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Arc System Works Discussion Thread 2
- Thread starter TISSG7Redgrave
- Start date
Rabbit2002
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Yeah, Ogre looks cool. But he and Izumi will release next year
Rabbit2002
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It seems there is a confirmation that Orge is just being sent into Abyss instead of erased by Roger Void
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Rip Lex and Silvaria being in the game.
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So Wagner just got some blatant "scorch the world to ashes" statements alongside what I think is her destroying the entire void realm or just destroying the door that connects the two worlds while pushed to her very limit, Londrekia replicates a similar feat by freezing the entire pit of the voids alongside Kuon and gaslighted Wagner to believe he died until the last second.
Some of the characters having to nerf Kuon's via cutting his ties to the Hollow World's EXS in order to beat him.
Vatista seems to have Low-Godly regen now since she self destructed against Kuon (and also has a non limiter state) and regenerated her entire body but loses her immortality as a result, and Hyde being Hyde gets caught in the worst timing possible by the other girls since Vatista is just butt naked after the regen finished.
Kuon falling into the abyss took everyone's in birth powers with him, and Gordeau's arcade ending brought Roger back to life after Gordy asked Kuon to find him and get him back, pretty dope.
Chaos ends up fusing with his pet in his ending so he's part void now.
Some of the characters having to nerf Kuon's via cutting his ties to the Hollow World's EXS in order to beat him.
Vatista seems to have Low-Godly regen now since she self destructed against Kuon (and also has a non limiter state) and regenerated her entire body but loses her immortality as a result, and Hyde being Hyde gets caught in the worst timing possible by the other girls since Vatista is just butt naked after the regen finished.
Kuon falling into the abyss took everyone's in birth powers with him, and Gordeau's arcade ending brought Roger back to life after Gordy asked Kuon to find him and get him back, pretty dope.
Chaos ends up fusing with his pet in his ending so he's part void now.
Rabbit2002
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Poor Hyde
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She also destroyed the void realm or at the very least the door itself which was channeling a lot of Kuon's power, plus Londrekia does the same thing with his Ice prison move he pulls. Besides I'd argue this would only scale to the top tiers since there's a lot of statements and feats that makes everyone scale to Kuon a complete outlier, especially with how the top tiers handle beating Kuon.
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So I'm getting into lightning the argent novel and found something interesting with raven, so apparently insects are also on the list of animals that raven can transform into which he used to devour a man straight to the bone Which absolutely sounds like a MK fatality . But also he also has some form of invisibility that that not only that threw the senses of a sentinel off and these machines have 600 fps sensors, infrared and ultra violet sensors that couldn't even pick him up.
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So he basically became undetectable to good radars, nice.
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I checked on Wagner’s day long Earth scorching feat, it gets calced to 6-B, so a buff at the end of the day there.
Also it seems Eltnum has a blatant “I move at light speed” statement, so it seems Light speed under night is back.
Also it seems Eltnum has a blatant “I move at light speed” statement, so it seems Light speed under night is back.
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Under Night In-Birth 2: Kuon Nukes Stars
vsbattles.fandom.com
Welp, 4-B and MFTL+ Kuon it is then.
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You have the calc?
Rabbit2002
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Yeah, but she has an influence in the arcade story so at least we might have a light-speed feat scale from Eltnum
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I mean like... she's literally non canon to the verse itself so I'd question why use her for scaling.
And even then, her Arcade in both games makes it clear she's beyond the cast. She stomps out everyone in both UNIB 1 and 2 going by the dialogue.
Like unironically the Kuon ultimate is a more solid argument for speed
Rabbit2002
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She is not really beyond the cast to the point that she can easily stomp everyone in both UNIB 1 and 2. As you can see Hilda can fight against Eltnum and Akatsuki in her arcade, even Akatsuki has been encountered for few times within arcade mode and he also defeated her
Rabbit2002
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There is also a statement that Eltnum can destroy the whole world but it seems she can only do it with overtime rather than within a short period of time, and the UNIB cast also already can destroy the world stuff by their own
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I honestly didn't remember these here so fair enough.
