𝟨-𝐵 𝒯𝑜𝓊𝓇𝓃𝒶𝓂𝑒𝓃𝓉: 𝒲𝑜𝓇𝓁𝒹 𝒪𝒻 𝑀𝒶𝑔𝒾𝒸, 𝑀𝒜𝒮𝐻 𝐵𝒰𝑅𝒩𝐸𝒟𝐸𝒜𝒟 𝒱𝒮 𝒦𝒪𝒰𝒦𝐼

[Arnoldstone18]

Welcome to the 6-B Tournament: World Of Magic. Please see here for more information on this tournament.

---

@AnAverageUsername vs @Expectro2000xxx ​

In the grand arena, where dreams take flight,
The semi-finals commence, a captivating sight.
Two warriors of power, destiny intertwine,
Mash Burnedead and Kouki, their strength will shine.

Mash, born without magic in a world full of spell,
Endured persecution, his story they would tell.
Trained in the arts of physical might,
To survive and prove his valorous light.

A student at Easton Magic Academy he became,
Faking magic, striving for greatness, not in name.
But a revelation emerged, a truth unforeseen,
Mash, a vessel created by Innocent Zero's scheme.

Kouki Amanogawa, a hero with a righteous heart,
Summoned to another world, a brand new start.
Blessed with holy magic, his purpose was clear,
To vanquish evil and allay any fear.

A noble soul, guided by justice and grace,
His journey fraught with challenges he'd embrace.
With unwavering loyalty, his path unfolds,
A beacon of hope, as the tale of heroism molds.

In the semi-finals, their powers collide,
Mash's resilience against Kouki's noble stride.
Muscles and magic entwined in the fray,
As destiny's dance unfolds, lighting the way.

Cheers erupt from the crowd, excitement swells,
In this tournament of champions, where legend dwells.
Two worlds converge, their strength put to the test,
May the victor rise, and the defeated find rest.

In the grand arena, where valor is crowned,
Semi-finals commence, with thunderous sound.
Mash and Kouki, let your spirits ignite,
May the true champion emerge in this glorious fight.

​

Punk Hazard​

MASH BURNEDEAD VS KOUKI AMANOGAWA​

Mash Burnedead scales above 80 Teratons, UPM Restricted, and Kouki Amanogawa scales above 55 Teratons. ​

• Speed Equalized
• Starting distance 10km apart and away from each other's line of sight
• Standard Equipment Permitted; Optional Equipment will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis.
• Fighters only have knowledge of their opponent's appearance and at least a vague sense of awareness of any dangerous (mid to high mid hax) abilities they possess.
• There will be civilians and vehicles in the area depending on the location of the battlefield. In other words business is as usual in those locations and battles spontaneously happens and disrupts it, however, the location's defenses will not go against the fighters so that their fight isn't impeded.
• Fighters are in character
• Stat Amps and Debuffs can not limit opponents above or below their tier respectively.
• Victory will be decided via Death or Incap or any other ways your opponents are unable to continue battle.
• The match will last up to 7 days to conclude. Otherwise, the participants with the most votes advance. In the event of no votes, the most active participants advance. In the event both participants were actively debating, then matches will be decided based on a coin flip.

 

[Noneless21]

Oh....

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Oh....

Oh?

 

[AnAverageUsername]

We meet again

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Anyways it's been so long since last time, what does Kouki begin with

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Lets wait for @Expectro2000xxx

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Wait why is kouki posted at 7 Teratons, hes supposed to be at 55 right?

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Wait why is kouki posted at 7 Teratons, hes supposed to be at 55 right?

My laptop restarted to si had to make this whole thing all over again and just missed that little detail hehe

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Oh God, looking at Kouki's profile, what the hell is that formatting

 

[Noneless21]

Oh God, looking at Kouki's profile, what the hell is that formatting

the inferior formatting fr even though I agree to it

though it's needed since it got so clogged up, not even hyperlink and bolded p&a can save it

 

[AnAverageUsername]

the inferior formatting fr even though I agree to it

though it's needed since it got so clogged up, not even hyperlink and bolded p&a can save it

The fate of an Isekai character

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

again

 

[AnAverageUsername]

again

Round 3, the match for the ages

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Anyways it's been so long since last time, what does Kouki begin with

Talk with the other side to try to convince to not fight (while fighting himself though) and when that don't work (which is basically always because he always face mindless beings or super bad people) go serious and use Serene Mind to kill with a swordmanship that the opponent can't register nor react.

