Metaphysical Aspects in Sailor Moon

[Iamunanimousinthat]

With recent events, the thread that establishes Star Seeds as metaphysical aspects has been partially rejected and Star Seeds kind of sit in a limbo sort of state. For ease and less confusion, and to allow supporters to easily link to a source, I want to use this thread to get Star Seeds officially accepted as a metaphysical aspect and have a blog that will be linked as an addendum to the cosmology page.

Star Seeds are already accepted metaphysical aspects. This CRT is to make a blog stating such as way to separate it from the conceptual manipulation thread. Star Seeds are still accepted as information manipulation type 2 via metaphysical equivalence.

Before we start allow me to define these terms to prevent confusion:​

1. When the word Star is being used in Sailor Moon, it can be used both literally and metaphorically. Literally to mean actual stars in space or metaphorically to mean celestial bodies like a planet, moon, etc. to even people and individuals. Since everything in the verse comes from a Star Seed, you can essentially call everything a "Star'.

2. While the text mentions, 'Galaxy', the scope of the Galaxy Cauldron expands to the entire Cosmology, and not just the galaxy. For example, Pharaoh 90 is a being from an Alternate Universe, yet he still originated in the Galaxy Cauldron which is located in the Main Universe.

3. Sailor Crystals are special forms of Star Seeds.

What are Metaphysical Aspects?​

The term Metaphysical Aspects refers to aspects of existence which are not part of the physical world, or spiritual aspects like mind or soul, but define or govern the world from the background. Examples include laws, causality, information, concepts, plot and also things our wiki does not list separately, such as some verses' versions of names, Dao, essence, ether etc.

What are Star Seeds?​

Star Seeds are the fundamental cores of everything in the Sailor Moon Universe. They are distillations of unknown power. They give birth to everything. All living things regardless of their shape, size, or name, all celestial objects (everything in the heavens). This is not just for physical beings, but non-physical beings such as Metallia who is pure darkness, Death Phantom, whose true form is his resentment, ghosts, and Gods. The galaxy cauldron through star seeds give form to all beings. Universes, power, light, darkness, history, destiny, futures, possibilities and potential. Even the Cosmos itself has a star seed.

They come from the Cauldron which is the source of everything. The Cauldron governs the rises and falls of stars. It is the ultimate source of everything. Everything exists and pasts away in the cauldron. It is the primoradial sea and mother ocean. The sea of beginning. Everything was one with the Cauldron, and everything returns to the cauldron.

Star Seeds and Sailor Crystals are concentrations of that primordial sea of pure potential. And in the Cauldron they are perfected/complete and one.

How do star seeds define and govern the world?​

Star seeds give everything their form. They are the fundamental source. Star seeds contain everything about the form within themselves. They are the source of power for all characters. Manipulating the star seeds means you can completely recreate the form. Sailor Galaxia manipulated the Star Seeds to create evil versions of the main cast. They were not simply brainwashed, but remade to be evil and subservient to her. Sailor Galaxia was able to redefine who they were on a fundamental level. Even the quality of their power was altered.

While star seeds govern and give form to things, Star seeds are also independent to the forms they give:

A. When Hotaru's body and soul were destroyed by Mistress 9, Sailor Saturn was still able to awaken because everything that makes her is in her Sailor Crystal.
B. When Mamoru was killed in the past, Chibi-Usa, his future daughter was completely unaffected. His future self was also not immediately erased by causality.
C. The Sailor Animamates are fake Sailor Senshi. They use the Sailor Crystals of dead Senshi as their power source. If Star Seeds weren't independent, those Sailor Crystals would have disappeared along with their dead original hosts.

But the forms are dependent on the star seeds:

A. After an unknown period of time, causality finally caught up to the future, Mamoru would have been erased but his Sailor Crystal kept him from being erased. (His daughter was still unaffected)
B. When Mamoru's crystal was thrown back into the cauldron and erased, Mamoru was erased across time, past, present, and future. His daughter, who completely erased as well.

No one can exist without their star seeds. And destroying the star seeds destroys everything in all parts of reality.

