Arceus and Chaos

[deonment]

Type 2 NEP dudes can interact with each other from default already iirc

they cant actually, you still need feats for it

 

[StrymULTRA]

they cant actually, you still need feats for it

Thread for that?

 

[Delta333]

NEP type 2 beings can touch themselves so they should have NPI lol

 

[StrymULTRA]

NEP type 2 beings can touch themselves so they should have NPI lol

I recall that UEG and The One could interact with each other just because of Type 2 NEP stuff, without the need of feats. But 1st we should make Type 2 NEP for Arceus accepted.

 

[Breakdown]

Agree with OP.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Void Manipulation btw would also be a given since Dialga and Palkia created a void when fighting each other in D/P adventure.

 

[Eficiente]

The egg appearing in a setting of nothing has no reason to mean that the egg and Original One are nothing too, but that they are the first something after that nothing.

 

[deonment]

the reasoning is more along the line of due to Arceus predating the 1 of Exististence(Palkia and Dialga) and the 0 of Anti-/Non-Existence(Giratina) with Arceus being neither of these he should qualify for nep2

 

[NeoZex6399]

I would wait until the blogs are finished.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

The egg appearing in a setting of nothing has no reason to mean that the egg and Original One are nothing too, but that they are the first something after that nothing.

That ultimately makes no sense since the lore specifies that nothingness is coming together to form the egg that is the Original One.

 

[theultimate5105]

The egg appearing in a setting of nothing has no reason to mean that the egg and Original One are nothing too, but that they are the first something after that nothing.

It didn't just appear it absorbed the nothingness and created itself out of nothingness that predates and exists outside of the Creation trios concepts and exists outside and above Existence and the anti-existence that is the distortion world

 

[Westcoast5005]

I agree

 

[Chariot190]

That ultimately makes no sense since the lore specifies that nothingness is coming together to form the egg that is the Original One.

I'd agree with Efi in that it could have been the first something after the nothing, that would be the logical conclusion, but if what you say is true, and that it was formed and comprised of the nothingness, well, I'd probably have to agree, nothing is still nothing even if there's a bunch of it. You can't combine nothing and nothing to make something after all.

 

[Thelastmlg]

I noticed a weird thing on the lore

At the heart of chaos, where all things became one, appeared an Egg.

If there was only chaos and the egg, how are "all things" becoming one there if they didn't exist yet, what are "all things"?

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

I noticed a weird thing on the lore

At the heart of chaos, where all things became one, appeared an Egg.

If there was only chaos and the egg, how are "all things" becoming one there if they didn't exist yet, what are "all things"?

"All things" in this context would also be nothingness. It and chaos would be synonymous with nothingness.

 

[StrymULTRA]

The egg appearing in a setting of nothing has no reason to mean that the egg and Original One are nothing too, but that they are the first something after that nothing.

Thing is that the myth describes the Egg as being made of said chaos tho, that's the basis of this whole CRT.

I'd agree with Efi in that it could have been the first something after the nothing, that would be the logical conclusion, but if what you say is true, and that it was formed and comprised of the nothingness, well, I'd probably have to agree, nothing is still nothing even if there's a bunch of it. You can't combine nothing and nothing to make something after all.

Kukui pretty much countered this in the replies as well.

 

[QuasiYuri]

I can see NEP type 1, but not Type 2 for the reasons brought up above.

 

[StrymULTRA]

I can see NEP type 1, but not Type 2 for the reasons brought up above.

Type 1 can't make sense as that would assume that concepts were already existing.

 

[StrymULTRA]

I mean, the egg itself is implied to be made of nothingness, so the logical conclusion would be Arceus being made of said nothingness too.

"All things became one" pretty much is a way to explain how the chaos is "compressed" to make the egg, because, what else should've been before existence and its concepts?

 

[YuuxGod97]

True Form Arceus should get Type 2 Nonexistence Physiology, also due of the description of said ability

Arceus having the same NEP as Anos?! NO I DISAGREE.


On a more serious note,

The egg appearing in a setting of nothing has no reason to mean that the egg and Original One are nothing too, but that they are the first something after that nothing.

I don’t quite agree with this, for these two below reasons.

In the beginning, there was only a churning turmoil of chaos.
At the heart of chaos, where all things became one, appeared an Egg.

It is said to have emerged from an egg in a place where there was nothing, then shaped the world.

The combination of ‘Nothing,’ is still considered nothing. You don’t get an answer from say, 0+0, because it is adding nothing, onto nothing. You simply don’t get something, out of nothing, and the context implies here;
“...
there was only a churning turmoil of chaos.
At the heart of chaos, where all things became one...have emerged from an egg in a place where there was nothing...”
Two separate entries I understand, but it’s where “all things,” which at the time was still ‘Nothing,’ Thus, you still have Nothing, even if all of Nothing gathered to one place.

“Off-Topic,” to an extent, I’m going to play Devils’ Advocate really quick.

Type 1 can't make sense as that would assume that concepts were already existing.

Wasn’t the Concept of ‘Chaos/Nothing’ already pre-existent?



Back to the Subject/CRT, I am inclined to agree with it, but if there is a massive blog coming that could unveil some new truths, or other stuff important.
We should hold on actually applying anything until that time the Blog is made, and discussed.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Wasn’t the Concept of ‘Chaos/Nothing’ already pre-existent?

MEH

 

[YuuxGod97]

MEH

I’m confused, what’s this about?

 

[StrymULTRA]

I’m confused, what’s this about?

