Possibly Controversial High 3-A Upgrade for MCU Scarlet Witch

[Yoazkk6188]

Instead of Her having High 3-A with Fire Manipulation from destroying the darkhold, we recently discussed that she should only scale that high when she is amplified by the Darkhold and is at her peak

New Proposal: “7-A physically, at least 6-A with Magic, up to High 3-A at peak”

High 3-A at Peak Explain: Wanda destroyed the Darkhold in every universe by igniting them and turning them to ash with her magic, which would make her High 3-A with Magic.
She also has a statement of destroying Darkhold castle in every universe to support. Wanda destroying every darkhold is not due to her destroying the castle, in fact there is no evidence that all darkhold are linked. In deadpool 3 it was shown that there was a statue of the scarlet witch from Wundagore in the void, suggesting that there are alternate variants of the Darkhold Castle in the multiverse. There are also other scarlet witch variants, such as Wanda Merlin from What If Season Two and Infinity Witch from MCU What If Immersive Story, and we know that the title of Scarlet Witch is connected to the Darkhold which exists in every universe, so it likely implies she has a throne in other universes as well.
-In order for her to burn every infinite Darkhold it would require her to produce an infinite energy output to magically ignite infinite darkholds at the same time.
-However sorcerer like Strange and Wong have shields that scale to her because they can block her magic blasts. So to avoid them scaling to her High 3-A, she would be High 3-A only at her peak.
-As Wanda become High 3-A from destroying darkhold, we assume that is because she was amplified by darkhold as she has the power from the Darkhold Castle.
-Wanda can only dreamwalk and connect to other universes if she has the darkhold, so when she is amplified by darkhold, which is at her peak, she can only use High 3-A Energy.

Supporting Statements:

• The MCU Timeline Book states that the scarlet witch has the power to bend reality to her will or destroy it entirely. Which goes with the statement from wong she is prophesied to rule or annihilate the cosmos, so when added with MCU timeline book statement, she can rule or annihilate the cosmos because she possesses the power to bend reality and can also destroy it entirely.
• She is also able to overwhelm Kamar Taj who is stated by Kevin Feige capable of stop inter-dimensional forces from wiping out all of reality, and the Masters of the Mystic Arts are being no match for her dark powers.
• Her power exceeds the Sorcerer Supremes, which includes Agamotto the first sorcerer supreme, who has spells that can fracture all reality (From Mcu What If Immersive Story) and she is a being of unfathomable magic, making her possibly more dangerous than the infinity stones which Wong states are near-unfathomable

wanda’s existence erasure
Wanda should receive Soul Erasure or have NPI be listed alongside her Existence Erasure for the following reasons: She has NPI for harming the souls of the damned with her magic but in the scene she doesn’t simply harm them and she straight up causes them to vanish completely where they don’t come back anymore and I think that could be also used as a justification for her existence erasure and that she could use it offensively (only in rare occasions)

And that a Soul is the essence of who someone is (Listed in dormammu profile but the scan for it isnt visible, so I dont know if it useable) so NPI and EE can be listed together and her erasing the souls of the damned can be conjoined with the darkhold erasure justification

At least 6-A, likely far higher, up to high 3-A via fire manipulation or magic
Agree:
Neutral:
Disagree:

Existence Erasure and NPI listed together or Soul Erasure for Wanda
Agree:
Neutral:
Disagree:

 

[Baabasaplar95]

I've seen the explanations for all of these many times. Strongly Disagree to the entire op.

 

[Qawsedf234]

which the Multiverse contains an uncountable infinite amount of timelines, so erasing uncountable infinite amount of 3D matter would be 4D

The multiverse contains an infinite amount of timelines and an uncountable infinite number of universes. Erasing the Darkhold from the multiverse is only working with a standard infinity (if that).

the Ancient one who can split a timeline into two and allowed it to exist together,

This isn't a Tier 2 feat.

Richie Palmer so maybe she can possibly upscale from Arishem

You'd have to prove that Palmer knows about Arishem for that to work.

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

again with this thing.

 

[Kaandnyy]

I don't agree with any of them.

 

[Yoazkk6188]

The multiverse contains an infinite amount of timelines and an uncountable infinite number of universes. Erasing the Darkhold from the multiverse is only working with a standard infinity (if that).