What Star Seeds aren't:​

Star seeds are not Souls. Here is a scene where Chibi-usa is a disembodied soul, and we see that her Sailor Crystal, the Silver Crystal is completely separate to her.
Hotaru, while being a disembodied soul, refers to a bigger self. That bigger self is obviously Sailor Saturn. Sailor Saturn who comes from her Sailor Crystal.

Star Seeds and Sailor Crystals are not physical.​

"Sailor Crystals are a distillation of power." (incase imgur is still not working)

"Sailor Crystals are a distillation of power."

The series has on many occasions made clear that the physical crystals that house the power/sailor crystals is not the important part.

When Galaxia takes the Sailor Crystal, she destroys the physical crystal and takes the sailor crystal inside of it. And this isn't just established in the final arc either!

Way back in the first arc, this distinction between the physical crystal and the power inside it is made abundantly clear. Sailor Moon subconsciously puts the power of the silver crystal inside Mamoru in order to save his life. After doing so, she renders the crystal into just a plain glass bauble. This is again repeated throughout the series that without the actual power, the silver crystal is just a piece of glass. The physical crystals act like conduits for the power inside.

The crystals themselves can have many physical manifestations that people can use, but ultimately, the physical bodies of the crystals are unimportant. It's the power inside. After all they are also the source of all power and abilities in the series.

They are concentrated power from the Cauldron, which is distinct and separated from reality and predates it entirely. Beings are erased across time and space when they enter the cauldron. The

Conclusion​

Every universe, star, planet, celestial object and being in the series comes from a star seed. They depend on the seeds for their very own existence. Star Seeds are concentrated power from the Cauldron, the ontological source of everything in the cosmology that also governs reality. By manipulating them, you can control and alter the forms they create, and their destruction completely affects reality, by erasing the forms from all of history.

Agreements
Disagreements: @glassman
Neutral:

 

[Robo432343]

Star Seeds are the fundamental cores of everything in the Sailor Moon Universe. They are distillations of unknown power. They give birth to everything. All living things regardless of their shape, size, or name, all celestial objects (everything in the heavens). This is not just for physical beings, but non-physical beings such as Metallia who is pure darkness, Death Phantom, whose true form is his resentment, ghosts, and Gods. The galaxy cauldron through star seeds give form to all beings. Universes, power, light, darkness, history, destiny, futures, possibilities and potential. Even the Cosmos itself has a star seed.

Use another definition because this part has been specifically debunked in the previous thread

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Use another definition because this part has been specifically debunked in the previous thread

It was not so try again.

Also, you can't debunk the literal words on the paper unless you're just going to be accepting falsehoods.

 

[MeiouHades]

unless you're just going to be accepting lies.

Sort of like how you've been lying by literally manipulating context and using two different versions of the same scan to support your point?

And in the Cauldron they are perfected/complete and one.

history, destiny, futures, possibilities and potential. Even the Cosmos itself has a star seed.

And here:

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Sort of like how you've been lying by literally manipulating context and using two different versions of the same scan to support your point?


And here:

Yawn. What is the point of you being so annoyingly aggressive with this baseless accusations.

Perfect and complete are the same word in Japanese which is why I used both scan interchangeable to provide further context.

perfect - Jisho.org

jisho.org

And your little screentake literally shows this? It literally says that perfect and complete are interchangeable.

What are you even trying to accomplish here with this other than to defame me?

 

[Vietthai96]

All living things regardless of their shape, size, or name, all celestial objects (everything in the heavens)

Not this again, back then you guys used a mistranslated scan for this, now you guys decide to use english localization scan that is also mistranslated???

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Not this again, back then you guys used a mistranslated scan for this, now you guys decide to use English localization scan that is also mistranslated???

We didn't mistranslate anything and we have always included this English scan in every thread. The English scan is not mistranslated.

Again, you guys can only make baseless accusations to derail a thread and stir confusion.

Do you have anything constructive to add?

 

[LegendariumOfLies]

Following & Neutral

 

[Vietthai96]

We didn't mistranslate anything and we have always included this English scan in every thread. The English scan is not mistranslated.

alright, i rechecked, the english localization is fine, but again the mistranslated scan is talking about this scan

anyway, back to the thread, again the same arguments as your previous CM1 upgrade thread with the exception of using the mistranslated scan, these arguments was addressed in this thread, the only difference thing here is instead of CM1, you are arguing for Metaphysical Aspects

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

Bruh lol, you need to wait 3 months or more to make Conceptual Manipulation CRT again.

