- 5,232
- 708
Intriguing...I'd like to see you try.
Aizen:6
Meganium:0 (I think?)
Standard Battle assumptions
7-B stats, Speed Equalised, Who wins?
-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
Aizen vs Meganium
- Thread starter LordAizenSama
- Start date
Intriguing...I'd like to see you try.
Aizen:6
Meganium:0 (I think?)
Standard Battle assumptions
7-B stats, Speed Equalised, Who wins?
- 3,669
- 1,080
This... is the strangest matchup I've seen... ever
- 925
- 525
Meganium via Fear Manipulation. What, that isn't a valid arguement? Oh, alright.
Meganium isn't half bad with its poison manipulation, good control over the battlefield, and superior staying power via healing and the like. But I think Aizen could turn the odds to his favor by messing with Meganium's mind and manipulating gravity to impede Meganium's fighting abilities. Plus, I'm not sure how well Aizen can fly, but that would likely help him against Meganium's plant manipulation.
I'd like to think Aizen catches Meganium as a pet. He should get a rickshaw cart and have a Meganium pull it around. I don't know which one suits his personality most, though. Normal Meganium, Nightmare Meganium, or MURRSTAKE! Meganium? This is very important.
Meganium isn't half bad with its poison manipulation, good control over the battlefield, and superior staying power via healing and the like. But I think Aizen could turn the odds to his favor by messing with Meganium's mind and manipulating gravity to impede Meganium's fighting abilities. Plus, I'm not sure how well Aizen can fly, but that would likely help him against Meganium's plant manipulation.
I'd like to think Aizen catches Meganium as a pet. He should get a rickshaw cart and have a Meganium pull it around. I don't know which one suits his personality most, though. Normal Meganium, Nightmare Meganium, or MURRSTAKE! Meganium? This is very important.
- 33,408
- 8,430
..That Meganium picture tho......
- 16,959
- 4,855
Yeah Aizen takes this. He also has his reality warping to help too.
- 40,459
- 12,940
You can't kill Me Stake! He's immortal!
In all seriousness, Aizen pulls an Aizen. KS ftw
In all seriousness, Aizen pulls an Aizen. KS ftw
- 925
- 525
I was kidding about MURRSTAKE!, of course. However! We are still ignoring the matter of the Mega-Rickshaw! I demand closure!
- 10,111
- 3,789
I don't know Aizen quite as well as I'd like, but... according to our page on him, "He can only use his Reality Warping when possessing the Hyogoku."
I don't know what Reality Warping specifically he has, nor if he still qualifies as having 7-B stats when possessing the Hyogoku, sadly.
That said, Kyōka Suigetsu is a big boon to Aizen here. With it, his hypnosis lets him control all 5 senses of his victim, & it still works whether they know they're hypnotized or not.
With this Meganium pretty much has no means of detecting or keeping track of Aizen, unless pain isn't one of the controlled senses -which I doubt- & Meganium can think to use where it's hurting from Aizen's attacks as a basis for what direction to attack.
There's also the fact that Aizen has Pseudo-Flight, giving him a mobility advantage, & meaning there are a lot more places Meganium could attack & have Aizen NOT be, which, combined with the hypnosis, means in theory, it won't hit him very much.
But, for the sake of argument....
Well, Meganium DOES have some tricks up its sleeve....
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Meganium#By_leveling_up
For one, does Kyōka Suigetsu count as a status ailment? If so, Safeguard may be able to block it. But that assumes Meganium thinks to use it before it sees Aizen's sword/Aizen himself, depending on which it is for this form of Aizen's.
Similarly, if Meganium has Leaf Guard & the weather has heavy sunlight (The former is possible, the latter might be unlikely/unfair.) it's protected against status ailments altogether. Heavy sunlight will also mean Meganium heals itself more whenever it uses Synthesis.
Then there's Poisonpowder.
Assuming it's used early enough, Aizen lets himself be in range of it, or it's just too difficult to avoid, Aizen could end up poisoned.... I mean, assuming he doesn't use a Barrier to block it, or an attack to destroy it or somehow redirect it, besides dodging it.
If he has Regenerationn in this form, Aizen's regen might combat the poison a bit, if he does get afflicted.
If Aizen is stupid enough to stay in range of Meganium, it could Body Slam him, for a small chance of inflicting Paralysis.
As for combatting during the hypnosis, as opposed to hoping it's a status ailment itself.... Meganium has:
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Petal_Blizzard_(move)
Even if Meganium is being completely deceived in all 5 senses, unless Aizen can use KS to directly & completely control everything Meganium does, attacking everything around it may be a way of assaulting him while under the hypnosis.