Though since the fight begin with so much distance he instead of normal swordmanship would go with the kilometers sized sword or his kilometers in size light dragon, other possiblity are also the army of light dragons but those normally come after the big light dragon.

As I commented in the skilled list (and in my wall) currently I'm not really in the mood of have long ass discussions about skill, so I'm not really bother much with that, specially since these two already fought before and their skill paragraphs were talked there.

The main difference from what I remember compared with the other thread is that this Kouki have Auralodde so a cut with one of his swords can fill the insides of the opponent with plants that cause a quite gruesome death, that and the fact that his light dragon breath was buffed with the release of vol 12 and now the thing annihilate the opponent at molecular level.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Talk with the other side to try to convince to not fight (while fighting himself though)

By fighting himself, what does that mean? Like, he talks to the opponent while fighting them?

and when that don't work (which is basically always because he always face mindless beings or super bad people) go serious and use Serene Mind to kill with a swordmanship that the opponent can't register nor react.

Is there a video or image of Serene Mind?

Though since the fight begin with so much distance he instead of normal swordmanship would go with the kilometers sized sword or his kilometers in size light dragon, other possiblity are also the army of light dragons but those normally come after the big light dragon.

Mash should be able to dodge this with his senses, mainly the long sword part. Light dragon might be tougher to avoid, but Mash can move underground and fly to help avoid stuff

As I commented in the skilled list (and in my wall) currently I'm not really in the mood of have long ass discussions about skill, so I'm not really bother much with that, specially since these two already fought before and their skill paragraphs were talked there.

Yeah, we don't need another essay over skill from each of them. I'm pretty sure we even got to the point where they're basically even.

The main difference from what I remember compared with the other thread is that this Kouki have Auralodde so a cut with one of his swords can fill the insides of the opponent with plants that cause a quite gruesome death, that and the fact that his light dragon breath was buffed with the release of vol 12 and now the thing annihilate the opponent at molecular level.

Mash should, again, be able to sense the dangers behind these attacks with his instinctive reaction and Info Analysis. Again, the light dragon would be a problem (because Light Novels can't help but one up themselves), but Mash's variety of acrobatics and traversal methods, and previously mentioned senses should help avoid these. Not to mention, Mash has an absurd LS advantage, so a one shot grapple is always an option.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

By fighting himself, what does that mean? Like, he talks to the opponent while fighting them?

Is there a video or image of Serene Mind?

Mash should be able to dodge this with his senses, mainly the long sword part. Light dragon might be tougher to avoid, but Mash can move underground and fly to help avoid stuff

Yeah, we don't need another essay over skill from each of them. I'm pretty sure we even got to the point where they're basically even.


Mash should, again, be able to sense the dangers behind these attacks with his instinctive reaction and Info Analysis. Again, the light dragon would be a problem (because Light Novels can't help but one up themselves), but Mash's variety of acrobatics and traversal methods, and previously mentioned senses should help avoid these. Not to mention, Mash has an absurd LS advantage, so a one shot grapple is always an option.

I mean that normally while he try to go the pacifist route with other they tend to ignore him and attack him regardles, so he defend by fighting back while still trying to convince them.

First of all, Serene Mind is literally just a state of mind, it's just the state of mind he reached from be so good with the sword and the state of mind he enter when fighting seriously (so when he decide that there is no possibility of settle things by talking). Second of all, Serene Mind were introduced around chapter 275 of the web novel, the light novel have only adapted until the 179 in vol 13, and the anime have only adapted until vol 6 of the light novel, so there will be no visual in at the very least another 7 years if things go super well and get adapted miraculously fast.