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

alright, i rechecked, the english localization is fine, but again the mistranslated scan is talking about this scan

anyway, back to the thread, again the same arguments as your previous CM1 upgrade thread with the exception of using the mistranslated scan, these arguments was addressed in this thread, the only difference thing here is instead of CM1, you are arguing for Metaphysical Aspects

Star Seeds are already metaphysical aspects. This thread is make it its own blog and put it on the website as separate thing not tied to conceptual manipulation.

You guys are just making noise for the sake of making noise.

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Bruh lol, you need to wait 3 months or more to make CRT Conceptual Manipulation again.

Maybe instead of derailing, you should try reading.

 

[Robo432343]

The metaphysical aspects you are referring to obviously links with conceptual manipulation

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

Maybe instead of derailing, you should try reading.

I see that you are using the same statements??

 

[Vietthai96]

Star Seeds are already metaphysical aspects. This thread is make it its own blog and put it on the website as separate thing not tied to conceptual manipulation.

but that doesn't change the fact that the arguments was reused and it was rejected in previous threads, you can't add rejected arguments (explanation) into profile or making official blog, that is the problem, why people must arguing against the reused and rejected arguments???

okay, you want arguing???

Death Phantom, whose true form is his resentment

again the scan didn't say what you say, it only say that Death Phantom's resentment has been soaking the planet Nemesis for centuries, this was addressed in the previous thread and you still reusing this???, where is the true form statement???. No offense, the argument you present isn't what was presented in the scan already make me not want to see other arguments and scans already

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

again the scan didn't say what you say, it only say that Death Phantom's resentment has been soaking the planet Nemesis for centuries, this was addressed in the previous thread and you still reusing this???, where is the true form statement???. No offense, the argument you present isn't what was presented in the scan already make me not want to see other arguments and scans already

Because it's still true.

Death Phantom is dead. All that remains of him is his resentment which fused with the planet. I can add more scans if its unclear as it is now.

 

[Ultimate-Rex1]

I understand what @Iamunanimousinthat is trying to say, but the problem is that you can't use a statement that got debunked until after 3 months as I remember.

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

I understand what @Iamunanimousinthat is trying to say, but the problem is that you can't use a statement that got debunked until after 3 months as I remember.

It got "debunked" for Conceptual Manipulation.

Just because a statement doesn't fit the standards for x, doesn't mean it's false or untrue. That's absurd. The story is still the story, regardless of whether it fits in the wikis standards or not.

again the scan didn't say what you say, it only say that Death Phantom's resentment has been soaking the planet Nemesis for centuries, this was addressed in the previous thread and you still reusing this???, where is the true form statement???. No offense, the argument you present isn't what was presented in the scan already make me not want to see other arguments and scans already

I have updated the OP to make it more clear

 

[Vietthai96]

Oh yeah, he merged with the planet, not his true form being resentment itself, like, while i could see why you came up to that interpretation, i'm not agree with that, he was literally alive, just sealed off, and bro decide to cast off his body and merge with the planet, his resentment soaking the planet just referring to the resentment he has toward the Silver Millennium Kingdom? (i forgot what it called again)

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Oh yeah, he merged with the planet, not his true form being resentment itself, like, while i could see why you came up to that interpretation, i'm not agree with that, he was literally alive, just sealed off, and bro decide to cast off his body and merge with the planet, his resentment soaking the planet just referring to the resentment he has toward the Silver Millennium Kingdom? (i forgot what it called again)

???

Where does anywhere say that? You can't just make up an explanation that's not supported by what's on paper.

Did you skip the part where he's a corpse and rotted away a long time ago? And that it took centuries for his will to finally merge with the planet? And that resentment is what's left of him, aka his true form?

 

[Vietthai96]

???

Where does anywhere say that? You can't just make up an explanation that's not supported by what's on paper.

Did you skip the part where he's a corpse and rotted away a long time ago? And that it took centuries for his will to finally merge with the planet? And that resentment is what's left of him, aka his true form?

you said it yourself??, he left his rotten body to merge with the planet

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

you said it yourself??, he left his rotten body to merge with the planet

Now you're just making things up because the scan literally says, "rotted a way long time ago" and that it was "his will that merged with the planet" Not his body.