Of course, he still has the options of dodging, putting up barriers or defending against the attack, although it might catch him by surprise. He could also try to fly out of range of his grounded opponent.
Another option is:
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Magical_Leaf_(move)
Again, as long as Meganium controls what it does, this may also be a feasible form of attack, as the leaves chase Aizen; If they move independently of Meganium, this homing attack may be a means of hitting him.
With Sweet Scent, Meganium can reduce Aizen's evasion....
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Sweet_Scent_(move)#Descriptio
Although its most recent descriptions mostly focus on that it's a sweet scent that reduces evasiveness & attracts wild Pokemon, it's earlier descriptions give more flavour.
Presumably, Sweet Scent could be used to distract or allure Aizen himself, making it a bit harder for him to defend, wherever he is.
And Meganium has access to both Reflect & Light Screen, which can halve physical, & "special" damage, meaning it can halve the damage from just about any of Aizen's attacks.
It can cure statuses it has via Aromatherapy, although, that will also cure Aizen's statuses, & depends on Aizen letting it smell the aroma, if he has it under KS, even if Aizen might not know what the aroma does.
And of course, Synthesis offers it healing.
Meganium's ability Overgrow boosts the power of its offenses when it's "in a pinch". Mechanically, for what it's worth, Overgrow triggers when Meganium is below 1 third of its max HP, & boosts power with Grass type moves by 50%.
Lastly, it's possible Aizen may have trouble bringing himself to fight Meganium, if we go by this Pokedex entry:
In short:
Using Safeguard early enough, or being in heavy sunlight with the Leaf Guard ability are means of protecting Meganium against statuses. This could be trouble for Aizen if his KS hypnosis qualifies as a status.
Similarly, using Aromatherapy & smelling the aroma -if Aizen lets it/doesn't realize he should prevent it- cures status ailments. It will also cure Aizen's status ailments.
Body Slam could Paralyze Aizen giving him a small chance of becoming immobile from being "fully paralyzed" sometimes. This depends on him being in range of it, though.
Overgrow boosts Meganium's power with Grass moves when its "in a pinch"/low on health.
Meganium can use both Reflect & Light Screen to halve damage from just about anything Aizen can throw at it. Reflect halves physical attack damage, Light Screen halves "special" attack damage.
If Meganium can poison Aizen with PoisonPowder, it can help wear down Aizen, or help combat his Regenerationn, if he has it in this form.
Meganium can use Synthesis to heal, which heals more if there's heavy sunlight.
Meganium can use Sweet Scent to allure/distract Aizen with a pleasant aroma, likely making him easier to hit with what offenses it has.
Meganium, in battle, releases an aroma that soothes & becalms emotions. In battle, like here, it releases more to blunt the foe's fighting spirit, which could possibly make Aizen have more trouble fighting back.
Even while hypnotized, if Meganium can control what it does, it can attack everything around it with Petal Blizzard, or use a homing attack via Magical Leaf, the leaves of which themselves chase the target, apparently. This provides Meganium semi-reliable means of attacking Aizen even at range or under the effects of Kyōka Suigetsu.
Aizen's biggest advantages are making Meganium's senses worthless, so that it's hard for it to detect him, & his pseudo-flight allowing him to keep mostly out of range & use his own ranged attacks. If his 7-B stats form also has Reality Warping &/or Regneration, this could also be useful.
If it can still control what it does, though, as mentioned, Meganium has ways of fighting, even if it can't see, hear, smell, feel or taste to detect them.
The fact that it can halve the damage of attacks, block statuses in several ways, heal & Poison Aizen means it could have an advantage in the long term.
I have my doubts about Kyōka Suigetsu giving Aizen an easy win here. I don't know how his Reality Warping works, though, nor if he has it or his Regenerationn in this form.
I'll laugh if Aizen's profile ends up with a win against Groudon & a loss against MEGANIUM of all things. XD
Hopefully my points seem valid, & dare I do it, I vote: Meganium High Difficulty, for being able to attack everything around it, homing attacks, damage halving, healing, status blocking & curing, scent-based alluring/distracting/becalming/battle-spirit-blunting & via PoisonPowder... err... poisoning.
Without complete knowledge of Aizen's RW nor knowing if he has it &/or how good his Regenerationn is, in his 7-B stats form as the OP specified here, I'm not sure his hypnosis, pseudo-flight, range & stats are enough for him to win here, silly of me as that may be.
I don't know what Reality Warping specifically he has, nor if he still qualifies as having 7-B stats when possessing the Hyogoku, sadly.
