCP Foundation without Dargoo .

 

[Antvasima]

I am doubtful about '''anybody's''' ability to keep SCP from turning into a massive mess if we are going to include almost everything.

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

I mean, stuff like the platonic pool balls was rejected due to being a really bad outlier, so it's not like we just instantly take everything

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

I mean, stuff like the platonic pool balls was rejected due to being a really bad outlier

Correction: That was rejected because Platonic Concepts in isolation outside of his philosophy isn't 1-A.

Still not debating the canon rules, but I'll correct blatant misconceptions like that, as it applies to other verses.

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

i'm fairly certain that the pool balls were confirmed to be true platonic concepts, but ok

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

No. They were rejected because you can't give something 1-A because they're described as a platonic concept.

To actually be 1-A you'd need justification to the point where being called a platonic concept is just wrapping on a gift.

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

Ok, that makes sense

sorry about that

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

No need to apologise, I'm just restating stuff that's already been debated.

Sorry if I came off as blunt, however.

 

[ProfessorLord]

Ouch :/

I felt this.

Thanks though @Weekly and @Dargo.

 

[Antvasima]

It wasn't intended as a slight towards Weekly or anybody else. I just feel extremely uncertain about letting loose all regulations for an extremely messy, inconsistent, and contradictory franchise.

 

[Agnaa]

Kep has replied.

I've always agreed roughly 80% with Dargoo, the other 20% being me disagreeing with a complete and utter ban of the usage of tales and a canon hub. The current rules def'ly look good enough to me.

It's dishonest to pretend that the old policy took consistency into account. It mostly did not, and we had to fight pretty damn hard to prioritize consistent ratings and prevent "one-paragraph-in-a-random-tale" updates. So yes, Dargoo's judgment is good.

Also, 106 being a WWI soldier who got infected by a tar-like substance was a backstory created by the original author of 106. It takes complete priority over other backstories if we're not talking extended canon.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you.

I agree with Dargoo and Kepekley.

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Okay.

I have talked with Agnaa after things have calmed down, and here's what I have to say:

The situation here was made into a complex and unmanageable mess because there was a debate within a debate: Agnaa made the thread to discuss the Author Pages, and Weekly brought up the Canon Rules, after which it turned into a debate on the canon rules. After that, myself, and I'm assuming everyone else on the thread, kind of just threw up our hands and wanted to be done with it. This wasn't helped by the jokes in the beggining that amplified perception that this can't be managed.

Here's what I suggest: Let's close this thread. Let's stop discussing SCP for now, and let Agnaa, Myself, Weekly, and a number of other users thouroughly discuss this off the wiki, then present something we can all agree on, which will cause the least amount of distress from users, sysops, and administration. This way we don't get the "canon/dimensional tiering discussion of the week" that's been driving a number of us insane.

We can use an unofficial discord or preferably another group chat service. Ovens has already suggested such a thing.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. I will close this thread then.

If if is outside of the wiki, you can ask Kepekley to take part as well.