The Real World Discussion Thread

[DaReaperMan]

So we need to add Robot Wars, Battlebots...
There's two others you can add, Reaper.

The most I might make from the older bots is Nightmare, but Nightmare has the issue of having two entire events untelevised. Also, no interest in Robot Wars. Chris and Kenny are simply superior announcers

 

[DaReaperMan]

Most weapons in battlebots that aren't designed to be gigamonsters like Deep Six or Son of Whyachi, vary from about 40 KJ to 70 KJ, and those work just fine even though OG Tombstone reached over 200 KJ with it's highest energy weapon bars.

It really shows that IRL does not care for your pithy tiering system lmfao

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Bite_Force_(BattleBots)

Just proves the point BTW

 

[H3110l12345I20]

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Bite_Force_(BattleBots)

Just proves the point BTW

I mean if we go by weight and overall pound-by-pound strength, we could technically beta test a match against something like a Pig or Leopard for IRL matches. For verse-verse based matches, errr... I got nothing for the main site.

 

[DaReaperMan]

I mean if we go by weight and overall pound-by-pound strength, we could technically beta test a match against something like a Pig or Leopard for IRL matches. For verse-verse based matches, errr... I got nothing for the main site.

To be fair, Bite Force is a metal brick with one dangerous part to it, just driving around is 9-C

 

[H3110l12345I20]

To be fair, Bite Force is a metal brick with one dangerous part to it, just driving around is 9-C

Incap is possible and they effectively scale to bears that can rip apart metal (Grizzlies, American Black Bears, etc). Although if you want a better bite force you can always shift to the spotted hyena.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Incap is possible and they effectively scale to bears that can rip apart metal (Grizzlies, American Black Bears, etc). Although if you want a better bite force you can always shift to the spotted hyena.

Yeah that's the problem, only one dangerous part. At least Tombstone is half a bot of murder

 

[Mahek_The_Assassin_Silent_Killer]

The most I might make from the older bots is Nightmare, but Nightmare has the issue of having two entire events untelevised. Also, no interest in Robot Wars. Chris and Kenny are simply superior announcers

The Robot Wars and Battlebots robots are all limited in weaponry either way, if you want actually extremely powerful robots use military unmanned/remote controlled stuff like weapons and vehicles then.
Pretty sure even a powerful enough laser or particle beam can disable the Robot Wars and Battlebots robots (hell, not sure if anyone's tried using EMPs) let alone kinetic weapons... pretty much any powerful enough ranged attack in general.

Robot combat - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[User_A_98732165489]

О ДЖОУЛЯХ НА ОСТРИЕ КОПЬЯ (Сила таранного удара копьем в сравнении с энергией «обычных» ударов/уколов холодным оружием)

Вероятно, каждому интересующемуся военной историей Средних веков и Ренессанса не раз попадалось утверждение о том, что таранный удар тяже..

vk.com

An experimental investigation of late medieval combat with the couched lance.pdf

vk.com

Mail: Unchained

A resource for historic arms and armor collectors with photo galleries, reviews, reference materials, discussion forums, a bookstore and a comparison tool.

web.archive.org

Wayback Machine

This VK post talks about notes of Doctor Аlan Williams, expert of metallurgy and medieval weaponry, in russian. The second link are William's writings, in english, just what we need (third is about history of chainmail, fourth is about renaissance-era weapons exercises).

Joules values:

• Axe, sword: 60-130 joules; Average Human to Athletic Human level
• Underarm stabbing: 63 joules; Average Human level
• Overarm stabbing: 115 joules; Athletic Human level
• 12th century longbow: 80 joules; Average Human level
• 13th century crossbow: 100-200 joules; Average Human+ to Athletic Human level
• Very strong steel crossbow: 230 joules; Athletic Human+ level
• Lance without saddle: 100 joules; Average Human level
• Stronger charged lance: 200-250-300 joules; Athletic Human level to Street level
• 3mm cuirass durability: 500 joules; Street level
• 2.5mm fine cuirass durability: 450 joules; Street level
• Very strong charged lance, if you're lucky: 600 joules; Street level

Spherical bullet's surface is much larger than stabbing point of arrow, bolt, spear, dagger or sword. As such, bullets need many times more raw Joules to penetrate armor, since larger surface = smaller penetration. Cue muscle-based weapons, despite having small amount of Joules on paper, dealing gruesome damage.