The sword is at least 3 kilometers in size, and I say at least because Hajime and Kousuke believed he could reach the 13 kilometers and that was before he got buffed by getting Aularodde, and with his swordmanship added on top it would make it even harder. Flying don't do much since Kouki is more than accustomed to fight flying enemies as that become super common early in the story, two of his most recents fights was even against armies of thousands of enemies able to fly (either with wings, air manip or gravity manip which was common between apparition gods), enemies that move underground aren't as common but still aren't something unheard of as there were both normal monsters and apparitions able to do that, he also have his own senses, instincts and Aularodde senses to further help sensing him.

At the initial distance? Yeah, I could see him dodging them, at something like 2-3 kilometers however? No, the attacks are simply too big and his opponent isn't bad enough to leave some sort of super gap for him to just close that without having to tank damage (and tanking the dragon breath is straight up death), not to mention that those things aren't unfamiliar to him (as he could for example land hits on Hajime) or he just possess them. For that he would need not only to close completely the distance while surviving the previous things but would also need to directly face hin cqc were Kouki actually shine the most as that's his specialty, and even in if he pass all of those things and choke him with Kouki natural regen he would recover too fast on top of the assistance from both his swords to help him (the two swords have consciouness, two goddess that love Kouki are inside each of them), and that's only in the best case that Kouki War Demon just don't let him ignore the lack of oxygen and continue fighting (as with it he can continue fighting as long he have either a body or mana to sustain his broken body).

 

[AnAverageUsername]

I mean that normally while he try to go the pacifist route with other they tend to ignore him and attack him regardles, so he defend by fighting back while still trying to convince them.

So he rolls a 4 out of 10 on Speech, got it

First of all, Serene Mind is literally just a state of mind, it's just the state of mind he reached from be so good with the sword and the state of mind he enter when fighting seriously (so when he decide that there is no possibility of settle things by talking). Second of all, Serene Mind were introduced around chapter 275 of the web novel, the light novel have only adapted until the 179 in vol 13, and the anime have only adapted until vol 6 of the light novel, so there will be no visual in at the very least another 7 years if things go super well and get adapted miraculously fast.

7 YEARS?!?!?! How can you deal with this.... oh wait, I'm a JoJo fan

So basically, he just gets better at sword techniques in this state yeah?

The sword is at least 3 kilometers in size, and I say at least because Hajime and Kousuke believed he could reach the 13 kilometers and that was before he got buffed by getting Aularodde, and with his swordmanship added on top it would make it even harder. Flying don't do much since Kouki is more than accustomed to fight flying enemies as that become super common early in the story, two of his most recents fights was even against armies of thousands of enemies able to fly (either with wings, air manip or gravity manip which was common between apparition gods), enemies that move underground aren't as common but still aren't something unheard of as there were both normal monsters and apparitions able to do that, he also have his own senses, instincts and Aularodde senses to further help sensing him.

I'm just saying the extra mobility options Mash has help here. Also, in which way does this word grow. I'm assuming in length, but does it also extend in width?

At the initial distance? Yeah, I could see him dodging them, at something like 2-3 kilometers however? No, the attacks are simply too big and his opponent isn't bad enough to leave some sort of super gap for him to just close that without having to tank damage (and tanking the dragon breath is straight up death), not to mention that those things aren't unfamiliar to him (as he could for example land hits on Hajime) or he just possess them. For that he would need not only to close completely the distance while surviving the previous things but would also need to directly face hin cqc were Kouki actually shine the most as that's his specialty, and even in if he pass all of those things and choke him with Kouki natural regen he would recover too fast on top of the assistance from both his swords to help him (the two swords have consciouness, two goddess that love Kouki are inside each of them), and that's only in the best case that Kouki War Demon just don't let him ignore the lack of oxygen and continue fighting (as with it he can continue fighting as long he have either a body or mana to sustain his broken body).

Again, as said above, which way does the sword grow. I'm not going to get into CQC stuff since that's also getting into a skill debate and we don't want that, but Mash's choking isn't about crushing the neck. It's squeezing the opponent's airway in a near instant, preventing oxygen and blood from reaching the brain thus causing hallucinations as the opponent gets knocked out.