 

[Vietthai96]

Now you're just making things up because the scan literally says, "rotted a way long time ago" and that it was "his will that merged with the planet" Not his body.

making thing up what?, literally, his body rotten away, so he left it and merge with the planet???, aren't no way you not reading your own scan??

also, i need to sleep now, but even if i was agree with you of him being resentment itself, you entire album killed off you argument, literally proved that Death Phantom originally was a living person, and starseed give birth to living beings, nothing more, you claimed that starseed can give birth to non-physical beings, however he being a resentment was after his body rotten away and he merged with the planet, the starseed didn't birth the resentment, it is belong to Death Phantom, there is no true form, as he originally was a living person on earth and was exiled to Nemesis

all other scans was debunked in the previous downgrade, so i don't think there is anything to talk anymore

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

making thing up what?, literally, his body rotten away, so he left it and merge with the planet???, aren't no way you not reading your own scan??

Where on the paper does it say he left his body? You're just saying things without evidence. It literally says the planet soaked up his resentment over centuries.

also, i need to sleep now, but even if i was agree with you of him being resentment itself, you entire album killed off you argument, literally proved that Death Phantom originally was a living person, and starseed give birth to living beings, nothing more, you claimed that starseed can give birth to non-physical beings, however he being a resentment was after his body rotten away and he merged with the planet, the starseed didn't birth the resentment, it is belong to Death Phantom, there is no true form, as he originally was a living person on earth and was exiled to Nemesis

This line of argument doesn't work in anyway. His star seed is still his source of existence, whether he was a physical living being or just his resentment. Star seeds contain everything that makes up a person, it would also contain his will as that is an aspect of himself.

Also I provided other examples on nonphysical beings, so the idea that your non-argument killed my argument is just silly.

 

[MeiouHades]

What are Star Seeds?​

Star Seeds are the fundamental cores of everything in the Sailor Moon Universe. They are distillations of unknown power. They give birth to everything. All living things regardless of their shape, size, or name, all celestial objects (everything in the heavens). This is not just for physical beings, but non-physical beings such as Metallia who is pure darkness, Death Phantom, whose true form is his resentment,

This again? None of the scans you've used prove this. It is just explicitly not true, it was debunked in the CM Type 1 thread and I'll debunk it here yet again as well, but seriously, remove this. You're not doin' yourself any favors by using rejected stuff over and over.

The galaxy cauldron through star seeds give form to all beings.

I'm tired of hearin' this. Just say they create them, that's all.

Universes, power, light, darkness, history,

Where is this saying that the Cauldron creates history itself?? All this scan states is Guardian Cosmos asking Sailor Moon if she wants to begin a new history for herself, nothing about the Cauldron creating anything or "giving form to history" as you'd put it.

destiny, futures, possibilities and potential.

Mind telling me how the statement "Here, where all destinies begin, the time has come to start a new history for our galaxy" even remotely implies that the Cauldron is "giving form" to destinies? Nor does the "future" scan imply anything about the Cauldron creating or "giving form" to it. The possibilities point specifically was debunked multiple times in the previous CRT and you failed to counter it back then adequately, why exactly are you bringing this up?

Even the Cosmos itself has a star seed.

This specifically I don't buy, at all. You have no actual evidence that this the Starseed for the universe, if it was then it's destruction should've spelled immediate end for the universe as well and yet this scan and this scan along with many others like it don't suggest that, at all.

They come from the Cauldron which is the source of everything.

Not unless you have some actual evidence for it. I see nothing about histories, destinies, futures coming from the Cauldron. When will you stop taking flowery and poetic text hyperliterally?

The Cauldron governs the rises and falls of stars. It is the ultimate source of everything. Everything exists and pasts away in the cauldron. It is the primoradial sea and mother ocean. The sea of beginning. Everything was one with the Cauldron, and everything returns to the cauldron.

I am seriously impressed how many different ways you can find to state the exact same, mundane things. All this means is that the Cauldron creates all stars, and once they die they'll return to it. That's it. That's all you needed to say there.