This again shows why Piercing is so important. Most muscle-powered weapons, short of charged lances, have raw Joules of Average Human to Athletic Human levels, but deal Street Level damage due to being sharp and pointy.

This shows another weirdness of our system: maces and such are not sharp (not piercing) and have raw joules as axe of same mass - yet still somehow deal Street Level damage. Despite not being Piercing, maces were more effective at penetrating armor than swords.

It's also worth noting, that most soldiers were much stronger than researchers. In turn, knights, lords and such were stronger than common soldiers. So results in Joules that modern researchers got are likely much smaller than Joules of strikes of actual medieval fighting-men. Thus, numbers above are low-end.

 

[DemonicDude]

The Battle Of The Claw! Lobster vs Cab | The Real World

Match info Match Rules: Both are 10-C Speed will be equalized Prep time of 20 minutes for each combatants Location: Murky water (A small, man-made freshwater pond with low visibility due to algae growth. Surrounded by grass, trees, and a residential structure with a wooden deck nearby)...

vsbattles.com

 

[DaReaperMan]

Solid Snake vs Raiden... with a twist!

Except it's battlebots! Le Rules Raiden will be using Tombstone and will be given recordings of all previous Tombstone Fights to watch. Snake will be using Vertical Disk Spinner Bite Force and will be given recordings of all previous Bite Force Fights to watch. They will be in normal positions...

vsbattles.com

Tombstone and Bite Force are used here lol

 

[Mahek_The_Assassin_Silent_Killer]

Spherical bullet's surface is much larger than stabbing point of arrow, bolt, spear, dagger or sword. As such, bullets need many times more raw Joules to penetrate armor, since larger surface = smaller penetration. Cue muscle-based weapons, despite having small amount of Joules on paper, dealing gruesome damage.

This again shows why Piercing is so important. Most muscle-powered weapons, short of charged lances, have raw Joules of Average Human to Athletic Human levels, but deal Street Level damage due to being sharp and pointy.

This shows another weirdness of our system: maces and such are not sharp (not piercing) and have raw joules as axe of same mass - yet still somehow deal Street Level damage. Despite not being Piercing, maces were more effective at penetrating armor than swords.

To be fair, aside from piercing damage (also, a few blunt force weapons did also have sharp spikes and blades and parts in general), the bullets (and also, keep in mind there are also sharp bullet design shapes, like the spitzer bullet) and blunt force weapons also benefited from the sheer force (combination of mass, velocity, and concentration of force and kinetic energy into a smaller area, usually a point, via spiked and bladed design) they imparted, which not only damaged armour but also transferred enough energy through the armour to harm the being inside the armour as well.

 

[Mahek_The_Assassin_Silent_Killer]

Search results for query: wikipedia

vsbattles.com

Welp, wondering if trying to search for every Wikipedia link I posted could help with this thread and the Real World page in general.

^We could use this welp (makes it easier to find any and all relevant links and posts I sent).

 

[DaReaperMan]

William Afton vs D E A T H R O L L

Rules Both 9-B Speed Equalized Battle takes place at the edge of a lake at dawn Battle starts 287.353937 inches away William Afton has a whole still-alive chicken in his hands Votes Less than nothing. Nothing but smoke.: 0 DEATH ROLL: 0 Inconclusive: 0

vsbattles.com

 

[Flashlight237]

Back here again. Apparently the decapitated head of a wolf fish is strong enough to crush a filled soda can:


Yeah, imagine pulling a feat off while being fvcking dead.

 

[Mahek_The_Assassin_Silent_Killer]

Back here again. Apparently the decapitated head of a wolf fish is strong enough to crush a filled soda can:


Yeah, imagine pulling a feat off while being fvcking dead.

Exploding whales:
Decapitated snakes:
Gillicus rupturing the organs of Xiphactinus:

 

[Flashlight237]

Exploding whales:
Decapitated snakes:
Gillicus rupturing the organs of Xiphactinus:

Hey, let's be fair to the wolf fish: at least the soda can thing was done directly by its head.