Also how durable is this sword? Just asking, since Kouki probably has an ability to bring back swords.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

So he rolls a 4 out of 10 on Speech, got it

7 YEARS?!?!?! How can you deal with this.... oh wait, I'm a JoJo fan

So basically, he just gets better at sword techniques in this state yeah?

I'm just saying the extra mobility options Mash has help here. Also, in which way does this word grow. I'm assuming in length, but does it also extend in width?

Again, as said above, which way does the sword grow. I'm not going to get into CQC stuff since that's also getting into a skill debate and we don't want that, but Mash's choking isn't about crushing the neck. It's squeezing the opponent's airway in a near instant, preventing oxygen and blood from reaching the brain thus causing hallucinations as the opponent gets knocked out.

Also how durable is this sword? Just asking, since Kouki probably has an ability to bring back swords.

He is actually quite charismatic, so the fact that he can't talk most of the enemies in his arcs is to show how bad they were or how hopeless comunication was: Dark Beings were creatures who felt so much disgust for the concepts of peace and cohexistence they all would had prefered to die than to live like that, The machines soldiers didn't had any consciouness and Mother was a tyrant that reduced a humanity that reached the stars to just a hundred thousand, the apparitions lost all consciouness due to the polution of their world and due to effects of The Dragon, etc.

That's being super optimistic and hoping that at least two other seasons of the anime are made after the third season already announced, so in a realistic sense it would be far more than that.

Yes, is essentially the difference between his mindset being no-serious to serious.

It was mainly show to gro in length (as at the time it was the only ranged option he had due to not be able to use magic) but the sword have show to be able to freely change her form both in length, width and general shape, so it shouldn't have any problem also expanding that much.

Just superficially mentioned it to show all the burdens he would need to pass just to try that option that most likely wouldn't actually finish the fight. Due to War Demon he continued to fight for days while basically having no more blood and unconscious.

Too durable to even consider the possibility of Mash breaking it, the first sword didn't even had a scratch after be used to fight against Ehit by the first hero (who was far weaker than this Kouki btw) and even a tier 5 Hajime thought it was amazing the sword and wanted to personally investigate it (this before it was revealed that it was the goddess of the world Tortus who took form to fight against Ehit), while the second is another world goddess who should be comparable to Lutria, so it's literally impossible for Mash to break them or even damage them.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

He is actually quite charismatic, so the fact that he can't talk most of the enemies in his arcs is to show how bad they were or how hopeless comunication was: Dark Beings were creatures who felt so much disgust for the concepts of peace and cohexistence they all would had prefered to die than to live like that, The machines soldiers didn't had any consciouness and Mother was a tyrant that reduced a humanity that reached the stars to just a hundred thousand, the apparitions lost all consciouness due to the polution of their world and due to effects of The Dragon, etc.

Well he wouldn't want to face Innocent Zero then

That's being super optimistic and hoping that at least two other seasons of the anime are made after the third season already announced, so in a realistic sense it would be far more than that.

I pity you

Yes, is essentially the difference between his mindset being no-serious to serious.

The equivalent of a gamer leaning forward in their chair

It was mainly show to gro in length (as at the time it was the only ranged option he had due to not be able to use magic) but the sword have show to be able to freely change her form both in length, width and general shape, so it shouldn't have any problem also expanding that much.

I see. I mean it's quite large, but with Mash's acrobatics and instincts the sword shouldn't be much of a problem to dodge

Just superficially mentioned it to show all the burdens he would need to pass just to try that option that most likely wouldn't actually finish the fight. Due to War Demon he continued to fight for days while basically having no more blood and unconscious.

I mean, there's a difference between being wounded to the point of blood loss and directly having blood and oxygen shut off from the brain directly, right? Also, on the topic of stamina, what level is it? Like, how long he can fight with injuries.

Too durable to even consider the possibility of Mash breaking it, the first sword didn't even had a scratch after be used to fight against Ehit by the first hero (who was far weaker than this Kouki btw) and even a tier 5 Hajime thought it was amazing the sword and wanted to personally investigate it (this before it was revealed that it was the goddess of the world Tortus who took form to fight against Ehit), while the second is another world goddess who should be comparable to Lutria, so it's literally impossible for Mash to break them or even damage them.