That said, Kyōka Suigetsu is a big boon to Aizen here. With it, his hypnosis lets him control all 5 senses of his victim, & it still works whether they know they're hypnotized or not.
With this Meganium pretty much has no means of detecting or keeping track of Aizen, unless pain isn't one of the controlled senses -which I doubt- & Meganium can think to use where it's hurting from Aizen's attacks as a basis for what direction to attack.
There's also the fact that Aizen has Pseudo-Flight, giving him a mobility advantage, & meaning there are a lot more places Meganium could attack & have Aizen NOT be, which, combined with the hypnosis, means in theory, it won't hit him very much.
But, for the sake of argument....
Well, Meganium DOES have some tricks up its sleeve....
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Meganium#By_leveling_up
For one, does Kyōka Suigetsu count as a status ailment? If so, Safeguard may be able to block it. But that assumes Meganium thinks to use it before it sees Aizen's sword/Aizen himself, depending on which it is for this form of Aizen's.
Similarly, if Meganium has Leaf Guard & the weather has heavy sunlight (The former is possible, the latter might be unlikely/unfair.) it's protected against status ailments altogether. Heavy sunlight will also mean Meganium heals itself more whenever it uses Synthesis.
Then there's Poisonpowder.
| SM | The user scatters a cloud of poisonous dust that poisons the target. |
If he has Regenerationn in this form, Aizen's regen might combat the poison a bit, if he does get afflicted.
If Aizen is stupid enough to stay in range of Meganium, it could Body Slam him, for a small chance of inflicting Paralysis.
As for combatting during the hypnosis, as opposed to hoping it's a status ailment itself.... Meganium has:
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Petal_Blizzard_(move)
Even if Meganium is being completely deceived in all 5 senses, unless Aizen can use KS to directly & completely control everything Meganium does, attacking everything around it may be a way of assaulting him while under the hypnosis.
Of course, he still has the options of dodging, putting up barriers or defending against the attack, although it might catch him by surprise. He could also try to fly out of range of his grounded opponent.
Another option is:
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Magical_Leaf_(move)
Again, as long as Meganium controls what it does, this may also be a feasible form of attack, as the leaves chase Aizen; If they move independently of Meganium, this homing attack may be a means of hitting him.
With Sweet Scent, Meganium can reduce Aizen's evasion....
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Sweet_Scent_(move)#Descriptio
Although its most recent descriptions mostly focus on that it's a sweet scent that reduces evasiveness & attracts wild Pokemon, it's earlier descriptions give more flavour.
| Stad2 | A pleasant aroma that distracts the target, making the opponent easier to hit. |
Presumably, Sweet Scent could be used to distract or allure Aizen himself, making it a bit harder for him to defend, wherever he is.
And Meganium has access to both Reflect & Light Screen, which can halve physical, & "special" damage, meaning it can halve the damage from just about any of Aizen's attacks.
It can cure statuses it has via Aromatherapy, although, that will also cure Aizen's statuses, & depends on Aizen letting it smell the aroma, if he has it under KS, even if Aizen might not know what the aroma does.
And of course, Synthesis offers it healing.
Meganium's ability Overgrow boosts the power of its offenses when it's "in a pinch". Mechanically, for what it's worth, Overgrow triggers when Meganium is below 1 third of its max HP, & boosts power with Grass type moves by 50%.
Lastly, it's possible Aizen may have trouble bringing himself to fight Meganium, if we go by this Pokedex entry:
| Emerald | The fragrance of Meganium's flower soothes and calms emotions. In battle, it gives off more of its becalming scent to blunt the foe's fighting spirit. |
|---|
In short:
Using Safeguard early enough, or being in heavy sunlight with the Leaf Guard ability are means of protecting Meganium against statuses. This could be trouble for Aizen if his KS hypnosis qualifies as a status.
Similarly, using Aromatherapy & smelling the aroma -if Aizen lets it/doesn't realize he should prevent it- cures status ailments. It will also cure Aizen's status ailments.
Body Slam could Paralyze Aizen giving him a small chance of becoming immobile from being "fully paralyzed" sometimes. This depends on him being in range of it, though.
Overgrow boosts Meganium's power with Grass moves when its "in a pinch"/low on health.
Meganium can use both Reflect & Light Screen to halve damage from just about anything Aizen can throw at it. Reflect halves physical attack damage, Light Screen halves "special" attack damage.
If Meganium can poison Aizen with PoisonPowder, it can help wear down Aizen, or help combat his Regenerationn, if he has it in this form.
Meganium can use Synthesis to heal, which heals more if there's heavy sunlight.
Meganium can use Sweet Scent to allure/distract Aizen with a pleasant aroma, likely making him easier to hit with what offenses it has.
