Weakest Monster vs. Control Devil (Sans vs. Makima) (8-13-1) (Grace Ended)

[Catbowtie]

Okay, so now she needs dodge the ensuing Danmaku, right?

What's a Brotato

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

does she even have enough acrobatics to weave?
or to yanno, dodge blue bones?
get teleported INTO bones?
gaster blaster spam from all directions?

Knowing the future...doesn't help here? If Makima tries to point, Sans Incons her. If she tries to dodge. Danmaku ****s her.

Why does she need to dodge anything? What's sans gonna do against getting Cosmos'd after makima realizes she has no chance of getting to Sans otherwise? All while having prior knowledge of everything sans will do in the moment from 6 seconds ahead of time

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

votes counted. Thx for cooperation

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

What I'm getting at is that Gaster's Blaster and everything else gets to makima before she raises a finger, even if she knows what sans is gonna do in every scenario. Cosmo's ggs ig

 

[Gamecooob]

Why does she need to dodge anything? What's sans gonna do against getting Cosmos'd after makima realizes she has no chance of getting to Sans otherwise? All while having prior knowledge of everything sans will do in the moment from 6 seconds ahead of time

The problem with this is, we're throwing them infront of eachother.
Sans will IMMEDIATELY start the first attack, six seconds wouldnt have even PASSED yet since the fight has started here.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

The problem with this is, we're throwing them infront of eachother.
Sans will IMMEDIATELY start the first attack, six seconds wouldnt have even PASSED yet since the fight has started here.

I know. That doesn't negate the fact that Makima knows what will happen in the moment he does what he does. Because her Precognition is activated. 6 seconds wouldn't have passed since the match started but Makima will know what Sans will proceed with after getting a short glimpse of what the future will look like if she just stands there and accepts San's barrage which isn't gonna happen. Makima isn't a lifeless doll as we're making her out to be

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Makima gets that glimpse and just thought bases cosmos's sans to oblivion

 

[Gamecooob]

I know. That doesn't negate the fact that Makima knows what will happen in the moment he does what he does. Because her Precognition is activated. 6 seconds wouldn't have passed since the match started but Makima will know what Sans will proceed with after getting a short glimpse of what the future will look like if she just stands there and accepts San's barrage which isn't gonna happen. Makima isn't a lifeless doll as we're making her out to be

This is malarkey.

Due to the immediate nature of Sans' first attack, like, he'll slam her down a split second after the fight starts, she wouldnt even be able to make sense of what she's seeing at first before it happens.

Like, she'll see herself get slammed down, get impaled by bones and just lie limp. She won't see his future attacks after that because she's DEAD in her precog.

Don't make me pull out MS paint for this.

She'll jump over the first bones from the ground, then what? She won't even have enough time to process this information because it happens too damn early in her precog, like, immediate levels.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Makima knows Sans can harm her soul, yes, but she doesn't know how.
How would she deduce that these bones can instakill her, when for all SHE knows this is just an appetizer and Sans doesn't do his soul damage immediately?

I mean, Makima isn't stupid, she's not gonna risk it.
But even if she was, the future sight would show her dying in that case, and she would work to prevent it, by floating up.

You boldly assume she will have the time to point at him with bones flying at him from all directions, angles and distances.

You're really overestimating how hard it is to point at someone, sans himself needs to wave down for the TK slam and wave to the left for the next bone swarm.

She'd attempt do the same to a Blue Bone, except her precog level + blue mode will pretty much stop her from even flying up when she sees that she's just dead.

Blue Mode does nothing, it's Class 10 LS compared to her Class M and she can fly.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Makima has prior knowledge that Sans has fought two beings capable of controlling, stopping, and starting roughly a thousand timelines and beat them many times over, even getting them to quit in some instances. She also knows he can damage her soul
Both are in-character, but Makima is on edge due to her prior knowledge is far less willing to be hit by things

What the hellyonte? Are we all serious rn? Makima just uses her one shot abilities immediately I'm sure San's doesn't start with thought based hax if he has any. Makima even without knowing the future's first response would be to "Bang" or thought hax this creature with Cosmos. Screw a fair battle, she is straight up killing without remorse-

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Makima is gonna do the quickest point ever in sheer fear before Sans can landishly do a whole barage of waves

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Oh yeah, another thing about the attacks being tangible.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

My Queen FRA

 

[Arkansalter2]

Yall do realize that he's TKing her soul correct?
Also, Sans has higher reactions because he can basically dodge attacks, again, in his sleep. He basically can dodge stuff he can't see and when he is completely off his guard.

 

[Gamecooob]

But even if she was, the future sight would show her dying in that case, and she would work to prevent it, by floating up.

Yes.
But my point is, the attacks afterward are TOO EARLY in her precog. She'd be effectively seeing her death in like, what, 0.5 seconds? Good luck getting a point & trying to dodge those corridor of bones while airborne.