Fair enough enough, but what about making Kouki let go of his sword?

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

So basically, he just gets better at sword techniques in this state yeah?

It's his version of Ultra instinct, people can't read his body or mind.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

The equivalent of a gamer leaning forward in their chair

I see. I mean it's quite large, but with Mash's acrobatics and instincts the sword shouldn't be much of a problem to dodge

I mean, there's a difference between being wounded to the point of blood loss and directly having blood and oxygen shut off from the brain directly, right? Also, on the topic of stamina, what level is it? Like, how long he can fight with injuries.

Fair enough enough, but what about making Kouki let go of his sword?

Correct.

As I said, at some distance yes, but at so close there is no much that acrobatics and senses can let you do when facing attacks the size of mountains.

To understand his injuries just read this scan (second and third image specific his state while the first show him fight like that), he fought like that for three days (well, the first day he still was in a more recognizable state, but he still was seeing the other side from how grave his state was and that was before even gain War Demon to be able to fight longer), and that fight while 1) Not having his standard equipment outside of his sword (so no armor absorption or recovery medicine from Hajime), in a situation where he couldn't use magic (so no recovery magic, including Divine Veil that would periodically heal him) outside of War Demon (and that's because War Demon isn't really magic and more just the control of his internal energy), and while actually spending all his energy (outside of the vere minimun to use War Demon) in big ass barrier to protect a city from thousands of Dark Beings for days, And on top of that even before his arcs were he did all of the previously mentioned he already stated to be able to fight for three days as long he didn't lost blood and made water to drink in combat, so what his arcs did was to buff this to be able to fight for that long even if half dead.

Even if he didn't wanted the sword and tried to left it behind the sword will automatically go to his (because as I said it have a goddess that love him inside), which is the only reason of why he had his sword at all in the above fights despite not having the rest of his equipment.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Correct.

As I said, at some distance yes, but at so close there is no much that acrobatics and senses can let you do when facing attacks the size of mountains.

Well at that point Mash still has options to dig underground and reach up close the rest of the way, or he could shorten the distance with Big Bang Dash.

To understand his injuries just read this scan (second and third image specific his state while the first show him fight like that), he fought like that for three days (well, the first day he still was in a more recognizable state, but he still was seeing the other side from how grave his state was and that was before even gain War Demon to be able to fight longer), and that fight while 1) Not having his standard equipment outside of his sword (so no armor absorption or recovery medicine from Hajime), in a situation where he couldn't use magic (so no recovery magic, including Divine Veil that would periodically heal him) outside of War Demon (and that's because War Demon isn't really magic and more just the control of his internal energy), and while actually spending all his energy (outside of the vere minimun to use War Demon) in big ass barrier to protect a city from thousands of Dark Beings for days, And on top of that even before his arcs were he did all of the previously mentioned he already stated to be able to fight for three days as long he didn't lost blood and made water to drink in combat, so what his arcs did was to buff this to be able to fight for that long even if half dead.

So he basically has good enough willpower to keep fighting unconscious and with several injuries, in a simple explanation yeah?

And so his stamina is around 3-days? Well Mash did train for around a month, said training being to the point where he had to fight animated armors so far above himself he had no choice but to adapt. Not sure if this would compare, but it's good to point out. Also, though it comes after his Post-Meliadoul training, Mash even with his heart ripped out has enough determination to get right back up and fight again, and was only stopped by being pinned to the wall by his father who was vastly superior after undergoing the eclipse. However, I believe this should count for Mash before his training, as it's simply a feat of willpower.

Even if he didn't wanted the sword and tried to left it behind the sword will automatically go to his (because as I said it have a goddess that love him inside), which is the only reason of why he had his sword at all in the above fights despite not having the rest of his equipment.

So its like Mjolnir?

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Well at that point Mash still has options to dig underground and reach up close the rest of the way, or he could shorten the distance with Big Bang Dash.