Star Seeds and Sailor Crystals are concentrations of that primordial sea of pure potential. And in the Cauldron they are perfected/complete and one.

Yeah, no. This is just referring to their Completed Star forms, a literal transformation that every Sailor Senshi is shown possessing at the very ending when Guardian Cosmos throws them out of the Cauldron. In fact, this is proven further when she states that it isn't easy to maintain your Complete Star forms inside the Cauldron. This is subtle but extremely important to note for a series like Sailor Moon where you're willing to take everything hyperliterally and strip it of its context. It's just referring to their Complete Star forms, their literal physical forms.

How do star seeds define and govern the world?​

Star seeds give everything their form. They are the fundamental source. Star seeds contain everything about the form within themselves

Let me offer a small correction here. Everything that it is STATED* to contain, not literally everything you can think of. That'd be a No-limits fallacy.

They are the source of power for all characters. Manipulating the star seeds means you can completely recreate the form. Sailor Galaxia manipulated the Star Seeds to create evil versions of the main cast. They were not simply brainwashed, but remade to be evil and subservient to her. Sailor Galaxia was able to redefine who they were on a fundamental level. Even the quality of their power was altered.

So mind manipulation plus power bestowal? Cool ability, I guess? It's really not that impressive even if you argue that they're entirely new creatures from the scratch.

While star seeds govern and give form to things, Star seeds are also independent to the forms they give:

A. When Hotaru's body and soul were destroyed by Mistress 9, Sailor Saturn was still able to awaken because everything that makes her is in her Sailor Crystal.

Immortality?

B. When Mamoru was killed in the past, Chibi-Usa, his future daughter was completely unaffected. His future self was also not immediately erased by causality.

Starseeds granting Acausality, this was discussed at length in the previous CRT. I don't understand what you think you'll achieve by stating this over and over and over until you're blue in the face.

C. The Sailor Animamates are fake Sailor Senshi. They use the Sailor Crystals of dead Senshi as their power source. If Star Seeds weren't independent, those Sailor Crystals would have disappeared along with their dead original hosts.

Okay

But the forms are dependent on the star seeds:

A. After an unknown period of time, causality finally caught up to the future, Mamoru would have been erased but his Sailor Crystal kept him from being erased. (His daughter was still unaffected)

You're missing an important event in the middle that was pointed out to you in the previous thread as well. After past Tuxedo Mask and the Sailor Guardians were physically erased in order to have their star seeds stolen, we're actually shown that all of their future counterparts eventually collapsed and started to fade away due to that action, and before you say that this could just be a result of their Starseed being destroyed (why would they be destroyed lol, the goal was to steal them), the stolen past star seeds also had their power maintained to prevent them from losing light too, so the star seeds were clearly intact up until the point they were erased.

B. When Mamoru's crystal was thrown back into the cauldron and erased, Mamoru was erased across time, past, present, and future. His daughter, who completely erased as well.

The Starseed that was granting him resistance to causality manipulation was destroyed, restoring the normal causal chain in the future between a father and his child (if the heart attack had killed me a few weeks ago, my "future" child wouldn't exist).

No one can exist without their star seeds. And destroying the star seeds destroys everything in all parts of reality.

What Star Seeds aren't:​

Star seeds are not Souls. Here is a scene where Chibi-usa is a disembodied soul, and we see that her Sailor Crystal, the Silver Crystal is completely separate to her.
Hotaru, while being a disembodied soul, refers to a bigger self. That bigger self is obviously Sailor Saturn. Sailor Saturn who comes from her Sailor Crystal.

I have nothing against this, I've never said that Starseeds = Souls.

Star Seeds and Sailor Crystals are not physical.​

"Sailor Crystals are a distillation of power." (incase imgur is still not working)

"Sailor Crystals are a distillation of power."

This doesn't prove that the Starseeds aren't physical. In fact, one of these scans itself disproves you. Right here it's literally stated that "My tear crystalized to become the mystical silver crystal...." This right here hard disproves you along with the staggering about of evidence in that album itself showing the crystal being quite literally a physical object that's being held and manipulated. It described a physical object, a tear, and a physical phenomenon known as crystallization to describe how the Silver Crystal was formed. If this doesn't tell you that they literally ARE physical I don't know what will.