Meganium, in battle, releases an aroma that soothes & becalms emotions. In battle, like here, it releases more to blunt the foe's fighting spirit, which could possibly make Aizen have more trouble fighting back.
Even while hypnotized, if Meganium can control what it does, it can attack everything around it with Petal Blizzard, or use a homing attack via Magical Leaf, the leaves of which themselves chase the target, apparently. This provides Meganium semi-reliable means of attacking Aizen even at range or under the effects of Kyōka Suigetsu.
Aizen's biggest advantages are making Meganium's senses worthless, so that it's hard for it to detect him, & his pseudo-flight allowing him to keep mostly out of range & use his own ranged attacks. If his 7-B stats form also has Reality Warping &/or Regneration, this could also be useful.
If it can still control what it does, though, as mentioned, Meganium has ways of fighting, even if it can't see, hear, smell, feel or taste to detect them.
The fact that it can halve the damage of attacks, block statuses in several ways, heal & Poison Aizen means it could have an advantage in the long term.
I have my doubts about Kyōka Suigetsu giving Aizen an easy win here. I don't know how his Reality Warping works, though, nor if he has it or his Regenerationn in this form.
I'll laugh if Aizen's profile ends up with a win against Groudon & a loss against MEGANIUM of all things. XD
Hopefully my points seem valid, & dare I do it, I vote: Meganium High Difficulty, for being able to attack everything around it, homing attacks, damage halving, healing, status blocking & curing, scent-based alluring/distracting/becalming/battle-spirit-blunting & via PoisonPowder... err... poisoning.
Without complete knowledge of Aizen's RW nor knowing if he has it &/or how good his Regenerationn is, in his 7-B stats form as the OP specified here, I'm not sure his hypnosis, pseudo-flight, range & stats are enough for him to win here, silly of me as that may be.
- 16,959
- 4,855
To be fair here Aizen might not think to use it on KS as I'm sure he'll believe Meganiums intelligence as a wild Dino will be no more greater than a Menos Grandes so KS might not be used right from the beginning.
But at the same time Aizen will likely feel the idea of just kidding Meganium down so he can end it faster (which is why my vote is still with him regardless).
But at the same time Aizen will likely feel the idea of just kidding Meganium down so he can end it faster (which is why my vote is still with him regardless).
- 10,111
- 3,789
I apologize, but I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "just kidding Meganium down". No offense meant.ProfessorKukui4Life said:
If you mean using his hypnosis to trick Meganium into thinking he's in one place, then actually being elsewhere & attacking.... Meganium still has the seemingly omnidirectional attack of Petal Blizzard & Magical Leaf for a homing attack.
If you mean "just kidding" as in "just using his Kidō", I'm not sure what among his spells would win. His barriers? Hadō #63: Raikōhō (ÚøÀÕÉ╝þé«, Thunder Roar Sear; Viz "Fiery Lightning Howl") or Hadō #99: Goryütenmetsu (õ║öÚ¥ìÞ╗óµ╗à, Five Swirling Dragons of Destruction) which may be resisted for possibly being Electric or Ground type against Meganium respectively, nevermind Reflect & Light Screen's damage halving.
Maybe Hadō #90: Kurohitsugi (Ú╗Ƶú║, Black Coffin)?
Or maybe "just kidding Meganium down" as in turning it into a kid or something with his reality warping?
I apologize for my verbosity & misunderstanding, but I fail to see what you're getting at. So sorry.
- 16,959
- 4,855
My bad auto correct. I meant Kidoing him down. Kido.
- 1,670
- 145
Aizen for reasons above.
- 1,099
- 47
Well dam lol Aizen takes this via KS and kido.
- 1,499
- 259
Aizen for reasons already mentioned above
- 10,111
- 3,789
Well, again, are his kido enough to get past Reflect, Light Screen, & the healing from Synthesis?
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Sosuke_Aize
Looking at his page, the ones listed seem mostly to be barriers, & the 3 offensive spells I mentioned earlier, an invisibility spell, & 3 kinds of barrier spells. 2 of those spells may possibly be resisted.
While they do seem useful, can they overcome possibly being resisted? Possibly having their damage halved by Reflect/Light Screen? Does Aizen have the stamina & ability to spam them enough to overwhelm Meganium?
He could also be on a time limit, to some degree, if he's Poisoned.
It may also be possible for Meganium to attack while he's casting these, & if Overgrow triggers, Meganium's offenses with Grass moves become even stronger, possibly putting more pressure on him while he's trying to attack.