So he basically has good enough willpower to keep fighting unconscious and with several injuries, in a simple explanation yeah?

And so his stamina is around 3-days? Well Mash did train for around a month, said training being to the point where he had to fight animated armors so far above himself he had no choice but to adapt. Not sure if this would compare, but it's good to point out. Also, though it comes after his Post-Meliadoul training, Mash even with his heart ripped out has enough determination to get right back up and fight again, and was only stopped by being pinned to the wall by his father who was vastly superior after undergoing the eclipse. However, I believe this should count for Mash before his training, as it's simply a feat of willpower.

So its like Mjolnir?

The underground part would only work if 1) Kouki don't see him go underground 2) Kouki don't sense him with his various senses 3) Kouki stay close to the ground instead of be high in the sky with his platforms (which should be likely considering that at that distance be high would be the best option to have a good view of the battlefield and the opponent). The speed amp is also not a problem as he have his own speed amp (even 12x perception amp if he use the glasses Hajime gave him) and regularly have faced people with speed amps (Shizuku whole thing before get busted was speed amps focus after all and in his arcs he dis faced opponents quite faster than him as Mother or Hajime with his 12x perception amp), so it isn't as game ending in this situation as you could believe.

In a very very simple explanation yes, in a not so summariced explanation he can fight unconscious while having his body broken and covered in his entire blood from continuously bleeding three days.

3 days of continuous fighting with no rest as just some water to drink before his arcs (before the After Stories key), and then that was upgraded to 3 days while in a half dead state with his bloodied broken body with zero rest, water, magic (including recovery magic or strong strengthening), equipment support and with all his energy exhausted (and technically speaking this also was under the effects of the Dark Beings miasma which is like highly concentrated exhaust fumes to his body). So this (plus the other big fights of his arcs which are similar) are his feats in situations were he can't rest at all while fighting armies of thousands continously for days on, so on top of the individual special abilities of his opponents he also needed to work against their team work and all, so I would consider them better stamina feats than the 100 knights thing of Mash.

If Mjolnir was a beatiful Ara Ara Onee-san then yes.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

The underground part would only work if 1)

Mash can always substitute himself with his clothing to help stir some confusion, he's done it before against Orter

Kouki don't see him go underground 2) Kouki don't sense him with his various senses

Can he sense those that lack magic?

3) Kouki stay close to the ground instead of be high in the sky with his platforms (which should be likely considering that at that distance be high would be the best option to have a good view of the battlefield and the opponent).

At that point Mash could get close and fly up with his sick leg kicks

The speed amp is also not a problem as he have his own speed amp (even 12x perception amp if he use the glasses Hajime gave him) and regularly have faced people with speed amps (Shizuku whole thing before get busted was speed amps focus after all and in his arcs he dis faced opponents quite faster than him as Mother or Hajime with his 12x perception amp), so it isn't as game ending in this situation as you could believe.

I'm not saying it's a game end option, as it wouldn't be either way since Kouki can actually take a hit from Mash unlike the last two contestants, only that it would help him cross the distance much easier in one go.

In a very very simple explanation yes, in a not so summariced explanation he can fight unconscious while having his body broken and covered in his entire blood from continuously bleeding three days.

That's some nice willpower there

3 days of continuous fighting with no rest as just some water to drink before his arcs (before the After Stories key), and then that was upgraded to 3 days while in a half dead state with his bloodied broken body with zero rest, water, magic (including recovery magic or strong strengthening), equipment support and with all his energy exhausted (and technically speaking this also was under the effects of the Dark Beings miasma which is like highly concentrated exhaust fumes to his body). So this (plus the other big fights of his arcs which are similar) are his feats in situations were he can't rest at all while fighting armies of thousands continously for days on, so on top of the individual special abilities of his opponents he also needed to work against their team work and all, so I would consider them better stamina feats than the 100 knights thing of Mash.