 

[Mahek_The_Assassin_Silent_Killer]

Hey, let's be fair to the wolf fish: at least the soda can thing was done directly by its head.

Snakes can bite (and have bitten and killed people who were trying to kill them) directly with their decapitated head AFTER being decapitated too though, so both them and the wolf fish are comparable for sure.

 

[Dalesean027]

Been busy, whats new here?

 

[DaReaperMan]

Been busy, whats new here?

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Bite_Force_(BattleBots)

Just proves the point BTW

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Tombstone_(BattleBots)

Hostile roombas

 

[O0DSF0o]

BOO! new profile

 

[H3110l12345I20]

BOO! new profile

Cool profile. Though I'd have to warn you. There's a real risk of it getting booted out of the wiki on the basis that "it's not above average or a conventional weapon!!" Be prepared for the dispute when the time comes.

 

[O0DSF0o]

Cool profile. Though I'd have to warn you. There's a real risk of it getting booted out of the wiki on the basis that "it's not above average or a conventional weapon!!" Be prepared for the dispute when the time comes.

dw, I have proof

 

[O0DSF0o]

Cool profile. Though I'd have to warn you. There's a real risk of it getting booted out of the wiki on the basis that "it's not above average or a conventional weapon!!" Be prepared for the dispute when the time comes.

Got reported for being low quality. Like ******* clockwork lmao

 

[H3110l12345I20]

Got reported for being low quality. Like ******* clockwork lmao

I mean, even if you give the vibe of a pencil profile being high quality, should still be on here? I've been through this horsetrash before. Staff openly want this site to be for indexing fictional franchises and real life weapons are there on the real world page for like combat.

The Milwil brick is arguably slightly more above average since it's a stronger club weapon than traditional paper or pencil. So...

Given all the factors above, I believe you were fighting an uphill battle O0DSF0o. I'll press F for you to pay respects for the profile.

 

[Flashlight237]

I have yet to find an alternative article that isn't paywalled, but apparently we got mice having speech now: https://www.nytimes.com/2026/05/06/...he-gift-of-speech-these-mice-have-it-too.html

 

[User_A_98732165489]

I think we have some categories of IRL weapons that we don't have profiles yet. Such as:

1) Purpose-built-for-war bludgeoning weapons. Such as mace, morningstar, etc.
2) A realistic two-handed sword.
3) One-handed axes of various types.
4) Purpose-built-for-war two-handed axes (as opposed to Fire Axe being improvised)
5) Polearms. E.G. Halberd - most popular polearm in Europe, has analogues all over the world (e.g. bisento is Japanese equivalent). More over, Halberd is known as the best melee weapon in Europe - and due to large mass and leverage, it's arguably the strongest IRL melee weapon in Joules, not counting the Couched Lance and certain power tools. Two keys: Dueling Halberd (or perhaps Pollaxe with blade - for individual combat; as long as man is tall, 2 meters or so) and Full-Length Halberd (much longer than man is tall - for field massed combat; 3 meters or so). Most had axe side and pick side.
6) Couched cavalry lance.
7) Picks, both one-handed and two-handed.

 

[Mahek_The_Assassin_Silent_Killer]

I think we have some categories of IRL weapons that we don't have profiles yet. Such as:

1) Purpose-built-for-war bludgeoning weapons. Such as mace, morningstar, etc.
2) A realistic two-handed sword.
3) One-handed axes of various types.
4) Purpose-built-for-war two-handed axes (as opposed to Fire Axe being improvised)
5) Polearms. E.G. Halberd - most popular polearm in Europe, has analogues all over the world (e.g. bisento is Japanese equivalent). More over, Halberd is known as the best melee weapon in Europe - and due to large mass and leverage, it's arguably the strongest IRL melee weapon in Joules, not counting the Couched Lance and certain power tools. Two keys: Dueling Halberd (or perhaps Pollaxe with blade - for individual combat; as long as man is tall, 2 meters or so) and Full-Length Halberd (much longer than man is tall - for field massed combat; 3 meters or so). Most had axe side and pick side.
6) Couched cavalry lance.
7) Picks, both one-handed and two-handed.