The series has on many occasions made clear that the physical crystals that house the power/sailor crystals is not the important part.

When Galaxia takes the Sailor Crystal, she destroys the physical crystal and takes the sailor crystal inside of it. And this isn't just established in the final arc either!

The crystal she takes is still physical, that's the gist of it.

Way back in the first arc, this distinction between the physical crystal and the power inside it is made abundantly clear. Sailor Moon subconsciously puts the power of the silver crystal inside Mamoru in order to save his life. After doing so, she renders the crystal into just a plain glass bauble. This is again repeated throughout the series that without the actual power, the silver crystal is just a piece of glass. The physical crystals act like conduits for the power inside.

No one, absolutely no one here, contested the idea that the power inside the crystals would be non-physical. Literally no one stated this, it wasn't even a point in the previous CRT because it's irrelevant. Heck, power can't even really be physical so even if you didn't have all those scans we still wouldn't be calling the power itself physical. The point was to show that these crystals themselves are just physical objects that can be manipulated physically, no one here is telling you that the power inside them is "physical" or unimportant.

The crystals themselves can have many physical manifestations that people can use, but ultimately, the physical bodies of the crystals are unimportant. It's the power inside. After all they are also the source of all power and abilities in the series.

That's not what you stated previously. You've been arguing continuously how the crystals themselves are these metaphysical, conceptual things that can't be manipulated physically, and when we showed mountains of evidence contradicting this, you've moved the goalpost to their "power". This is a clear case of Strawman fallacy.

They are concentrated power from the Cauldron, which is distinct and separated from reality and predates it entirely. Beings are erased across time and space when they enter the cauldron. The

Dude, their Starseed just gets nuked, that's why causality catching up to them and erases them. You stated this yourself above and I even gave you a scene that you didn't include to prove this further. The Cauldron, the source of the Starseeds, seems to erase themas well but that's a problem with the power system of the verse, not the Cauldron being some transcendent, superior existence separate from reality. This is just explicitly not true when we're literally told that a new Cauldron can pop-up even if this one is destroyed.

Every universe

No

star, planet, celestial object and being in the series comes from a star seed. They depend on the seeds for their very own existence. Star Seeds are concentrated power from the Cauldron, the ontological source of everything in the cosmology

Evidence would be greatly appreciated

that also governs reality. By manipulating them, you can control and alter the forms they create, and their destruction completely affects reality, by erasing the forms from all of history.

Which, as I said, is just a weakness of this power system. It can still be a fundamental aspect separate from the mind and body, but that doesn't mean it's the "ontological source of everything" (whatever that means). I don't really understand the point of this thread or what you're even arguing for here if I'm being honest. Even if I grant you that Starseeds can qualify for metaphysical aspects, you do realize that this doesn't make them non-physical right (and vice versa)? And you do understand that even if they're a Metaphysical aspect, that you'd still have to show or prove how they qualify for specific abilities if you want to give it to them, right?

 

[MeiouHades]

It got "debunked" for Conceptual Manipulation.

Just because a statement doesn't fit the standards for x, doesn't mean it's false or untrue. That's absurd. The story is still the story, regardless of whether it fits in the wikis standards or not.



I have updated the OP to make it more clear

This is just too funny dude.

I AM THE PLANET ITSELF (And Wiseman is Nemesis himself)

BUT NOW, I AM THE PLANET NEMESIS ITSELF

Three to four different statements here are outright stating or implying that he's the planet itself, not resentment, not whatever you're implying. Seriously dude....

 

[ChoursDropoff]

I think OP should focus on the new evidence in this thread, re-establish what ever evidence got dismissed in the previous thread in another thread.

 

[AsterReal]

This is just too funny dude.

I AM THE PLANET ITSELF (And Wiseman is Nemesis himself)

BUT NOW, I AM THE PLANET NEMESIS ITSELF

Three to four different statements here are outright stating or implying that he's the planet itself, not resentment, not whatever you're implying. Seriously dude....

His resentment merged with the planet. So Death Phantom is Nemesis for merging with the planet. What are you trying to say?

 

[MeiouHades]

His resentment merged with the planet. So Death Phantom is Nemesis for merging with the planet. What are you trying to say?