The mcu multiverse is actually a structure with all the infinite timelines branching out into more infinite timelines, with those other timelines also doing the same so it would be an uncountable amount of timelines

Mcu cosmology: (With this we can conclude that all of the uncountable infinite timelines that branched out indefinitely from the Sacred Timeline at least contain an infinite number of universes, realities and dimensions, endless possibilities where every passing/singular moment can branch out into infinite realities and possibilities, making each single branch a 2-A structure which in turn can branch out into uncountable infinite 2-A structures on its own, and so on ad infinitum with each single branch.) Timelines contain infinite possibilities which would be 2-A structure and with every infinite moment branch into infinite timelines and those branches doing the same it would be Low 1-C multiverse

So wanda destroying mount wundagore through unknown means with erasing darkhold in every uncountable infinite amount of timelines I think would be a higher infinity of getting rid of all wundagores and darkhold all at once which is why she has Low Complex Multiverse range”

 

[Yoazkk6188]

You'd have to prove that Palmer knows about Arishem for that to work.

I don’t know if he does, but According to the MCU Fandom, (Richie Palmer was a production assistant on Guardians of Galaxy, development assistant on: Doctor Strange, Thor: Ragnarok, and others, manager of production and development on Avengers Infinity War and Endgame, WandaVision, and more, and co-producer on multiverse of madness)

If Richie Palmer is familiar with Doctor Strange 1, could the “most powerful” statement be used to put her possibly above Dormammu? Universe term is intertwined with the usage of Timeline terms in the MCU. Alongside her possessing the Darkhold which is stated by him to be ultimate evil/greatest power of evil in the multiverse among the sorcerers, is a pure source of all evil in the multiverse, and how Darkhold and Book of Vishanti are both antitheses to each other, The Book Of Vishanti also is greatest power of good in the Multiverse and also was used by the illuminati to defeat Thanos who had Four Infinity Stones in the scene, but is unknown how the book of vishanti was used in the fight, The Darkhold stated to be a great threat to all of the multiverse with Wanda using it, and Agatha practicing the darkest of magic imaginable from the Darkhold. And with Wong saying that she is a being of unfathomable magic and Sam Raimi saying that her chaos magic is the most powerful than all characters in the picture, could that be used to say Wanda’s Magic is possibly greater than Dormammu’s Magic? Could Wanda be At least 6-A, likely far higher, up to possiblyat least 2-B with Magic based on these statements or would that only apply for her using the darkhold not with her own magic? (At least 6-A, likely far higher with Magic, Possibly at least 2-B with the Darkhold)

What do you think:

So with her destroying Wundagore would be At least 6-A, likely far higher, up to possibly Low 2-C with Magic

And by statements of her having the power to destroy reality entirely and scaling from Agamotto’s spells in What if Immersive story, At least 6-A, likely far higher, up to possibly 3-A with Magic

Or with the most powerful and Darkhold statements
At least 6-A, likely far higher, up to possibly at least 2-B with Magic
At least 6-A, likely far higher with Magic; Possibly at least 2-B with the Darkhold

And even if Wanda cant be upgraded could you comment on whether her completely destroying the Souls of the Damned can be used as another justification for her existence erasure? And Wanda also erasing Doctor Strange’s Sling Ring could be used as another justification

 

[HswLOTSS]

Neutral.

 

[Qawsedf234]

The mcu multiverse is actually a structure with all the infinite timelines branching out into more infinite timelines, with those other timelines also doing the same so it would be an uncountable amount of timelines

That's an infinite amount of timelines but an uncountable infinite number of universes since the timelines are 2-A. The timelines are explicitly branching due to choice and free will, meanings it's not a quantum based branch which is what gives you an uncountable infinite number of alternate branches.

production assistant

That just means they assisted film making in some capacity. That's not a writing or directing position. That's like asking a costume designer how strong Antman is.

Wanda’s Magic is possibly greater than Dormammu’s Magic?

Not really.

So with her destroying Wundagore would be At least 6-A, likely far higher, up to possibly Low 2-C with Magic

The most you can theoretically have is High 3-A with Existence Erasure. There's nothing Tier 2 about the feat.