Weapons, vehicles, etc.
Halberds and pollaxes also had hammer sides too but unsure how they compare to the sledgehammer in pure energy/force, otherwise yeah we definitely need more polearms, I'd vote for the Langxian and Nine Dragon Trident to be included. (I'm not sure if we should make a separate Polearms page cause the Spear page exists or if we just change the Spear page to make it Polearms.)
Maybe we should add combination weapons too...

Combination weapons - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Category:Combination weapons - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

^We could use this welp (makes it easier to find any and all relevant links and posts I sent).

We still have a lot of stuff we could add...
We should seriously add modern day stuff to the list.
Not sure if we should add theoretical, hypothetical, experimentaland proposed/ideated stuff too though either.

 

[User_A_98732165489]

Halberd and Pollaxes differed in that Halberd was monolithic, while Pollaxe was modular. Halberd had axe side, pick side and spear point.

Pollaxe had spear point, and 2 sides - each side could be one of the following: axe, pick, beefy flat hammer, round hammer with tiny spike (think Star Wars Gaderffii), and small tenderizer with 4 prongs. From least to most penetration: beefy hammer, gaderffii, axe, tenderizer, pick.

 

[Mahek_The_Assassin_Silent_Killer]

think Star Wars Gaderffii

Ironically the Gaderffii is also based off real world weapons.

Totokia - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

 

[Mahek_The_Assassin_Silent_Killer]

A bit curious how different living beings react to different potential damage causes and how they could also compare to non-living matter in terms of durability/ability to resist/withstand such damage causes.
This is 140 gs, humans have survived up to 360 gs instantaneously by accident and 46.2 gs sustained voluntarily.

Unpopular Opinions and (Friendly) Rant thread

I instinctively distrust "humanity **** yeah kill the aliens" types because they basically broadcast from the jump that they would respond to something different from them with scorn, and I don't trust like that. Depend on whether they actually threatens humanity or not. If they do? Why you...

vsbattles.com

 

[H3110l12345I20]

I'll need to update my new activity schedule but in the meantime, I'm going to question the tiers of the Giant and Colossal Squid.

Spoiler: Giant and Colossal Squid Feats

• Strength record
  • The Giant Squid is stated to be not scaled larger to be proportionally as physically strong as the Humboldt Squid, but nonetheless their feat record is there.
  • Scientific/direct
    • (How Squid hunt)
  • Accounts
    • Background: Back then, the accounts are human-centric and if you have any basic knowledge on the giant/colossal squid, you'd know it's supposed to be a deep sea predator (NOT a surface dweller). That being said the squids in this section are probably ill, injured (as implied in regular accounts when GIant/Colossal Squids are seen in the surface), or displaced by external forces/internal motivations. That being said them being weakened technically strengthens the feat. That being said it's important to take these accounts with a healthy dose of skepticism and differentiate what is within the behavior of the Squids. As to why a giant squid would attack a non-living ship with people...
      • Much of the accounts involve people provoking the squid via attacking it
      • The squid could think the ship is a curious prey item to eat or item to just observe curiously (and then realize it isn't food when it bites into it)
      • or squid could think the ship is a predator.
      • Furthermore, it's important to separate what is plausibly within the possiblity for the Giant/Colossal Squid's actions as these are human accounts biased to portraying the squids as a Kraken-like figure.
    • Raw Strength:
      • A large squid capsized the Pearl [a 150 ton Yacht], albeit torque rather than the squid's weight did most of the work.
        • Is stated the said squid's body was as thick as the Pearl and had tenticles as thick as wood
      • [translate to english via google translate] A large squid capsized a boat with 11 adults and 12-week-old baby, albeit the physical extent of the boat and the torque-caused capsizing was unknown.
      • Physically overpowers and kill humans with ease
      • Scarred the USS Stein Frigate's rubber-coated dome
      • Three separate occassions a momentarily grabbed onto the metal of the Brunswick before dying to it's propellers; it failed to permanently grip into the metal
      • An excerpt from the 1873 account from a 2010 physics professor blogger implies a giant/colossal squid was able to strike the bottom of a two-manned fishermen boat hard enough to shake it; afterwards it necessitated an axe to chop two tenticles off of the boat
    • Piercing:
      • Scarred the USS Stein Frigate's rubber-coated dome
      • Allegedly scared Cox's skin and overpowered a man, however it could've been the Humboldt Squid
  • Scarred Sperm Whale skin
  • Fought and cannibalized each other
  • Regularly hunts deep-sea fish and other physically weaker squids
    • Regularly hunts and is implied to be capable of overpowering Antarctic toothfish, which may weigh more than 150 kg in mass and measure up to 2 m in length
  • Size
    • Colossal Squid are 14 m (45.9 ft) long
    • Giant Squid are 20 m (66 ft) long
    • Giant Squid 7 are times longer than average humans as a size comparison
  • Weight
    • Colossal Squid weigh over 500 kg (1,100 lb)
    • Giant Squid weigh either 454 kg (1000 lb) or 275 kg depending on your sources