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Sosuke_Aize
Looking at his page, the ones listed seem mostly to be barriers, & the 3 offensive spells I mentioned earlier, an invisibility spell, & 3 kinds of barrier spells. 2 of those spells may possibly be resisted.
While they do seem useful, can they overcome possibly being resisted? Possibly having their damage halved by Reflect/Light Screen? Does Aizen have the stamina & ability to spam them enough to overwhelm Meganium?
He could also be on a time limit, to some degree, if he's Poisoned.
It may also be possible for Meganium to attack while he's casting these, & if Overgrow triggers, Meganium's offenses with Grass moves become even stronger, possibly putting more pressure on him while he's trying to attack.
- 5,232
- 708
- Thread starter
- #17
Aizen can likely use any kidou or bakudo excluding the forbidden ones Tessai showed, considering he is the only known user of the strongest/hardest kidou.
- 10,111
- 3,789
Fair enough. I was assuming we would've gone by the feats about what Kido he can use, but I suppose the statements should hold up.
I can see why that would give him an overwhelming versatility advantage. I was just going by the spells listed on his page.
Also, having thought on it, I think I may have underestimated Kyōka Suigetsu. If Aizen can deceive all 5 senses, he can also create the illusion of him being in sight, not being damaged by attacks, etc.
Or being damaged by attacks.
As well as prevent Meganium from realizing he IS somewhere else, as opposed to in front of it. since he has control of its sight, hearing, sense of smell, touch & taste.
Either way, if employed it could lead to Meganium fighting an imaginary opponent the whole battle. Assuming KS also controls the sense of pain & Meganium doesn't cue in that the attacks aren't coming from the source KS depicts them as coming from.
....Or Aizen could just co-ordinate it so that reality & the hypnosis's indication of where the sources of pain are DO match up, but he keeps moving out of that position.
Or make Meganium believe it's fighting a losing battle, or mislead it into using the wrong techniques, I suppose.
Having thought on it, it would probably be sheer luck if Meganium did use Petal Blizzard/Magical Leaf once under the influence of KS.
Other than Reflect/LS, Synthesis & PoisonPowder, the biggest things in Meganium's favour is Aizen might underestimate Meganium as a mere beast &/or initially choose not to fight it. Safeguard, in theory, may also protect it against KS & some of the spells, as could Leaf Guard, with proper weather.
His engaging it in combat could also be delayed by Meganium's scents released in combat blunting his will to fight. Possibly giving set-up time or adding time he could spend poisoned, if he does end up so. Sweet Scent might also aid in that respect.
But yeah. Having thought on it, although Meganium might have ways to combat KS, Aizen probably wins via the versatility advantage of being able to use literally ALL of the Kidou spells, & used at its best, KS could still provide a good tactical advantage.
Boy do I feel embarassed now.
Changing my vote to Aizen, low-med difficulty.
I can see why that would give him an overwhelming versatility advantage. I was just going by the spells listed on his page.
Also, having thought on it, I think I may have underestimated Kyōka Suigetsu. If Aizen can deceive all 5 senses, he can also create the illusion of him being in sight, not being damaged by attacks, etc.
Or being damaged by attacks.
As well as prevent Meganium from realizing he IS somewhere else, as opposed to in front of it. since he has control of its sight, hearing, sense of smell, touch & taste.
Either way, if employed it could lead to Meganium fighting an imaginary opponent the whole battle. Assuming KS also controls the sense of pain & Meganium doesn't cue in that the attacks aren't coming from the source KS depicts them as coming from.
....Or Aizen could just co-ordinate it so that reality & the hypnosis's indication of where the sources of pain are DO match up, but he keeps moving out of that position.
Or make Meganium believe it's fighting a losing battle, or mislead it into using the wrong techniques, I suppose.
Having thought on it, it would probably be sheer luck if Meganium did use Petal Blizzard/Magical Leaf once under the influence of KS.
Other than Reflect/LS, Synthesis & PoisonPowder, the biggest things in Meganium's favour is Aizen might underestimate Meganium as a mere beast &/or initially choose not to fight it. Safeguard, in theory, may also protect it against KS & some of the spells, as could Leaf Guard, with proper weather.
His engaging it in combat could also be delayed by Meganium's scents released in combat blunting his will to fight. Possibly giving set-up time or adding time he could spend poisoned, if he does end up so. Sweet Scent might also aid in that respect.
But yeah. Having thought on it, although Meganium might have ways to combat KS, Aizen probably wins via the versatility advantage of being able to use literally ALL of the Kidou spells, & used at its best, KS could still provide a good tactical advantage.
Boy do I feel embarassed now.
Changing my vote to Aizen, low-med difficulty.