 

[Yoazkk6188]

The most you can theoretically have is High 3-A with Existence Erasure. There's nothing Tier 2 about the feat.

if you don't agree with Tier 2, I have no objection, and there's also the matter of EE breaking her soul

As far as you can see, the H3A makes sense if you're considering it as an upgrade

 

[Yoazkk6188]

Bump

 

[FentyBeauty]

im late to this but anyways wanda doesnt have existence erasure anymore so idk if that changes anything

as for her killing the souls of the damned, wouldn’t that be like soul destruction/manipulation or something

 

[Yoazkk6188]

Bump

Since scarlet witch had destroy every darkhold with existence erasure removed from her profile and replaced with fire manipulation instead, I changed her upgrade option via EE to fire manipulation instead as she has shown infinite power to burn objects with infinite number

 

[LMalone22]

Since scarlet witch had destroy every darkhold with existence erasure removed from her profile and replaced with fire manipulation instead, I changed her upgrade option via EE to fire manipulation instead as she has shown infinite power to burn objects with infinite number

This seems reasonable enough to be an AP

---

whereas countably infinite numbers are included under High Universe level.

 

[Yoazkk6188]

Bump

 

[Richard5128pm]

Agree with High 3-A AP with fire manipulation

 

[BEYONDER19999]

I agree to High 3-A AP

 

[Yoazkk6188]

I agree to High 3-A AP

Agree with High 3-A AP with fire manipulation

Thanks

 

[Yoazkk6188]

Bump

 

[LMalone22]

bump

 

[LMalone22]

bump This CRT has been around for a long time

 

[Yoazkk6188]

Bump

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

I suppose High 3-A makes sense.

 

[LMalone22]

Need more 2 staff

 

[DivineCreator389]

In Scarlet Witch’s profile, Wandas destroying darkhold is not existence erasure it is fire manipulation so she can get high 3-A

I agree with H3-A, as Wanda can destroy the Darkhold in every universe. She also has a prophecy to either rule or annihilate the cosmos, which could support her AP and power at a universal level. However, I don't think she would use that level of power in battle.

with fire manipulation

I disagree with fire manipulation, as her power should be attributed to Chaos manipulation or Magic. She destroyed the Book of Vishanti with her magic blast, causing it to burn, which is clearly not fire manipulation. Her base power is manipulating elements of chaos, not fire magic, so via Chaos manipulation or Magic would be a better choice.

wanda’s existence erasure
Wanda should receive Soul Erasure or have NPI be listed alongside her Existence Erasure for the following reasons: She has NPI for harming the souls of the damned with her magic but in the scene she doesn’t simply harm them and she straight up causes them to vanish completely where they don’t come back anymore and I think that could be also used as a justification for her existence erasure and that she could use it offensively (only in rare occasions)

Could it be that soul manipulation is more fitting than EE, given that she created souls for her twin children? She doesn't appear to have any statements suggesting she can or could perform existence erasure. At best, we only have statements like her having the power to rewrite reality as she chooses, and there's the instance where she blasted a random sorcerer out of the screen during the Kamar-Taj battle scene. However, that isn't strong evidence for assuming she has EE. Maybe we should wait for her to show more abilities if she returns to the screen.

If Richie Palmer is familiar with Doctor Strange 1, could the “most powerful” statement be used to put her possibly above Dormammu?

could that be used to say Wanda’s Magic is possibly greater than Dormammu’s Magic?

Nope.Scarlet Witch (Earth-616) has a statement that she has the power to rule or annihilate the cosmos, which at best is H3-A, as she demonstrated the power to destroy the Darkhold across realities. Even in another reality, where Wanda gained more knowledge in What If? Season 2, Wanda Merlin (who is also stated to be the Scarlet Witch) struggles to slow down incursions between realities, placing her at low 2-C, which is still below Dormammu. Perhaps, with America Chavez’s power to amplify her magic, she could potentially battle Dormammu.

Could Wanda be At least 6-A, likely far higher, up to possiblyat least 2-B with Magic based on these statements or would that only apply for her using the darkhold not with her own magic? (At least 6-A, likely far higher with Magic, Possibly at least 2-B with the Darkhold)

Darkhold should be low2-C via environmental destruction or at least low 2-C as it can cause the incursion.At least 2-B seems too high based on what was shown in the movie .

 

[LMalone22]

The most you can theoretically have is High 3-A with Existence Erasure. There's nothing Tier 2 about the feat.

After a long argument and owner of CRT has changed the topic, so what are your thoughts on the new topic?

 

[FentyBeauty]

well if ppl are fine with high 3-A via fire manipulation being used then i agree with it ig

 

[Baabasaplar95]

I'm okay with H3A fire manip. BUT I'm against any H3A other than Fire Manip, obviously Fire manip

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

High 3-A looks alright.