What the hellyonte? Are we all serious rn? Makima just uses her one shot abilities immediately I'm sure San's doesn't start with thought based hax if he has any. Makima even without knowing the future's first response would be to "Bang" or thought hax this creature with Cosmos. Screw a fair battle, she is straight up killing without remorse-

Cosmo is irrelevant. Makima is not a member on VSBattles Wiki. She's not gonna think (oh damn im gonna die, let me use my thought-based hax), no, shes gonna go for a "bang", its ACTUALLY in character.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Mind you these guys literally start face to face.. literally 5 meters apart.. Sans using Danmaku is just him wanting to hit himself which is hilarious Using TK is definitely his first response which Makima has millions of ways to counter

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Yall do realize that he's TKing her soul correct?

Doesn't matter if he targets the soul if the soul is contained to a body that has flight and free movement that can output force far beyond what Sans can act against.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Yall do realize that he's TKing her soul correct?
Also, Sans has higher reactions because he can basically dodge attacks, again, in his sleep. He basically can dodge stuff he can't see and when he is completely off his guard.

And you do realize Makima has thought based mind hax that fills your brain with information from the universe and makes him stand completely still? Like what are we trying to play here She'll just use this off the bat, not taking any chances with this pile of bones cuz she lit has prior knowledge

 

[Arkansalter2]

Can she even counter soul based TK and dura neg? I... didn't think so?

 

[MintyBoi1]

Voting Makima for BANG

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Cosmo is irrelevant. Makima is not a member on VSBattles Wiki. She's not gonna think (oh damn im gonna die, let me use my thought-based hax), no, shes gonna go for a "bang", its ACTUALLY in character.

Did you read the rules? Btw do you understand that theses guys are under SBA influence alongside the rules?? Makima isn't her usual lay away "I'm gonna tank everything cuz Regen". She sees San's as a mega threat and she is on edge. Literally desperate not allow defeat more than SBA influences. This guy is the equivalent of Pochita or The Gun Devil to her. She's using everything valid. In character or not

 

[Arkansalter2]

Whats stopping this again?

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Yes.
But my point is, the attacks afterward are TOO EARLY in her precog. She'd be effectively seeing her death in like, what, 0.5 seconds? Good luck getting a point & trying to dodge those corridor of bones while airborne.

Her flight doesn't require any movement, she can go up and use a Bang at the same time, killing sans as he's throwing the first part of his attack 99% of the time.
The bone corridor can be dealt with a Bang or by her goons just attacking it, and then we go back to the whole Makima TPs out stuff, yada yada

But really 99% of the time Makima kills sans the first 2 seconds into his first attack.

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

this is becoming closer than I ever thought possible

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Did you read the rules? Btw do you understand that theses guys are under SBA influence alongside the rules?? Makima isn't her usual lay away "I'm gonna tank everything cuz Regen". She sees San's as a mega threat and she is on edge. Literally desperate not allow defeat more than SBA influences. This guy is the equivalent of Pochita or The Gun Devil to her. She's using everything valid. In character or not

Essentially "Aight this is unwinnable" is the makima we're arguing here

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Can she even counter soul based TK and dura neg? I... didn't think so?

Can sans counter passives and thought based mind hax? Doesn't seem like it

 

[Gamecooob]

Did you read the rules? Btw do you understand that theses guys are under SBA influence alongside the rules?? Makima isn't her usual lay away "I'm gonna tank everything cuz Regen". She sees San's as a mega threat and she is on edge. Literally desperate not allow defeat more than SBA influences

Makima hasn't even USED Cosmo in canon btw, she doesn't know what a "thought based hax" is, my guy, you can't just plug a controller into her and make her act extremely OOC.

Her flight doesn't require any movement, she can go up and use a Bang at the same time, killing sans like 99% as he's throwing the first part of his attack.

By the time she floats up and points her finger, the bone corridor is there, y'know that right? She's pointing at Sans while the bones are coming from behind her, in your scenario. She kills sans, sure, but the bones come from a different direction and obliterate anyway.

The bone corridor can be dealt with a Bang

So, is Makima Banging sans, or the corridor first? You can't have both at the same time. I don't want to regurgitate my points here.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

By the time she floats up and points her finger, the bone corridor is there, y'know that right? She's pointing at Sans while the bones are coming from behind her, in your scenario. She kills sans, sure, but the bones come from a different direction and obliterate anyway.

Not really? There's a small pause between the first bones and the bone corridor, buddy even has to wave his arm to the left to bring them, can't do that when you go poof.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Makima hasn't even USED Cosmo in canon btw, she doesn't know what a "thought based hax" is, my guy, you can't just plug a controller into her and make her act extremely OOC.

1. Saying Makima doesn't know what thought based hax is while HER LITERAL MAIN ABILITY is thought based is crazy but I digress.. what does that defeat? She's using it anyway as it's an ability she has- I don't see your point. Are you saying she can't use it? Cuz that defeats nothing if so. She just needs the right circumstance which a dire circumstance like this is. This defeats nothing.