Although that doesn't really change how Eltnum and Akatsuki both are literally guest characters and aren't canon to the verse at all. Using them for scaling is extremely dubious and idk why guest characters are being considered as valid sources for scaling. For a speed buff, literally use Kuon's ult. lol
Rabbit2002
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I didn't say that we don't use Kuon's ult for speed buff, I mean it would be better if we had more examples for speed justify
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As long as there aren't any contradicts to those being actual stars it should be fine
Also, are we gonna scale the ultimate to everyone, or just who all ends up scaling to Kuon going by the Chronicles whenever that releases?
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I mean we used scaling of Akuma from Tekken even though he is a guest character and is important to the Tekken Lore. This is same with SMT Dante being used in SMT III lore.
So we could use Eltnum since as I recall she appeared in other characters arcade stories.
But yeah Kuon's stuff is still used, its just using those two are good enough for more examples for speed justify it.
So we could use Eltnum since as I recall she appeared in other characters arcade stories.
But yeah Kuon's stuff is still used, its just using those two are good enough for more examples for speed justify it.
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Eltnum literally isnt even in the story mode itself unlike the examples you mentioned.
Also im noticing this site is inconsistent about ladder scaling. Melty blood has planned revisions about deleting all Arcade scaling because people have crying aboutt ladder scaling the past 2 years
Rabbit2002
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If you're referring to Chronicle mode then yes, neither Eltnum nor Akatsuki appear in Chronicle mode, a story set before the Night in which Hilda plans to become Re-Birth. But that's because Eltnum and Akatsuki hadn't been summoned to UNI until Night in Arcade Story. So we don't know if both will appear in UNI 2 Chronicle mode, so I guess let's wait until French Bread releases this mode
Well, I didn't play Melty Blood yet, so I don't know if it is similar to UNI or not
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Melty Blood unironically has a better case for ladder scaling due to how timelines work in Nasuverse
But yeah I only mention it because there's been a sudden uprising in people not liking ladder scaling. Famous example here
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@Violatas you do realize Eltnum and Akatsuki predominantly scales off whatever is given in Under Night for those iterations right? We don't remotely use Nasu scaling to cross scale to Under Night to begin with, also she's not really beyond the cast if she lost to Akatsuki who stated he had some trouble fighting Hyde in UNICLR. Also the calc is literally just "take the High 6-A calc and divide it by the amount of seconds in a day", so you can just use that.
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Melty was brought up because the back and forth over ladder scaling, not scaling to Sion from Melty herself. Just check my last message. Also you still didn't address how they're guest characters, which is what I really take issues with.
I already assumed that yes, but I asked if you had an actual calc for it
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Them being guest characters means jack shit if they're part of the game and have story cutscene interactions with the cast in the first place, otherwise Tekken Akuma wouldn't exist at all.
No but the calc member literally just said "take the High 6-A calc and divide it by the amount of seconds per day" and boom, you get the results.
No but the calc member literally just said "take the High 6-A calc and divide it by the amount of seconds per day" and boom, you get the results.
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Already addressed earlier as well. Murray explicitly said Akuma is canon to Tekken 7 so that's really not a good example.
Also how does this community even feel about ladder scaling.
So country level-large country?
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So just like how it's not a good example to use guest characters as an argument for Akatsuki and Eltnum because they actually have story cutscenes? Again address the story cutscenes they both have because you're not addressing that part. Don't really care for Nasu scaling.
Country level since it ranges in 12 teratons at best.
Country level since it ranges in 12 teratons at best.
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I did address it though? Akuma is explicitly canon to Tekken 7 as said by Murray, meanwhile Eltnum and Akatsuki aren't even in the Chronicles of Under Night and their appearances likely aren't meant to be taken seriously. This site doesn't just scale characters like that radically. And again this has nothing to do with Nasu scaling, just inconsistency I've noticed regarding ladder scaling in general.
Cool.
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You do realize Chronicles mode is a prequel to what happens in Arcade mode right? It's not something that's parallel to what happens in Arcade mode which happens AFTER the Chronicle mode stuff in the first place. Ok? Mika's story isn't meant to be taken seriously either, or Nanase's story due to it being comedic in nature, that doesn't disregard their canonical appearance in the story. Wdym scale characters like that radically? We're literally using stuff that's in Under Night, not Melty Blood or Tsukihime. Idk why you keep saying that when that's not what's being argued for light speed UNIB.