I mean, that's just interpretation. Like, was the army that Kouki fought far above himself? I mean, being able to fight 3 days with little water and injured is impressive and all, but when physically weaker characters like Dot and Lance trained against Orter for a week straight while constantly being attacked with no room to breathe while having little water to ration, Mash should obviously scale above them. Again, Mash had to fight 100 animated armor things that were so far above him he had no choice but to adapt, one after the other.

If Mjolnir was a beatiful Ara Ara Onee-san then yes.

I dont like the sound of that

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Mash can always substitute himself with his clothing to help stir some confusion, he's done it before against Orter

Can he sense those that lack magic?

At that point Mash could get close and fly up with his sick leg kicks

I'm not saying it's a game end option, as it wouldn't be either way since Kouki can actually take a hit from Mash unlike the last two contestants, only that it would help him cross the distance much easier in one go.

That's some nice willpower there

I mean, that's just interpretation. Like, was the army that Kouki fought far above himself? I mean, being able to fight 3 days with little water and injured is impressive and all, but when physically weaker characters like Dot and Lance trained against Orter for a week straight while constantly being attacked with no room to breathe while having little water to ration, Mash should obviously scale above them. Again, Mash had to fight 100 animated armor things that were so far above him he had no choice but to adapt, one after the other.

I dont like the sound of that

I don't really see that, but even considering it it would be a one time trick unless he can regrow his clothes or some shit like that.

Yep, Dark Beings didn't even had magic (they had other power unknow power to him), and in his next arc the Factory World is show how he can also feel non-supernatural things like machines or people with no power whatsoever. Plus I'm also pretty sure there were times when his senses showed to work against people without magic in the main story, but since his arcs are in the After Stories I honestly don't remember those.

He would still need to tank things to close the distance as there would still be kilometers between them and he isn't just a immobile dummy.

Fair enough I guess.

The first vanilla 3 days stamina were against monsters from Ehit Sancturay, so they should had be at least comparable to him if not stronger (he also said how it was a desperate situation that could had perfectly killed him), against the army of Dark Beings he was using the bare minimum strength possible and strengthening to fight which was why each attack from them could had killed him (and that's why he was so badly injuried), in the Factory World arc (his next arc) due to how insanely nerfed he was (due to the enviroment and plot of the arc) he was just above normal machine soldiers in stats while the heaven machine soldiers were above him and the machine soldiers above them (don't remember their name) were far above the heaven soldiers (so much that Hajime, Kouki and Kousuke had problems working together to defeat one of them the first time they fought one and by the end of that arc (the arc lasted like 2 days) he was fighting several thousands of those machine soldiers while still nerfed. So those weren't easy fights were he just brute forced his way with his stats, he needed to adapt and learn all of those things (Swordmanship, War Demon, Serene Mind, Danmaku Attack Reflection, etc.) to be able to survive.

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

Nah, more LM wank
Mash simply outskill that mf

 

[AnAverageUsername]

I don't really see that, but even considering it it would be a one time trick unless he can regrow his clothes or some shit like that.

Yep, Dark Beings didn't even had magic (they had other power unknow power to him), and in his next arc the Factory World is show how he can also feel non-supernatural things like machines or people with no power whatsoever. Plus I'm also pretty sure there were times when his senses showed to work against people without magic in the main story, but since his arcs are in the After Stories I honestly don't remember those.

So basically, it's like a spiritual sense?

He would still need to tank things to close the distance as there would still be kilometers between them and he isn't just a immobile dummy.

Yeah, but Mash is good at tanking damage and keep pushing forward. The kilometer distance is a problem (I wonder how many more times I'm gonna say that), but he should make it there eventually. Also, if he can't tank stuff because of certain effects, then his senses should help him out in detecting them before dodging in the air.

Fair enough I guess.

