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AP Upgrade to all the top tier MLP characters

MinatoSparkle

MinatoSparkle

He/Him
7,178
3,992
I was reading through previous threads, when I came across a thread discussing whether or not Discord was 4-A. It was decided that there wasn't enough proof of that, but now that Discord and all the other MLP god tiers are High 4-C, it might be able to upgrade them back to 4-B. Even if it's decided that there wasn't enough proof for Discord to be upgraded, since Rainbow Power is so much higher in power than Discord, it could be upgraded to 4-B anyways.

https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1222911
 
Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
Even with our updated chart, Rainbow Power would have to be several hundred times greater than Discord in terms of power to hit the lowest bounds of 4-B, which I don't think we have evidence of.
Click to expand...
What about when considering the thead I linked?
 
It would depend entirely on how many stars he removed. Keep in mind that doing that to 2000 stars (which is clearly a lot more than there were in that scene) is about 3 Foe, which is still a bit away from the new 22.77 Foe baseline for Solar System level.
 
Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
It would depend entirely on how many stars he removed. Keep in mind that doing that to 2000 stars (which is clearly a lot more than there were in that scene) is about 3 Foe, which is still a bit away from the new 22.77 Foe baseline for Solar System level.
Click to expand...
RP is more than 10x stronger than Discord.
 
ZacharyGrossman273 said:
Then 4-B for Rainbow power and the like, High 4-C for Discord
Click to expand...
We still don't know how many stars he erased. Hell, he could've erased all the stars in the universe, but we couldn't know. I recommend At least High 4-C for the alicorns and all those who scale to them.
 
Lightbuster30 said:
There appear to be 40-50 stars in the scene. Twice as much if we double that what is behind them. So 5300 Teratons.
Click to expand...
It's not only those stars that were erased. At least all of the visible stars in the entire sky from that place were erased. That's easily hundreds, probably thousands of stars. You're only talking about one or two shots.
 
ZacharyGrossman273 said:
4-B, nice
Click to expand...
Well, I'm still not 100% sure if there were enough stars shown to be gone after the snap for 4-B, but it almost certainly makes the EoH, The Crystal Heart, RP, and possibly Stygian 4-B. Heck, maybe even Tirek. Someone should probably do a calculation to find out how many stars in total were in the sky using how many were in a certain area in one screen shot.
 
Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
It would depend entirely on how many stars he removed. Keep in mind that doing that to 2000 stars (which is clearly a lot more than there were in that scene) is about 3 Foe, which is still a bit away from the new 22.77 Foe baseline for Solar System level.
Click to expand...
Also, how come this hasn't been implemented to the actual page?
 
No, that's all the stars In the sky. Even adding each star group per shot, which is a massive reach, you still get a few hundred. If it's all the same, I'd rather keep them at large star level than baseline 4-B. I already have a calc that puts the top tiers at High 4-C+, which our local Tier 0 will soon be evaluating. If not that, then just go with 40-50 x baseline. At least it's casual.

Also even if he erased 10k stars (as in all the stars around the planet), it'd be 12 Tenatons
 
Lightbuster30 said:
No, that's all the stars In the sky. Even adding each star group per shot, which is a massive reach, you still get a few hundred. If it's all the same, I'd rather keep them at large star level than baseline 4-B. I already have a calc that puts the top tiers at High 4-C+, which our local Tier 0 will soon be evaluating. If not that, then just go with 40-50 x baseline. At least it's casual.
Also even if he erased 10k stars (as in all the stars around the planet), it'd be 12 Tenatons
Click to expand...
In that case, RP only has to be a few dozen times stronger than Discord to be 4-B, which isn't that much of a stretch. Also, why is it 40-50x baseline? Do you mean Baseline 4-C? And even adding each star group per shot (which isnt a highball, Discord warped the entire area when he did this, as after his effect, you can't see any of the regular sky) isn't enough, since there's also what's above them, to the parts of the sky they didn't show, and behind the houses. Anyways, as you pointed out yourself, it was EXTREMELY casual, making the chance of RP being 4-B even higher.
 
It's a stretch because some of the same stars could be in the same shots. I took the shot with the most stars as a highball. Maybe Azathoth would be cool if I used the most stars ever shown in a dingle shot in the series, but I doubt he'd go for it. As much as I don't like it, we ususlly don't go use speculation here.