Giant and Colossal Squid should be baseline 9-C in Attack Potency, and Durability; Peak Human in Lifting Strength

Despite us lacking full knowledge over both squids and the boat/ship attacking feats being vague, the things that solidify baseline 9-C for the Giant Squid are it's obvious physical superiority to normal human men and Antarctic Toothfish. It's also implied they can grapple and wrestle with other comparable squids so their lifting strength should be Peak Human.

The part about them being 9-C+ via Sperm Whale scarring seemed odd to me since it got implimented from an old CRT. Pressure enables flesh to be more vulnerable to damage when in reality muscle and stuff can be good at tanking physical shock and Newtons if pressure came to withstand blunt force.

• By precedent of a bed of nails the Whales casually tank ramming into each other's heads with little damage and yet if they were to do the same thing with a spiked wall it's a different story. 9-C+ implies the squid can cut above it's weight class when it shouldn't. I even tried to calculate the Giant and Colossal Squid's Sucker Attack Potency and I ended up getting a weak AP here (note the calculation isn't evaluated but you get the point.

I can say the same thing about the Colossal Squid.

 

[Mahek_The_Assassin_Silent_Killer]

The Word Is Bird (The Real World CRT)

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/K%C4%81k%C4%81p%C5%8D possibly Longevity (Reported to reach 100 years old, making it possibly the longest-living bird species) This doesn't exceed the human lifespan, so it doesn't qualify for longevity. https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Canada_Goose Should...

vsbattles.com

 

[User_A_98732165489]

On different sorts of halberds and pollaxes:

Halberds are always spike+axe+pick. Forms differ, but the goal is same. By the way, ANY weapon can be a Flamberg for extra damage.

Pollaxe with beefy hammer and axe.

Pollaxe with 4-point thagomizer and axe.

Pollaxe with gaderffii and axe.

Pollaxe with pick and 4-point thagomizer.

Bec De Corbin with pick and beefy hammer.

Pollaxe with thinner axe and beefy hammer.

Pollaxes with comically short and comically long spikes.

Different sorts of polearms.

War Hammers, Two-Handed War Picks. One of the sides was a hammer (or more rarely, an axe). Other was a pick, more pointy and sharp than on halberd, varying in lenght from "long" to "ludicrous". Some had a forward-facing spike; halberds and pollaxes almost always have a forward-facing spike.

 

[Mahek_The_Assassin_Silent_Killer]

thagomizer.

Kinda funny that this term was used here when it was first used for stegosaur tail spikes...

Thagomizer - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Though now I'm thinking of tenderiser which is probably what you were actually referring to.

 

[Mahek_The_Assassin_Silent_Killer]

Halberd and Pollaxes differed in that Halberd was monolithic, while Pollaxe was modular. Halberd had axe side, pick side and spear point.

Pollaxe had spear point, and 2 sides - each side could be one of the following: axe, pick, beefy flat hammer, round hammer with tiny spike (think Star Wars Gaderffii), and small tenderizer with 4 prongs. From least to most penetration: beefy hammer, gaderffii, axe, tenderizer, pick.

Yeah you probably meant tenderiser then.

