Adding Weaknesses to Phenomena intervention

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

Before we dive in to weaknesses, I just want to add Type 5 Immortality to the PI page. It's pretty much already accepted. Look at Kokonoe and Terumi for example.

Okay, I forgot some weaknesses to PI. I'll get straight to the point:

• Observation is, to some users, extremely tiring and takes a lot of energy. It is also the reason why some use of PI needs extreme amount of seithr to do so. This is evident in Kokonoe's case, when her observing two people is enough to tire her out. This is also especially true with self-observation, as shown with Terumi in Wheel of Fortune CD, when he is puking because of the toll of the constant use of self-observation.
• Self-observation, a type of observation when a user observe her/himself, is temporary, at least to normal users. This is evident with Terumi's case, when his appearance into the world during Ragna's childhood were temporary and only had weeks at least during Central Fiction.
• Observation, while it is a powerful ability, can't make something that is virtually impossible to a reality. This is stated during the conversation of Naoto and Raquel, when she stated that Phenomena Intervention can't make something impossible possible, which is evident with how Phenomena Intervention works.
• Observation is sometimes uncontrollable even by the user. Es and Nobody, even with their mastery of Phenomena Intervention, cannot stop the Embryo from passively altering reality with Phenomena Intervention. This is also true when the user has some sort of mental instability or has extreme emotional conditions. This is shown when Noel was subconsciously started Continuum Shift against her will, due to the panic and anger she is feeling alongside various mental abuse she took from Terumi.
• Users of self-observation doesn't automatically make them observers. The most popular example if this is Black Beast and Nox Nyctores, former being Anti-Observer Armament due to constantly observing itself and the latter constantly observing itself to keep its power strong or growing.

Also btw, since Terumi can be tired as stated above, his base stamina shouldn't be infinite and should be Extremely High instead.

 

[Theglassman12]

Was that ever mentioned that it tired her out? Cause it wasn't an issue for her in CP or CF when she was still able to observe two people and still fight.

yeah I can get behind this.

Was this in bloodedge or something else? other than that, seems fine.

agree

I feel it's a bit contradictory for them not to be observers when they can do something as crazy as self observation, but that's just me.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

Well, not literally tired and more like "maxed out". Like a train with too much passengers. She's observing too much people.

Yeah it's in Bloodedge.

Well, BB and NN has no supporting evidence of them being observers at all, especially when the latter is observed by normal souls.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

I also still have the issue of us treating it as though PI unleashes all the effects listed at once. I don't ever remember that happening thus making PI pretty much a grabbag.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

We never treat like it release all of it at once tho? You mean the Es' case? Es and her Embryo is a special case because the effects of PI is virtually randomized, thus is considered to be able to release any effects on the fly to not make it any more confusing in VSB and not make it a dice game.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

Or you mean that every PI users has access to all of the usage of PI at once? Yeah, I had that problem. I argued but the majority disagreed with me saying that Type 1 and 2 does not differentiate from different set of abilities, just the scale of those abilities. Being minority, I just stopped arguing. But I think we can add this.

• Some usage of Phenomena Intervention can't be used properly by some users, or at least can't be used on scale that it can be usable in terms of battle. This is evident with Clavis when he can use Observation to stop time but isn't strong enough to warp reality.

 

[Theglassman12]

I also still have the issue of us treating it as though PI unleashes all the effects listed at once. I don't ever remember that happening thus making PI pretty much a grabbag.

I don't recall ever saying that PI makes the characters nuke the other with all the hax. The only ones we argued that does do that are the embryo ones and arguably Noel cause of the games she has the Azure powers she subconsciously makes PI.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

I argue that Noel only has "passive" in specific, very specific circumstances. And even then only use of PI that is subconscious is Probability.

 

[Theglassman12]

Not really, there's more shit that she did like create a pocket dimension that she can warp to her liking, freeze time, and essentially everything the embryo did in CF considering she was the source of the Embryo maintaining existence.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

Oh, the pocket dimension isn't passive, it's response to Amaterasu's PI. Being basically a battery doesn't mean it has power of a remote.

 

[Theglassman12]

No it wasn't cause of Amaterasu's PI. Both the arcade and story mode in CP, Noel just subconsciously made it when Izanami was going crazy with Takamagahara's PI and rachel points it out that her will essentially made a counter to it with her own PI.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

So it's not passive, because it is a response to an attack, not activated automatically just because.

 

[Theglassman12]

it was automatically as her will subconsiously reacted to the power.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

Yes, but it is not passive because it should have a response from the opposition.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

Can this be added?

 

[Theglassman12]

I guess so

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

This would be helpful in knowing the limits of using these powers, so I agree.

 

[AKM sama]

I unlocked the page. Tell me here when you're done so this thread can be closed too.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

Done. These can be closed.

 

[AKM sama]

Okay.