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A Quick PMMM Downgrade
- Thread starter SomebodyData
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- 2,347
- 488
Honestly, the "Heaven" being not higher than a timeline is a bit illogical, given that would means there are infinite versions of it exists throughout the Multiverse.
But the production notes only said there is only one heaven, which would suggest that the heaven encompassed every timelines and thus beyond the conventional timeline.
I would say just gives them "Possibly/likely Low 1-C" next to their 2-A rating.
But the production notes only said there is only one heaven, which would suggest that the heaven encompassed every timelines and thus beyond the conventional timeline.
I would say just gives them "Possibly/likely Low 1-C" next to their 2-A rating.
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Was it ever established that heaven is higher than the universe?. And when magical girls die do they go there? cause it will contradicts it being an higher dimensions.
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Actually it will not contradict if they ascend when die like some verse
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How's that a contradiction?
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I wasn't thinking of that while typing
Agnaa
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That's not what that means. It could simply be a space separate from all timelines, but not qualitatively superior to them.
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How could a space be separated from timelines yet, still claims it still bound to it? It's pretty quite clear the heaven is on higher plane.
Kyubey using the word "universe" in its explanation could also be refers to timeline, given that next after that Madoka used the word "timeline" as much as Kyubey uses the word "universe".
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The crack of time in dbh is exactly like this it's a separate space from the infinite time line.
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Unless this crack of time states to be "higher", then it's not the same thing.
Besides, a space separates of timeline already exists in PMMM. And the Heaven is higher than this space.
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- Thread starter
- #93
Akemi Ya kinda debunks your whole Heaven argument Beast, unless you think base Homura is Low 1-C.
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There is nothing that says lower D being cannot enter higher dimensional space. Gurren Lagann is a prime example.
Beside, Akemi ya is stated to be in between timelines and not higher than them. The one that is higher is the heaven.
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- #96
Regidian
Not base Homura, but Wraith Arc Homura
Beast
Sure, but then there is nothing stopping from saying UM is a 4-D being entering a 5-D space in that case.
With higher meaning what? Like the FAQ stated, in the case of afterlifes in particular it just be pointing to its place in the cosmology, not that it's 5-D.
Not base Homura, but Wraith Arc Homura
Beast
Sure, but then there is nothing stopping from saying UM is a 4-D being entering a 5-D space in that case.
With higher meaning what? Like the FAQ stated, in the case of afterlifes in particular it just be pointing to its place in the cosmology, not that it's 5-D.
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That is kind of a false equivalence. We both know that is not the case with Madoka since she herself, kind of became the heaven itself. If the heaven is in 5-D space, then Madoka is 5-D too.
Except it kind of debunk your argument about "Madoka seeing all the timelines" due to her Omnipresent, instead of "She sees all.timelines like dots that connected by lines".
This scan tells us about the location of Akemi ya or at least, the dimension that Akemi ya resides in. It stated to be outside of timeline, which shouldn't be anything less than 4-D as far as I know.
The heaven or Madoka herself should be on higher plane than the dimension Akemi ya located in.
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- Thread starter
- #98
Left that out considering it would upgrade every magical girl in heaven (as they are apart of heaven) to low 1-C too but didn't think it'd go that far.
Which describes Madoka's perspective, not the realm's size.
Low 2-C Homuras from Akemi Ya isn't much of an improvement in consistency here. Also just being outside a timeline is def not 4-D.
Higher plane, sure. 2x Higher dimensional, not really stated.
Which describes Madoka's perspective, not the realm's size.
Low 2-C Homuras from Akemi Ya isn't much of an improvement in consistency here. Also just being outside a timeline is def not 4-D.
Higher plane, sure. 2x Higher dimensional, not really stated.
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I mean, the LoC assistants aren't even 2-A to begin with, you even refused it when I proposed in a CRT that only their hax that scaled to that level. Why do you suddenly brings up the subject now?
Why in the world do you think Homuras are Low 2-C? It's not like they created that dimension or something.
I mean, I'm not even sure myself. Timeline is a 4 dimensional construct, but with the whole outside =/= higher, I can't just say Akemi ya is within a dimension located in 5-D space. But I don't think the dimension located in 3-D space is correct either, 4-D is the only thing I could think of.
It doesn't need 2x higher statement when if context shows it's higher than 4-D construct.
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- #100
Because at no point did we ever treat Heaven as a higher dimensional plane above the multiverse or timeline beforehand?
I'm not the one claiming Akemi-Ya is 4-D or 5-D...
The entire omnipresence argument provides supporting evidence sure, but it's nowhere near enough for an argument. Especially considering that the omnipresence would occur with or without the realm.
I'm not the one claiming Akemi-Ya is 4-D or 5-D...
The entire omnipresence argument provides supporting evidence sure, but it's nowhere near enough for an argument. Especially considering that the omnipresence would occur with or without the realm.
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Yeah I agree with SD
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Higher plane here is existing outside of 4-D, nothing says that it's superior to 4-D
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If this refers to first part of my precious reply, then this doesn't answer my question. Even back then Madoka is 2-A, you don't agree that LoC assistants should scale to Madoka for being one with her, even in hax potency only. So why you suddenly brings up they should scale as if you agree to it beforehand?
Akemi ya is the restaurant within a dimension outside of timelines. Never claims the restaurant itself to be 4-D except for its location.
Omnipresent could also occurs outside or higher though.
Never claimed dimension where Akemi ya located is higher than 4-D though.
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So both akemi ya and heaven are not 5-D
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Akemi ya is a restaurant inside of a dimension that is located outside of timeline, as far as I know, that means Akemi ya is located in 4-D space.
Agnaa
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Not being bound by something doesn't mean it's a higher plane.
A realm not being bound by a timeline doesn't make that realm superior to the timeline, it can just be separate. Multiverse over here, separate realm over there, no qualitative superiority necessary.
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Akemi ya being 4D doesn't mean heaven is 5-D
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Most agree with the downgrade for the time being, but Ultima and SD are still in talks I believe
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- Thread starter
- #111
I don't think Ultima really cares given he's been active since his last response.
Not to mention, we've been kinda derailed from the original purpose of the thread; the current reasoning for low 1-C is bunk, so 2-A is here to stay for now.
Not to mention, we've been kinda derailed from the original purpose of the thread; the current reasoning for low 1-C is bunk, so 2-A is here to stay for now.
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Downgrade all the low 1-C stuff back to 2-A
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I'm tired, but I will find it later
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- #117
Basically the record metaphor used to upgrade the character to low 1-C is neither supposed to be taken literally or even low 1-C
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@SomebodyData Somewhat unrelated, but can you message me on my wall when you have the time?
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- #120
Yep
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