Character who is Type 2 NEP due of embodying the nothingness before the concepts that made up existence as well.

 

[NeoZex6399]

The blog is finished and it has been stated that Arceus is an absolute existence that transcends everything.

 

[StrymULTRA]

The blog is finished and it has been stated that Arceus is an absolute existence that transcends everything.

It even back ups Type 2 NEP so we can still talk OwO

 

[YuuxGod97]

Chaos here is the pure void before existence due of it being a reference to the mythologies which treat chaos as such.

Arceus is actually a direct implication of the Mythos narrative of Cosmic Egg, possibly coming from the Vedic (Modern day Hinduism), word Brahmanda.
or, ‘Creator God Egg’.

 

[theultimate5105]

Ok so the blog also agrees with this
Also Low 1-C Arceus when

 

[Fixxed]

Character who is Type 2 NEP due of embodying the nothingness before the concepts that made up existence as well.

For addition

Nil is lack of all concept, and because this reason Nil was accepted AS NEP2 character



Umm i disagree with this CRT

At the heart of chaos, where all things became one, appeared an Egg.

arceus(egg) is born from chaos , and is not mean arceus is chaos itself

Sure the explanation is like philosophy of Wuji and egg is like Taiji which is born from chaos (wuji)

 

[StrymULTRA]

arceus(egg) is born from chaos , and is not mean arceus is chaos itself

The myth pretty much implies that the egg is made of chaos, due of it being the result of "concentrated chaos" tho.

Tho there's also stuff about Giratina's True Form being Type 1 NEP itself which can back up.

 

[theultimate5105]

For addition

Nil is lack of all concept, and because this reason Nil was accepted AS NEP2 character



Umm i disagree with this CRT

At the heart of chaos, where all things became one, appeared an Egg.

arceus(egg) is born from chaos , and is not mean arceus is chaos itself

Sure the explanation is like philosophy of Wuji and egg is like Taiji which is born from chaos (wuji)

Taiji may be born of Wuji but it is not made of Wuji
Thats the key difference The Egg is made of Chaos it is not born from it
also it trancends the 1(the multiverse) and 0(Distortion world) and exists nonexistent compared to them

 

[Fixxed]

if there is additional context in Supporting feats for arceus NEP2, maybe I would agree

 

[theultimate5105]

if there is additional context in Supporting feats for arceus NEP2, maybe I would agree

So basically the Distortion world is the complete opposite of the multiverse. A sort of Anti-existence which makes it NEP type 1
Now Arceus completely trancends everything in the verse and the primal chaos exists on the same level so the Nothingness that is the Primal chaos is a deeper nonexistence compared to The distortion world. It exists outside of the system of existence so it fufills the second justification of NEP type 2

Pokémon Called Gods

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[StrymULTRA]

As I said before, I'll only reply after the blog is finished because I'm still creating my vision of the Pokémon world while working on it.

Now? Is it done or we should still wait?

 

[deonment]

I mean honestly, Arceus should have it through the latter part of the nep2 stuff

2: Idealistic Nonexistence: The lack of absolutely everything to a state of nonexistence at a conceptual level. Such a state defies even the most basic logical principles and is unknowable in the truest form, as it is not a state at all. Such entities are typically presented as primordial voids or pure emptiness, or any abstract state which precedes or opposes the state of existence on all levels. In terms of binary, this would be something that is neither 1 nor 0, where 1 is existence and 0 is nonexistence

In the context of pokemon, this binary should be Palkia and Dialga who would be the 1as they are existence due to them being space and time in this case with Giritina being the 0 as anti/non-existence due to several statements that seem to exist within the blog that was posted above, with Arceus being neither of these he would be considered nep2 based on him not being the 1 or 0

 

[Delta333]

I mean honestly, Arceus should have it through the latter part of the nep2 stuff

In the context of pokemon, this binary should be Palkia and Dialga who would be the 1as they are existence due to them being space and time in this case with Giritina being the 0 as anti/non-existence due to several statements that seem to exist within the blog that was posted above, with Arceus being neither of these he would be considered nep2 based on him not being the 1 or 0

why being neither of these is NEP type 2?I mean if we can use that logic for one random character in pokemon that is not palkia,dialga or giratina then it’s NEP type 2?

 

[theultimate5105]

why being neither of these is NEP type 2?I mean if we can use that logic for one random character in pokemon that is not palkia,dialga or giratina then it’s NEP type 2?

It exists as neither existence nor non existences every pokemon exists as those two

 

[GilverTheProtoAngelo]

why being neither of these is NEP type 2?I mean if we can use that logic for one random character in pokemon that is not palkia,dialga or giratina then it’s NEP type 2?

Bruh any random character is already part of existance, that comes under domain of Palkia, Dilaga etc.

 

[Delta333]

Bruh any random character is already part of existance, that comes under domain of Palkia, Dilaga etc.

Lol of course I know they’re a part of existence,what I mean is not being space time or non existence is not enough for NEP type 2 because countless characters in verse are neither of these by default

 

[GilverTheProtoAngelo]

Lol of course I know they’re a part of existence,what I mean is not being space time or non existence is not enough for NEP type 2 because countless characters in verse are neither of these by default

Matter is also a thing though, which comes under wings of space-time hence existance.
Any random characater is made of normal matter.

Giratina is completely opposite to this. Absence of space-time , nothing ness.

And Arceus exists outside this binary.

 

[Starter_Pack]

So, what are the main arguments for and against the OP suggestion, in summary?