All I'm seeing here is that his will merged with the planet, which is fine (I think that qualifies for Abstract Existence here? Not entirely sure), but that is still a far cry from stating that his "true form" is his very resentment. That's an unsupported inference at best and downright contradicted at worst.

 

[RoninSlayer200]

His resentment merged with the planet. So Death Phantom is Nemesis for merging with the planet. What are you trying to say?

Merging with a planet doesn't make you a non-physical or abstract thing.

Like, you quite literally became a physical celestial object.

 

[MeiouHades]

Now if it was merging with the universe or space-time, then you might've had a stronger case but I'm just not seeing how anything here remotely implies that he is resentment itself when the panels go out of there way to beat this point to death that he is the planet itself.

 

[AsterReal]

Now if it was merging with the universe or space-time, then you might've had a stronger case but I'm just not seeing how anything here remotely implies that he is resentment itself when the panels go out of there way to beat this point to death that he is the planet itself.

Unanimous are not arguing that Death Phantom is resentment itself, but that his true form is HIS own resentment.

 

[MeiouHades]

Unanimous are not arguing that Death Phantom is resentment itself, but that his true form is HIS own resentment.

Unfortunately that's precisely where he's lacking in scans. There's nothing there really stating that, just that his body had rotten away and his will merged with the planet. If that's what you're referring to then I don't really understand the statement here. I suppose you could argue that it's his resentment that's actually his will but.... even that seems like a reach because I'm not sure what statement in those scans you can use to arrive at that interpretation

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

This is just too funny dude.

I AM THE PLANET ITSELF (And Wiseman is Nemesis himself)

BUT NOW, I AM THE PLANET NEMESIS ITSELF

Three to four different statements here are outright stating or implying that he's the planet itself, not resentment, not whatever you're implying. Seriously dude....

You are aware that every honest person who reads the scan I am posted knows that your arguments are irrational?

Death Phantom started as a human on earth and then was defeated and then sealed on planet Nemesis. He died on nemesis, and his body rotted away. His will and resentment was soaked up by Nemesis and he merged with the planet. Sailor Moon called his true form, his resentment. We see a wispy shadow of himself when she calls him out. His isn't in his planet form when he says that.

I don't even understand why you're fixated on this other than just just drag another thread down the gutter with endless arguments?

Metallia has no physical form and comes from a star seed, there ae the examples of the ghosts. whatever you're arguing is moot and just a distraction.

No one, absolutely no one here, contested the idea that the power inside the crystals would be non-physical. Literally no one stated this, it wasn't even a point in the previous CRT because it's irrelevant. Heck, power can't even really be physical so even if you didn't have all those scans we still wouldn't be calling the power itself physical. The point was to show that these crystals themselves are just physical objects that can be manipulated physically, no one here is telling you that the power inside them is "physical" or unimportant.

I have a direct statement that says sailor crystals are distillations of power.

Also you're completely misrepresenting and ignoring the actual argument:

This doesn't prove that the Starseeds aren't physical. In fact, one of these scans itself disproves you. Right here it's literally stated that "My tear crystalized to become the mystical silver crystal...." This right here hard disproves you along with the staggering about of evidence in that album itself showing the crystal being quite literally a physical object that's being held and manipulated. It described a physical object, a tear, and a physical phenomenon known as crystallization to describe how the Silver Crystal was formed. If this doesn't tell you that they literally ARE physical I don't know what will.
The crystal she takes is still physical, that's the gist of it.
No one, absolutely no one here, contested the idea that the power inside the crystals would be non-physical. Literally no one stated this, it wasn't even a point in the previous CRT because it's irrelevant. Heck, power can't even really be physical so even if you didn't have all those scans we still wouldn't be calling the power itself physical. The point was to show that these crystals themselves are just physical objects that can be manipulated physically, no one here is telling you that the power inside them is "physical" or unimportant.

I have shown that the series absolutely differentiates the physical crystal with the power in side it. And has on multiple occasions stated that the crystal is just a glass bauble without the power.

Here is a literally scan:



Showing the power leaving the physical crystal.

You are conflating the physical crystal with the actual power. The series has on many occasions stressed it's about the power inside. I understand that you need to ignore that because it just deflates everything you're saying, but at least try to appear neutral.

