Shadow Slave: Cosmology and Concept Types (1 more staff vote needed)

[Verezen]

Essentially, what I'm getting from this is that the Absolute Laws predate Existence, have always existed, and the world came after them, which is characteristic of Type 1 Concepts.

However, the issue is that Type 1 Concepts are supposed to exist independently of what they govern. But in this case, the Gods are the Absolute Laws, and they’re also bound by each other’s conceptual nature, meaning that these Absolute Laws govern one another. That falls more in line with Type 2, where concepts are still abstract but interdependent of what they govern and capable of influencing or affecting one another.

So, yeah, I agree with Type 2 Concepts.

Perhaps I am misunderstanding what you are saying, but I do not believe the laws affecting each other would be an anti feat against type 1, which allows explicitly for other concepts of that nature to affect them.

1. Independent Universal Concepts: Such concepts are completely independent from the part of reality they govern, except maybe of other concepts of this nature.

Also the laws are not the gods, they were created by them and exist even after the Gods died. Also the Gods are not the particulars which are governed by these concepts, the concepts of space, time, and death would be the particulars and the laws exist independently of those things, especially because they existed before them. I don’t see how it can be argued that the laws are interdependent on reality when they have outlived their creators (who are also the beings responsible for creating reality) and the laws predate the reality they govern.

 

[Floxy178]

From what I can tell, this scan is saying they exist outside their boundary, but then specifically says they are not free from them, just can take more liberties.

Yes, that's true. I believe those show that Gods ≠ ALs

Unless there's something that states otherwise, this would imply Shadow God was still not free of the other Absolute Laws, despite being one, which implies Absolute Laws affect one another and themselves.

Not just "others", Shadow God is not free of any of them.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Yes, that's true. I believe those show that Gods ≠ ALs. Not just "others", Shadow God is not free of any of them.

What this ultimately means is:

• Shadow God is an Absolute Law.
• Gods are governed by Absolute Laws.
• Therefore, Shadow God is governed both by himself and by other Absolute Laws.

However, Type 1 Concepts are required to exist independently of what they govern.

 

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

Gods just aren't the absolute laws, nor are interdependent concepts a contradiction for type 1. Type 1 only concerns its relation to its particulars instantiated into reality and not other concepts.

What this ultimately means is:

• Shadow God is an Absolute Law.
• Gods are governed by Absolute Laws.
• Therefore, Shadow God is governed both by himself and by other Absolute Laws.

However, Type 1 Concepts are required to exist independently of what they govern.

I mean the Gods are quite literally dead yet all their absolute laws still exist or function fine.

 

[Seraphor12]

From what I can tell, this scan is saying they exist outside their boundary, but then specifically says they are not free from them, just can take more liberties. Unless there's something that states otherwise, this would imply Shadow God was still not free of the other Absolute Laws, despite being one, which implies Absolute Laws affect one another and themselves.

I would like to clarify a verse logic in that scan, there are 7 ranks and the 6th rank known as sacred rank and higher rank than that called divine, characters at these ranks are called as gods or lesser gods and sunny was also meant this by "a god or lesser". The sacred and divine ranks are surely not beyond the laws and they also didn't created them although true gods are implied to be way stronger than them who also created the laws and are also said to have anything to have always existed if they willed in this scan

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Gods just aren't the absolute laws, nor are interdependent concepts a contradiction for type 1. Type 1 only concerns its relation to its particulars instantiated into reality and not other concepts.

Oh, I misread that, never mind then, this is fine for Type 1.

 

[Pluto321]

snip

i think you should create a vote tally of who agree and disagree with things in crt.

 

[Seraphor12]

i think you should create a vote tally of who agree and disagree with things in crt.

@Verezen should create it ig, he is the op

 

[Verezen]

i think you should create a vote tally of who agree and disagree with things in crt.

I will add it for mod votes; normal votes will get repetitive, I think.

 

[Pluto321]

I will add it for mod votes; normal votes will get repetitive, I think.

sure

 

[Pluto321]

Oh, I misread that, never mind then, this is fine for Type 1.

and it's op forgot but can you also tag other mods

 

[Verezen]

Oh, I misread that, never mind then, this is fine for Type 1.

By the way, can I take your vote as accepting the entire CRT or only the type 1 stuff?

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

By the way, can I take your vote as accepting the entire CRT or only the type 1 stuff?

Yeah, it all seems good.

 

[Verezen]

Bump

 

[Saibotsan]

I came to this thread straight straight from reading the end of the domain war. I agree on the entire CRT

Especially the type 1CM as shadow God is dead yet the concept of death still exists

 

[Seraphor12]

Bump

 

[FinePoint]

I'm fine with the scaling and Type 2 concepts.

I don't really see sufficient evidence for Type 1 in that it requires independence from what they govern, not from what created them.

 

[Jaynic1]

I'm fine with the scaling and Type 2 concepts.

I don't really see sufficient evidence for Type 1 in that it requires independence from what they govern, not from what created them.

so in other words it would need to exist independent of the world?

 

[FinePoint]

so in other words it would need to exist independent of the world?

Indeed, and anything else it governs.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

I don't really see sufficient evidence for Type 1 in that it requires independence from what they govern, not from what created them.

I gave Type 1, based on the fact that they existed before the reality they influence.

 

[FinePoint]

I gave Type 1, based on the fact that they existed before the reality they influence.

Well, I don't really see that mentioned in the scan.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Well, I don't really see that mentioned in the scan.

Huh, I don't know why they didn't include them in the blog. That's weird.

This is the one saying they've always existed, and this is the one saying the world only got created after.

 

[FinePoint]

Huh, I don't know why they didn't include them in the blog. That's weird.

This is the one saying they've always existed, and this is the one saying the world only got created after.

I'm guessing the second scan is chronologically after the first one (since I can't tell from the scans themselves.)

In which case, Type 1 is probably fine.

 

[Verezen]

I'm guessing the second scan is chronologically after the first one (since I can't tell from the scans themselves.)

In which case, Type 1 is probably fine.

Ah sorry,
The scan for them having willed something to have always existed was in the crt.
And I understand it might’ve been confusing without context, but reality was created after the Void was sealed, and the laws were used against the beings of the Void before that sealing. Which is why the laws predate reality.

Anyway I can take this as your agreement to the crt right?

I will add the scan that clarifies existence was created after the seal into the crt

 

[FinePoint]

Anyway I can take this as your agreement to the crt right?

Indeed, and thank you for clarifying.

 

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

Huh, I don't know why they didn't include them in the blog. That's weird.

This is the one saying they've always existed, and this is the one saying the world only got created after.

damn OP almost fumbled

 

[Seraphor12]

Bump

 

[Seraphor12]

Bump

 

[Seraphor12]

Bump

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

This isn't Tier 1, so you only needed two staff votes. This can be applied.

 

[Seraphor12]

This isn't Tier 1, so you only needed two staff votes. This can be applied.

I see, thanks for clarifying. In this case this thread can be closed ig because it's already 3 days and no one have objection rn