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Amon vs Karthus

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Well considering Broadway Force is essentially Mind Manipulation I doubt it effects Amon. Karthus, on the other hand...
 
The only time he used it on screen was in the Pentakill Mortal Reminder music video. He uses magic to activate it. Magic manipulates the mind, making them dance and rock out.

Also his Broadway Force isn't even passive; he used Requiem to proc it.
 
When... he makes them dance...

Unless he physically is moving each muscle with magic he is manipulating their minds.
 
Assaltwaffle said:
When... he makes them dance...

Unless he physically is moving each muscle with magic he is manipulating their minds.
Click to expand...
I'm sorry what?

Controlling a muscle in a person's bones means you're controlling their mind?

Is paralysis Mind manipulation now?
 
@Schnee

I think you entirely missed my point. Controlling every muscle is NOT mind control. I was stating the dichotomy of the possibilities for Karthus' dancing power.

Either A. He is controlling every muscle or make them dance

or B. He is controlling their mind to make them dance.

Sorry if you didn't see that in my first post but I in no way implied that physically moving muscles to be mind manipulation.
 
Except Karthus has never demonstrated the ability to use mind manip, if anything seeing as its done with Requiem implies its soul manip

Plus eve if it was mind manip its mind manip via magic which is a different kind of mind manip than Amon has resisted
 
@Weekly

Manipulating a metaphysical mind, regardless of whether it is done by magic or psionic power, is still the manipulation of a metaphysical mind. It isn't like Ragyō Kiryüi who uses a brain to control others. It's basically the same.

Also Karthus never demonstrated the ability to control bodies or make them dance, either. This is Pentakill Karthus, who has a different moveset than normal Karthus. Unless he is telling their very souls to dance, which then results in bodily movement, him using Soul Manipulation isn't exactly the go-to answer for how is Broadway Force works.
 
Also I don't remember Requiem being Soul Manipulation. While he can take and absorb souls, when is Requiem stated to by a soul-based attack?
 
Resisting mind manip = resisting soul manip

lol wat?

Occams Razor my dude. Karthus never demonstrated mind manip at any other point in time and the broadway force is done via an attack that directly affects the soul. Therefore his broadway force is done via soul manip.
 
@Weekly

Man I'm being strawmanned a lot in this thread.

No, I never claimed that "resisting mind manip = resisting soul manip". In fact you can very clearly see that I, in fact, do NOT believe such by the use of "unless". "Unless he is telling their very souls to dance..."

That statement clearly shows that I agree that if he indeed is commanding their souls to dance that this would bypass normal mind manipulation resistance. I claimed that mind manipulation via magic or psionic power was equal, not that resisting mind manipulation was equal to resisting soul manipulation.
 
I thought some of it was Death or shadow-isles based. You're saying that even Lay Waste and Wall of Pain are soul attacks?
 
Well then Death Manip needs to be removed if he isn't using Death Magic, but rather soul attacks all around.

Also where in his bio states that his magic is exclusively soul-based? The other Shadow Isles heralds don't share that trait.
 
Now in Karthus profile it doesn't seem like he resists Mind Manipulation so there is that. Also Amon is FAR more haxxed than Karthus. In Karthus's favor however, I don't believe Amon has a resistance to soul manipulation. I don't see Karthus getting past Amons psionic potential unfortunately, due to the sheer diversity of Amons powers.

Amon Low-Mid Diff
 
@Boc Amon wouldnt be able to use any psinics as he'd be instantly caught in Karthus' broadway force
 
Willing to agree to some extent but could you send the video that he utilized the broadway force on, wanna see what we are working with here.
 
2:33 actually

Also forgot his summoning and his broadway force are intertwined, he summons his other band members as a byproduct of his music
 
WeeklyBattles said:
2:33 actually

Also forgot his summoning and his broadway force are intertwined, he summons his other band members as a byproduct of his music
Click to expand...
2:33 is a excellent example of how his broadway force could do good harm to Amon. AMon has summoning as well though. Does Karthus have a way to kill Amon?

Starting to lean toward Inconclusive.
 
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