Being casual doesn't warrent a tier jump unless the feat is ludicrously close to baseline, like a few points off. And even then it may not be considered, especially not when the feat in question isn't even that. But only a few times baseline.
 
Lightbuster30 said:
It's a stretch because some of the same stars could be in the same shots. I took the shot with the most stars as a highball. Maybe Azathoth would be cool if I used the most stars ever shown in a dingle shot in the series, but I doubt he'd go for it. As much as I don't like it, we ususlly don't go use speculation here.
Being casual doesn't warrent a tier jump unless the feat is ludicrously close to baseline, like a few points off. And even then it may not be considered, especially not when the feat in question isn't even that. But only a few times baseline.
Click to expand...
You're right, it doesn't warrant an outright tier jump. However, it does warrant RP being At least High 4-C.
 
Lightbuster30 said:
That's fine with me
Click to expand...
Also, wouldn't this make all who scale to the Alicorns High 4-C since Discord is several times baseline High 4-C at least and the princesses are only 2-3x weaker?
 
Lightbuster30 said:
Should. After all Tirek stomped Discord with more or less than 4x alicorn magic. Just Divide by 4 or 3.
Click to expand...
Significantly less actually, since he fought 4 Alicorn Twilight with Discord's magic.
 
Well we don't exactly know how powerful Discord is compared to the princesses. Bare maximum of 3x. Starswirl would be Star level to Star Level+ if we double the amount of stars we don't see from behind. We would divide Discords magic by 3 to get one alicorns power, then, further dividing by 6 as it took 5 plus Starswirl to perform Celestia's feat.
 
Lightbuster30 said:
Well we don't exactly know how powerful Discord is compared to the princesses. Bare maximum of 3x. Starswirl would be Star level to Star Level+ if we double the amount of stars we don't see from behind. We would divide Discords magic by 3 to get one alicorns power, then, further dividing by 6 as it took 5 plus Starswirl to perform Celestia's feat.
Click to expand...
But the other 5 ponies were drained of all their magic when they did that, yet Starswirl did it consistently, showing that he was above them all. Also, wasn't it said in the comics that Starswirl is stronger than the princesses, and in the episode that Twilight was weaker than Starswirl? That would mean he's also Large Star Level. I think Discord's more likely 2x stronger, since Tirek stomped him. The season 4 finale cleared up a lot of things power scaling wise, but it also made a lot of things confusing. Logically, Discord should be more than twice the strength of the alicorns, yet when Tirek absorbed Discord's, when he was already stronger than him, he became 4x alicorn level only, or possibily even lower if you think Twilight doesn't scale to the others.
 
Well that just means Starswirl is even farther into Star level. He still couldn't do it on his own, so they are at least somewhat comparable. And the comics aren't canon. Yet anyways. Still think Twilight is more consistiently portrayed as massively superior to her friends than equal to them.

Not really tbh. Discord's current ap justifucation is wrong. Stomping 2 Star Level beings doesn't make you 2x them. Not unless you overpowered them after the combined their power into one. This on the other hand is actually legit, and my calc even more so. Provided Azathoth accepts it.
 
Well that just means Starswirl is even farther into Star level. He still couldn't do it on his own, so they are at least somewhat comparable. And the comics aren't canon. Yet anyways. Still think Twilight is more consistiently portrayed as massively superior to her friends than equal to them.

Not really tbh. Discord's current ap justifucation is wrong. Stomping 2 Star Level beings doesn't make you 2x them. Not unless you overpowered them after the combined their power into one. This on the other hand is actually legit, and my calc even more so. Provided Azathoth accepts it.

Again, Stygian said that Twilight was ALMOST as strong as Starswirl. This means that Starswirl is Large Star Level if Twilight is. Now that I think about it, since Stygian in his weakened state was implyed to be stronger than Starswirl and the other pillars, wouldn't that guarantee Twilight as High 4C?

Wel, he was extremely casual while doing so, and created dimensions with natural light (basically a star) and had complete control over them. Also, being able to sneeze away a changeling army is pretty impressive, and being able to move multiple stars at once, etc..
 