 

[LMalone22]

In conclusion, she will get H3-A with fire manipulation or magic

 

[Bernkastelll]

In conclusion, she will get H3-A with fire manipulation or magic

magic

 

[LMalone22]

magic

Yeah because that is her power too because if she didn't have infinite power she can't destroy every darkhold with only fire manipulation

 

[BunBun]

In Scarlet Witch’s profile, Wandas destroying darkhold is not existence erasure it is fire manipulation so she can get high 3-A with fire manipulation

wanda’s existence erasure
Wanda should receive Soul Erasure or have NPI be listed alongside her Existence Erasure for the following reasons: She has NPI for harming the souls of the damned with her magic but in the scene she doesn’t simply harm them and she straight up causes them to vanish completely where they don’t come back anymore and I think that could be also used as a justification for her existence erasure and that she could use it offensively (only in rare occasions)

And that a Soul is the essence of who someone is (Listed in dormammu profile but the scan for it isnt visible, so I dont know if it useable) so NPI and EE can be listed together and her erasing the souls of the damned can be conjoined with the darkhold erasure justification

At least 6-A, likely far higher, up to high 3-A via fire manipulation or magic
Agree:
Neutral:
Disagree:

Existence Erasure and NPI listed together or Soul Erasure for Wanda
Agree:
Neutral:
Disagree:

Agree

 

[Richard5128pm]

In conclusion, she will get H3-A with fire manipulation or magic

It has to be magic

 

[FentyBeauty]

Yeah because that is her power too because if she didn't have infinite power she can't destroy every darkhold with only fire manipulation

okay but wont that cause issues tho bc we have sorcerers like strange, ancient one, etc that have shields which scale to her from them blocking her attacks

unless like.. we just remove that from their durability section since those sorcerers could only pull that off by being in groups or something idk like if wanda could only destroy them darkholds from being amped by the darkhold itself

 

[LMalone22]

okay but wont that cause issues tho bc we have sorcerers like strange, ancient one, etc that have shields which scale to her from them blocking her attacks

No one can scale because her attacks are her base power, not destruction of objects or infinite matter

 

[FentyBeauty]

No one can scale because her attacks are her base power, not destruction of objects or infinite matter

her regular attacks r magic blasts which is like her magic tho- bc if she were to have high 3-A via magic from destroying the darkholds then like wouldn’t those attacks be the same bc its from her magic

 

[LMalone22]

her regular attacks r magic blasts which is like her magic tho- bc if she were to have high 3-A via magic from destroying the darkholds then like wouldn’t those attacks be the same bc its from her magic

High 3-A: High Universe level​

Characters or objects that demonstrate an infinite amount of energy on a 3-D scale, such as creating or destroying infinite mass, or those who can affect an infinite 3-D space. This extends to an infinite number of finite or infinite-sized 3-D universes or pocket dimensions when not accounting for any higher dimensions or time. Large numbers of infinite 3-D universes, unless causally closed from one another by a separate spacetime or existence, only count for a higher level of this tier. Being "infinitely" stronger than this level, unless uncountably so, does not qualify for any higher tier.

 

[Hixkaryana]

her regular attacks r magic blasts which is like her magic tho- bc if she were to have high 3-A via magic from destroying the darkholds then like wouldn’t those attacks be the same bc its from her magic

She destroyed the Darkholds using a hax, which I don’t think was mentioned here. So it would be impossible to scale Stephen or Ancient One to her blasts.

 

[FentyBeauty]

High 3-A: High Universe level​

Characters or objects that demonstrate an infinite amount of energy on a 3-D scale, such as creating or destroying infinite mass, or those who can affect an infinite 3-D space. This extends to an infinite number of finite or infinite-sized 3-D universes or pocket dimensions when not accounting for any higher dimensions or time. Large numbers of infinite 3-D universes, unless causally closed from one another by a separate spacetime or existence, only count for a higher level of this tier. Being "infinitely" stronger than this level, unless uncountably so, does not qualify for any higher tier.

ik that but like.. i’m asking that wouldn’t her magic attacks be High 3-A also if ur saying it would apply to her magic rather than for her fire manipulation

so r u basically saying that her magic is high 3-A from destroying the darkhold but its not when she’s using her magic attacks??