Where is this saying that the Cauldron creates history itself?? All this scan states is Guardian Cosmos asking Sailor Moon if she wants to begin a new history for herself, nothing about the Cauldron creating anything or "giving form to history" as you'd put it.

Mind telling me how the statement "Here, where all destinies begin, the time has come to start a new history for our galaxy" even remotely implies that the Cauldron is "giving form" to destinies? Nor does the "future" scan imply anything about the Cauldron creating or "giving form" to it. The possibilities point specifically was debunked multiple times in the previous CRT and you failed to counter it back then adequately, why exactly are you bringing this up?

The Cauldron creates universes. Acting like destinies and histories and futures is somehow a stretch (despite being literally written on the paper) is so funny to me. We already know there exists alternate versions of universes with alternate futures.

Yeah, no. This is just referring to their Completed Star forms, a literal transformation that every Sailor Senshi is shown possessing at the very ending when Guardian Cosmos throws them out of the Cauldron. In fact, this is proven further when she states that it isn't easy to maintain your Complete Star forms inside the Cauldron. This is subtle but extremely important to note for a series like Sailor Moon where you're willing to take everything hyperliterally and strip it of its context. It's just referring to their Complete Star forms, their literal physical forms.

Already debunked this bad take. complete and perfect are the same word in Japanese. And it literally cannot be their physical forms because the cauldron is not apart of the physical realm and they were erased from past, present, and future before entering.

Immortality?
Starseeds granting Acausality, this was discussed at length in the previous CRT. I don't understand what you think you'll achieve by stating this over and over and over until you're blue in the face.
Okay
You're missing an important event in the middle that was pointed out to you in the previous thread as well. After past Tuxedo Mask and the Sailor Guardians were physically erased in order to have their star seeds stolen, we're actually shown that all of their future counterparts eventually collapsed and started to fade away due to that action, and before you say that this could just be a result of their Starseed being destroyed (why would they be destroyed lol, the goal was to steal them), the stolen past star seeds also had their power maintained to prevent them from losing light too, so the star seeds were clearly intact up until the point they were erased.

if t's just immortality and accasuality, explain why Mamoru was erased from the past too? Mamoru's star seed was destroyed in the present and his past was erased too.

Which, as I said, is just a weakness of this power system. It can still be a fundamental aspect separate from the mind and body, but that doesn't mean it's the "ontological source of everything" (whatever that means). I don't really understand the point of this thread or what you're even arguing for here if I'm being honest. Even if I grant you that Starseeds can qualify for metaphysical aspects, you do realize that this doesn't make them non-physical right (and vice versa)? And you do understand that even if they're a Metaphysical aspect, that you'd still have to show or prove how they qualify for specific abilities if you want to give it to them, right?

Star seeds already qualify for metaphysical aspects. They're currently accepted as an equivalent to information.

 

[AsterReal]

Unfortunately that's precisely where he's lacking in scans. There's nothing there really stating that, just that his body had rotten away and his will merged with the planet. If that's what you're referring to then I don't really understand the statement here. I suppose you could argue that it's his resentment that's actually his will but.... even that seems like a reach because I'm not sure what statement in those scans you can use to arrive at that interpretation

Death Phantom claims that his will merged with Nemesis and Sailor Mercury then says that his resentment merged with Nemesis and that moves the Planet. Sailor Moon calls Death Phantom when it's just her will, "her true form." Is that not enough evidence or does it require more context?

 

[MeiouHades]

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Death Phantom claims that his will merged with Nemesis and Sailor Mercury then says that his resentment merged with Nemesis and that moves the Planet. Sailor Moon calls Death Phantom when it's just her will, "her true form." Is that not enough evidence or does it require more context?

And not to mention, that when Sailor Moon asks, "Is this your true form?" she has already seen Death Phantom merged with the planet.

 

[Da3ggman]

Wonder if this thread will mysteriously asked to get closed after staff decide to vote against it….

 

[Iamunanimousinthat]

Wonder if this thread will mysteriously asked to get closed after staff decide to vote against it….

If they vote against it, they'll just be voting against putting accepted information in a blog...

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

They can still vote against already accepted information.
They are not infallible