Not denying that. Just that the statement isn't taken as valid due to Twilight supposedly having too many contradictory showings of being portrayed as on par with her friends, instead of being stronger. Believe me, I did argue against that, but the discussion just kinda stopped. People just stopped commenting after my last post iirc. Sucks, but it is what it is.

Refer to my post about being casual. Agreed on the dimension making having light, but you need an admin to accept it. We don't exactly know how strong the chagenlings were though. They did have all the magic from the major figures, so maybe it could count. I don't recall moving multiple stars. I recall removing a bunch of stars, but that's already mentioned here.
 
Lightbuster30 said:
Not denying that. Just that the statement isn't taken as valid due to Twilight supposedly having too many contradictory showings of being portrayed as on par with her friends, instead of being stronger. Believe me, I did argue against that, but the discussion just kinda stopped. People just stopped commenting after my last post iirc. Sucks, but it is what it is.
Refer to my post about being casual. Agreed on the dimension making having light, but you need an admin to accept it. We don't exactly know how strong the chagenlings were though. They did have all the magic from the major figures, so maybe it could count. I don't recall moving multiple stars. I recall removing a bunch of stars, but that's already mentioned here.
Click to expand...
I guess, but I feel it's more accurate here, since Stygian above all others would know Starswirl's strength, since he fought him and has a deep hatred for him. Also, it makes sense since he's Twilight's idol.

Yeah, but he was really close to High 4-C. It does mention in his AP department of Discord's profile that it's possible he created his own dimensions, though it didn't mention the light part. At least it had Chrysalis, and defeating her with a sneeze is no mean feat, regardless of her love quantity, since she was shown to hold her own against Copy Twilight for quite a while. I don't either, it just says that on his profile.
 
It's not really about that as much as it is "consistency".

Well he mentioned just the army. Might have been bragging since Twilight's Kingdom showed he isn't overwhelmingly powerful compared to the Princesses. From a numbers point of view that is. Yeah he stomped the Princesses, but in fiction it isn't uncommon for a minor difference to lead to a stomp.
 
Lightbuster30 said:
It's not really about that as much as it is "consistency".
Well he mentioned just the army. Might have been bragging since Twilight's Kingdom showed he isn't overwhelmingly powerful compared to the Princesses. From a numbers point of view that is. Yeah he stomped the Princesses, but in fiction it isn't uncommon for a minor difference to lead to a stomp.
Click to expand...
Maybe.

Also, Tirek couldn't overwhelm Discord until he'd absorbed the magic from most of the ponies in all of Equestria and the Mane 6. There's no proper way of scaling how many ponies the alicorns equal, but even 5 normal ponies and Starswirl-who you think somewhat scales to them-could raise the sun, albeit with a lot of effort. Even if Celestia can easily do it, it still shows how much more powerful than her Discord is.
 
Since Azahoth seems to have rejected this suggestion, it seems best to close this thread.
 
Antvasima said:
Since Azahoth seems to have rejected this suggestion, it seems best to close this thread.
Click to expand...
That was before we talked about other things that possibly change other things. He hasn't rejected that.
 
Well, you can politely ask him to comment here again then.

Also, please stop quoting each other back and forth. It spams the page and makes it hard to read.
 
I don't think we calc these feats by just the amount of stars, but the tota distance warped. I remember Assalt telling me that when I asked about a similar Donald Duck feat.

Nearest star tat isn't our sun is 4.068e+16 meters away.

Target radius is a star, so 695,508,587.14 m (I think we use a different value now? Can someone confirm that?)

Target GBE is a star so using the sun. 5.693 * 10^41 J (again I think we use something else for generic stars but idk what)

4.068e+16 / 695,508,587.14 = 58,489,572.5979 meters

5.693e+41 * 58,489,572.5979 = 3.3298114e+49 J

332.98114 KiloFOE

(not sure if my method is outdated or not but using the E = 4*U*(Er/Tr)^2 formula gets TeraFOE level results, idk what that's all about)
 
I am honestly uncertain what our current standards are for these types of feats. It seems best to ask Azathoth.
 
We multiply the average star's GBE by the number of stars destroyed if the feat is FTL KE & doesn't warrant Inverse Square Law being used.
 
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