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I think you're missing what I'm saying. I'm asking how do we know we're supposed to take them being in the verse seriously when there's nothing going for it. Akuma in Tekken 7 is literally only used because we have confirmation he's canon.
Yes and they're actually canonical characters in the verse.
For using guest characters for scaling unless we have reason to take their appearance as canon.
I already told you this has nothing to do with Melty Blood. I literally only brought that up because people have been rising up about removing ladder scaling since its "cringe." Just weird inconsistency. I literally said nothing about y'all trying to scale to Eltnam from Melty Blood lmao
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Literally the fact they have actual story cutscenes to work off of and not just cameos like how KOF games have random cameo appearances in their games despite little to no story stuff to prove their other SNK work is canon to the series.
Ok, so you agree the point of "their stories aren't meant to be taken seriously" isn't an argument to make.
Not gonna repeat myself over and over again, we literally have story cutscenes with Eltnum and Akatsuki in their arcade modes of them fighting other Under night characters, this isn't KOF 1998 or 2002 where it's a mixture of everything with little to no regard for canon.
You're the one who asked us how everyone felt about the ladder scaling in the first place, so idk why you're assuming that's not at all being mentioned here.
Ok, so you agree the point of "their stories aren't meant to be taken seriously" isn't an argument to make.
Not gonna repeat myself over and over again, we literally have story cutscenes with Eltnum and Akatsuki in their arcade modes of them fighting other Under night characters, this isn't KOF 1998 or 2002 where it's a mixture of everything with little to no regard for canon.
You're the one who asked us how everyone felt about the ladder scaling in the first place, so idk why you're assuming that's not at all being mentioned here.
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The story cutscenes from just the ladders? Lol. If they show up in the Chronicles of Under Night 2 it could be fine, but as of now we have nothing indicating their appearance in the verse is meant to be taken seriously.
Nanase and Mika are explicitly canon to the verse and Eltnum and Akatsuki are just guest characters with us having nothing we should take their appearances as canon. Glad you agree.
Yes I've seen the cutscenes, but this still doesn't answer the question of do we take their appearances as legit for scaling when we don't even know if they're supposed to be canon to the verse.
I didn't ask what y'all thought of Melty Blood scaling, check that again. I asked what y'all thought of ladder scaling in general.
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Here's the progress I've made for Gear Physiology
vsbattles.fandom.com
Gear Physiology
vsbattles.fandom.com
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@Violatas said ladders have canonical outcomes like Enkidu fighting Waldstein or Hyde fighting Hilda, so not an argument to make when they're flat out used to have some canonicity in the story.
Nothing except the arcade stuff, sure ok.
Why would they not be canon to the verse if they have their own cutscenes and interactions with the cast in the first place? Again you're comparing something like KOF 98 and 02 cameos to something that actually has story importance.
You mean arcade ladder scaling? Because that's all we've got going in terms of any terms of scaling for the series, especially for UNIB 2 since there's no Chronicle mode, so we're gonna have to use it one way or another.
@Ikelaggan looks pretty decent.
Nothing except the arcade stuff, sure ok.
Why would they not be canon to the verse if they have their own cutscenes and interactions with the cast in the first place? Again you're comparing something like KOF 98 and 02 cameos to something that actually has story importance.
You mean arcade ladder scaling? Because that's all we've got going in terms of any terms of scaling for the series, especially for UNIB 2 since there's no Chronicle mode, so we're gonna have to use it one way or another.
@Ikelaggan looks pretty decent.
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I'm just gonna snip everything else and answer this. This is literally all I wanted an answer to regarding how y'all treat ladders. I know y'all weren't scaling the cast to Sion from Melty, I just brought up Melty as an example because people in this site treat ladder scaling inconsistently and its annoying.
Then again I will say the Nasuverse community on this site is very incompetent and everyone knows that lmao
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You should’ve elaborated on what you meant by ladders, just say arcade mode next time. Also no need to throw shade at another community on the site, last thing we need is another flame war.
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What did you think ladders meant? Lol. That couldn't be referring to anything else
Sure