The first vanilla 3 days stamina were against monsters from Ehit Sancturay, so they should had be at least comparable to him if not stronger (he also said how it was a desperate situation that could had perfectly killed him), against the army of Dark Beings he was using the bare minimum strength possible and strengthening to fight which was why each attack from them could had killed him (and that's why he was so badly injuried), in the Factory World arc (his next arc) due to how insanely nerfed he was (due to the enviroment and plot of the arc) he was just above normal machine soldiers in stats while the heaven machine soldiers were above him and the machine soldiers above them (don't remember their name) were far above the heaven soldiers (so much that Hajime, Kouki and Kousuke had problems working together to defeat one of them the first time they fought one and by the end of that arc (the arc lasted like 2 days) he was fighting several thousands of those machine soldiers while still nerfed. So those weren't easy fights were he just brute forced his way with his stats, he needed to adapt and learn all of those things (Swordmanship, War Demon, Serene Mind, Danmaku Attack Reflection, etc.) to be able to survive.

See, now that's impressive. But I still would believe Mash's stamina is more impressive simply by the fact that he had to do his training for multiple weeks, while also being superior to Lance and Dot who had to do their training in a week as well, under the aforementioned set up. And Mash always has a creampuff to give him a recharge. Always hiding them in his robes.... must smell terrible.

 

[EL_xWatcher1234x]

So basically, it's like a spiritual sense?

yes but more advanced, in the verse there is characters can sense invisible attack, stuff before they happen, the best can sense space distortion .

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

So basically, it's like a spiritual sense?

Yeah, but Mash is good at tanking damage and keep pushing forward. The kilometer distance is a problem (I wonder how many more times I'm gonna say that), but he should make it there eventually. Also, if he can't tank stuff because of certain effects, then his senses should help him out in detecting them before dodging in the air.

See, now that's impressive. But I still would believe Mash's stamina is more impressive simply by the fact that he had to do his training for multiple weeks, while also being superior to Lance and Dot who had to do their training in a week as well, under the aforementioned set up. And Mash always has a creampuff to give him a recharge. Always hiding them in his robes.... must smell terrible.

Not exactly but that's a good way to comprehend it.

Fair in the part about be good in tanking and fair with the part about dodging the truly dangerous things, however would like to not that if forced to dodge the distance would likely increase again to some extent so it isn't exactly a perfect solution.

Fair enough, as said personally I still think Kouki stamina stuff is better than that but is also valid if you think Mash stuff is better.

Now what though, because we have pretty much stated the things of both sides, think people should begin to vote or nah? Asking as I think the arguments laid for each side seem fine to begin voting as they currently are.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Not exactly but that's a good way to comprehend it.

Yeah, I've never read or watched the series, that's the best I can understand it

Fair in the part about be good in tanking and fair with the part about dodging the truly dangerous things, however would like to not that if forced to dodge the distance would likely increase again to some extent so it isn't exactly a perfect solution.

Yeah, it isn't perfect, but it is a solution

Fair enough, as said personally I still think Kouki stamina stuff is better than that but is also valid if you think Mash stuff is better.

Yeah, it depends on how you read into things.

Now what though, because we have pretty much stated the things of both sides, think people should begin to vote or nah? Asking as I think the arguments laid for each side seem fine to begin voting as they currently are.

Yeah, we'd just go into circles at this point. I'm assuming you're voting Kouki, as I'm voting Mash?

 

[Arnoldstone18]

I guess we can begin voting

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Yeah, we'd just go into circles at this point. I'm assuming you're voting Kouki, as I'm voting Mash?

Yeah, I'm fine with that, this time the debate was most satisfactory than the previous ones that dragged too much.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Yeah, it was better

honestly Mash winning would be funny, as he'd move to the finals and possibly win the tournament lacking magic, in a magic based tournament

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Yeah, it was better

honestly Mash winning would be funny, as he'd move to the finals and possibly win the tournament lacking magic, in a magic based tournament

Ehh, after this he would need to face the smurf character with an eye contact insta win.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Ehh, after this he would need to face the smurf character with an eye contact insta win.

that smurf may or may not be removed

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

that smurf may or may not be removed

I genuinely don't know how someone who just win by looking at people was allowed, if the bar was that at that point at least others characters with insta wins should had been added instead of people with magic beams and martial arts with some magical effect.

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Bump

 

[AnAverageUsername]

Bump

 

[Noneless21]

imma be the devil's advocate and choose incon

 

[AnAverageUsername]

imma be the devil's advocate and choose incon

Don't just be the advocate, be the devil alone