2 .
State of mind: In character, but will attempt to win the battle. Characters will not give up of their own accord. That means a character that is uninterested or sees no chance of winning won't simply leave and characters wouldn't simply become friends with each other. This doesn't prevent a character being made to give up, because the other character manipulates them via things like, for example, mind control, fear inducement, psychological tricks or superhuman charisma.
Each character will view their opponents as enemies, who they have to assume wish to cause them severe harm such that losing could have any range of dire consequences. The characters will assume their opponents have not been forced into battle. They are assumed to have decided from free will to fight and are not excused by a just cause, difficult times or otherwise exonerating circumstances. Furthermore, the situation is assumed one where the opponents are not protected by social norms or consequences, such as being a civilian protected by law.

Makima will do anything liable to win. Especially with SBA and the rules of this matchup. Makima and I will say it again, the rules enable her to literally be on edge in this match. Desperate to kill Sans as he is a threat beyond her control. What's worse is that he is able to severely harm her. She will fear him just as much as she did the Gun Devil as well as Pochita. And Makima literally doesn't start by playing around against threats such as these. Pure mischaracterization. She is using her best stuff to desperately win because she's literally forced to here

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Really don't think the Cosmo stuff is really relevant when Bang, a move she spams a ton, does the job just as well here

 

[Gamecooob]

Not really? There's a small pause between the first bones and the bone corridor, buddy even has to wave his arm to the left to bring them, can't do that when you go poof.

his left-arm wave takes precisely 3 frames.
and the pause in total is like, 27 frames (including the wave)

You're having to assume that
>She doesn't see herself dead (again) after jumping over the first wave.
>assume she tries to boldly insta-kill an opponent that can obliterate her with a graze of his attacks, instead of listening to her precog. this is an opponent shes vary of btw, with feats of killing someone beyond her comprehension.
>Their gestures don't have the possibility of being executed at the same time, killing sans and then killing Makima with the bone barrage after.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Really don't think the Cosmo stuff is really relevant when Bang, a move she spams a ton, does the job just as well here

I agree. I'm also arguing Cosmos because the San's supporters seem to believe she just stands there and accepts her fate without actually retaliating out of fear with her abilities that post a threat to San's just as much as he does. One Bang is enough anyway imo

 

[Gamecooob]

1. Saying Makima doesn't know what thought based hax is while HER LITERAL MAIN ABILITY is thought based is crazy but I digress.. what does that defeat? She's using it anyway as it's an ability she has- I don't see your point. Are you saying she can't use it? Cuz that defeats nothing if so. She just needs the right circumstance. This defeats nothing.

did you just say that Makima has knowledge of VSBW lingo? Fym she knows what "thought based hax" is.

nah, its MS paint time

 

[Mommyleona]

people be forgetting first thing Sans does is yap and not insta attack

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

did you just say that Makima has knowledge of VSBW lingo? Fym she knows what "thought based hax" is.

nah, its MS paint time

Are we being frl?

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

people be forgetting first thing Sans does is yap and not insta attack

Proceeds to argue "In-character" for Makima

Aye that double standards hit different

 

[Gamecooob]

people be forgetting first thing Sans does is yap and not insta attack

Sans yaps in canon because he's watched Frisk kill the entire ******* underground, knows of their RESET capability, and KNOWS that he can yap because he knows that he can kill Frisk alot. (along with just having common talking points with Frisk lol)

This is an enemy, whom losing to has dire consequences. From another universe. Which he knows nothing of. Safe to say, hes gonna go immediate first attack.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Anyway my vote still goes to Our Queen (I am not being controlled by Makima rn) until other critical arguments arise. Peace! :3

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

his left-arm wave takes precisely 3 frames.
and the pause in total is like, 27 frames (including the wave)

You're having to assume that
>She doesn't see herself dead (again) after jumping over the first wave.
>assume she tries to boldly insta-kill an opponent that can obliterate her with a graze of his attacks, instead of listening to her precog. this is an opponent shes vary of btw, with feats of killing someone beyond her comprehension.
>Their gestures don't have the possibility of being executed at the same time, killing sans and then killing Makima with the bone barrage after.

>I don't really get this one, what stops her from preventing it? Like she did the first wave?
>She threw an attack at the Darkness Devil, she's definitely not the type to go full defense. Precog should also show her sans dying to the Bang too
>Thing is sans' gesture for the bone corridor is his third one, he needs to wave full force down and then up, and only then does he wave to the left.
Makima only needs to point at him, that's the only gesture she needs to do here.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Haine

Haine (ハイネ, Haine) is the God of Hitogashima, Hiruko no Mikoto and "Mother" to the Shadows. Itself supposed to be an ancient being from outside the world, sustained by copying and transforming itself into its nearby things. It then arrives on Earth, falls into the sea turning into a whale, ends...

vsbattles.fandom.com

My goat would never