On different sorts of halberds and pollaxes:

Halberds are always spike+axe+pick. Forms differ, but the goal is same. By the way, ANY weapon can be a Flamberg for extra damage.

Pollaxe with beefy hammer and axe.

Pollaxe with 4-point thagomizer and axe.

Pollaxe with gaderffii and axe.

Pollaxe with pick and 4-point thagomizer.

Bec De Corbin with pick and beefy hammer.

Pollaxe with thinner axe and beefy hammer.

Pollaxes with comically short and comically long spikes.

Different sorts of polearms.

War Hammers, Two-Handed War Picks. One of the sides was a hammer (or more rarely, an axe). Other was a pick, more pointy and sharp than on halberd, varying in lenght from "long" to "ludicrous". Some had a forward-facing spike; halberds and pollaxes almost always have a forward-facing spike.

Chinese polearm - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Asian (Persian, Indian, Chinese, etc) versions are also worth looking into (You have mentioned a few of them before).

By the way, ANY weapon can be a Flamberg for extra damage.

It'd make sense against unarmoured beings, but it wouldn't probably work against armour, and it was also noted to potentially help with blade clashes but also required more time to (and was more difficult to) sharpen.
(Blade serrations would also have been a good alternative.)

 

[User_A_98732165489]

I would also think that crescent-shaped axes are better than normal axes due to smaller effective surface area. When normal axe strikes someone, entire blade's surface is in contact. When crescent-shaped axe strikes something, first the edges make contact, then the middle point; the line of cut changes as material is cut. Same for round axes, but cut starts in center and ends on outer age, not vice-versa.

 

[Mahek_The_Assassin_Silent_Killer]

I would also think that crescent-shaped axes are better than normal axes due to smaller effective surface area. When normal axe strikes someone, entire blade's surface is in contact. When crescent-shaped axe strikes something, first the edges make contact, then the middle point; the line of cut changes as material is cut. Same for round axes, but cut starts in center and ends on outer age, not vice-versa.

With that in mind, you'd probably like the Fangtian Ji polearm then given the design is basically spear + double crescent axe blades (I sorta wish they made a version with 4-8 spear points and 4-8 (either the dagger-axe or crescent-axe) side blades... though in a way if they had octagonal/8-sided or at least thickened diamond cross section convex grind spear point blades those blades in of themselves would have been very good at cutting, piercing and bashing/slashing, stabbing and smashing so the axe blade wouldn't be necessary).

Blade - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Oakeshott typology - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Grind - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Hagane_no_Saiyajin]

https://royalsocietypublishing.org/rsos/article/13/2/252139/480521/Evidence-of-bird-like-foot-function-in

 

[User_A_98732165489]

I would also think that crescent-shaped axes are better than normal axes due to smaller effective surface area. When normal axe strikes someone, entire blade's surface is in contact. When crescent-shaped axe strikes something, first the edges make contact, then the middle point; the line of cut changes as material is cut. Same for round axes, but cut starts in center and ends on outer age, not vice-versa.
Click to expand...

With that in mind, you'd probably like the Fangtian Ji polearm then given the design is basically spear + double crescent axe blades (I sorta wish they made a version with 4-8 spear points and 4-8 (either the dagger-axe or crescent-axe) side blades... though in a way if they had octagonal/8-sided or at least thickened diamond cross section convex grind spear point blades those blades in of themselves would have been very good at cutting, piercing and bashing/slashing, stabbing and smashing so the axe blade wouldn't be necessary).

Blade - Wikipedia​

en.wikipedia.org

Oakeshott typology - Wikipedia​

en.wikipedia.org

Grind - Wikipedia​

en.wikipedia.org

Regardless of what's the main head is, the secondary would better be a pick. The reason is that the pick deals more deep wounds than axe and has a lot more piercing than axe - so it's ideal for brutalizing unarmored enemies and for piercing armor (by punching through or targeting chinks in armor). In late medieval to renaissance era, pretty much everyone are either clad in metal armor (e.g. knights) or have no armor at all (e.g. musketeers, pikemen). Pick can also be used to grab enemies, such as to put them off-balance.

So best combination, in my opinion, is axe+pick+speartip. The main question are exact forms of those axe, pick and speartip.