Just so you know I don't make intentional stomp threads. I checked Sephiroth's profile and from what I saw it seemed like this matchup could work.
Also just so you know what I'm using is Sephiroth's second key.
Well, Spiritual Energy strikes the Spirit, which translates into the Mind and Soul, as well as causing emotions to go into disarray and memories to scramble. This is done in conceptual and informational level, so it does need resistance to prevent it. And also warps space-time. And also allows users to interact with abstracts made of information, energy, nonexistent beings and transdual entities.
If Kirin had Prevasion it would at least pass through but she don’t got that here
Guess this one doesn’t apply here, since Prevasion doesn’t exist here, and if it does exist you’d have to hit (Layered? Maybe?) Electrons- which could happen since Fire/Blizzard can accelerate or slow electrons, but still not sure about actually hurting them
GV can Prevade Type 3 Conceptual Soul/Mind, Space, and Time. Informational is a no-no, Kirin does resist them, but uh, not enough for this. Besides any hit would one shot
Well for future reference the upcoming CRT should place her sealing with 2-3 Layers (Glaives < Kirin < Djinn Kirin Sealing). Still not accepted yet tho
Four times is uh a lot
But that rule can be changed, right? As you mentiond, Mystic can allow her to use the ability to give her a better advantage.
If Kirin was allowed to use Prevasion, I guess Sephiroth can try to affect her electrons with Blizzaga or Firaga. Figuring this out isn't that unlikely either, given his perma active mind and memory scan can gather information on her abilities. Unless she resist's Telepathy that is.
Okay, I deal very little with more esoteric out there stuff, but does Type 3 protect you from Type 1?
Still good enough if you ask me. Even if both Sephiroth and Kirin are baseline right now, Kirin's sealing feats are better than what Sephiroth can resist which is just Aerith's Seal Evil sealing the movements of the enemy.
Ah... frig. Well, it's not a blitz or anything. I was just pointing out that Sephiroth can't just emulate uncountable Speed Plus Materia for a 100x amp or something
What I'm worried about is that giving Kirin Prevasion might make her completely unhittable, so if Sephiroth has the means to bypass it then I guess it's fine.
Kirin doe have these::
Tbh I'm not entirely sure if it'll even work because accelerating and deccelerating doesn't mean you can hurt the thing. However Sephiroth can simply Time Stop instead and hit Kirin before she becomes electrons to defend anyways
Nope, different types of intangibility require different feats to bypass (elemental NPI to beat elemental intang, soul NPI to beat soul intang)
Nah, I'm pretty sure the hierarchy is 1 > 2 > 3. Tbh idk this specific stuff either
There is Teseo who can convert matter into computer data and vice versa... so... I mean if its computer data that has information about reality, and therefore Teseo states he can affect reality with that power- and space even warps/loops in his stage which was made from his Septima... I guess that counts as some kind of Type 2 Information? He can transform GV into data to instant kill him until GV3 decided to say "no", but Kirin doesn't have this herself without GV turning her back from being data
She got it
Tbh it comes down to what Sephiroth decides to use first, Time Stop would be his best option, and it's probably more likely for it to happen than using Materia abilities he hasn't directly showcased
I'd want to ask on if this Time Stop is of the kind that allows doing damage in Sephiroth's relative time, or the damage only happens once the Time Stop wears off, if it's the latter then Prevasion would trigger, I'd think.
If Remake is to go by, it damage follows the caster rather than the time of the target.
Physically yes, if Sephiroth's NPI isn't good enough. He can still target souls directly with his attacks.
These are pretty good, but the stat gap is too big. Sephiroth also resists Stat Reduction.
I guess Warden Flash would normally work for Sephiroth's regular attacks, but again, the stat gap is too big.
Hmmm... none of Sephiroth's ranged attacks are physical, they are all informational/conceptual. Not to mention, Spiritual Energy bypasses shields, barriers, reflection, even alter space-time alterations.
Normally this would work pretty well, but the stat gap is an issue again.
Dispel might be an issue here. Limit Breaks also bypass invulnerability so Octaslash would work..
Strictly speaking, it alters electrons with enough potency to create combustion or slow them enough to reduce temperature to freezing point. But, you got me there I really don't know how it would deal with prevasion.
Hmmm... got it. There are some feats here and there but dunno if they would amount to anything.
Was checking out and yeah, this is the case.
This is something that it's talked about in the blog but isn't exactly applied yet and is somewhat related to layering. The power of Spiritual Energy is tied directly to how strong a person's Spirit is and that can be gauged by how resillient their Spirit is shown to be. People can get Mako Poisoning from prolongued or big exposure to Mako (even something like staying for too long on a place where there's mako fumes nearby, which is what got Jessie's dad in a Mako Poisoning induced coma). Sephiroth on his end can stay inside the Lifestream itself without issue, which is the accumulated Spiritual Energy of all living beings that have ever lived in the Planet (which Rebirth apparently Retconned into the universe across an infinite Multiverse). Additionally, in the final battle of the original game, he could harm Cloud's Spirit in the one on one duel, despite Cloud also enduring the Lifestream.
Yeah, I think that would count as Info Type 2. If Gunvolt nopes that ability then he should be resistant.
So in Kirin's case is not exactly a resistance, more like regenerating or being restored from it thanks to Gunvolt. Which makes me think, if Gunvolt can turn restore a person from data into a real individual, that would count as limited Info Manip for him, wouldn't it?
You can't beat the miko girl with the power of J-Pop backing her up.
He does use Slow and Stop rather frequently in his battle. He also tries to immobilize and kill his enemies with telekinesis.
A couple of other things I forgot to mention:
As said before, idk how the interaction works, but Kirin has showcased Prevading attacks that directly damage her soul, it may not be on a Information/Concept level, but the fact that Prevasion is a factor at all would mean that you'd have to get past it to hit her soul (as in, the soul isn't just floating seperately, suspectible to being hit by soul targetting attacks- because if it was then Prevasion would just... never ever work against those types of attacks, but it clearly did).
It scales off of her Radiant Fetters' Sealing stuff
Yeah, Image Pulsing buffs are probably a no go, and yeah, Limit Breaks too
Mhm, if reducing the temperatures a person's body to below AZ (somehow below AZ exists) doesn't work, I don't think a Blizzaga will either
While I personally say that hitting electricity is good enough, pretty sure how it actually works in the system is that you have to specifically hit electrons which is kind of unfair ngl, but it is what it is
Again, gonna need more time to figure out how the interaction works
Guess that's one more thing to add to the CRT... even though it's technically there already...
Yeah, this ability is him replicating the same Teseo Info Manip, directly referencing him as someone who can turn things into electronic data and back. Tbh, this doesn't really matter for Kirin since GV isn't even there, and Sephiroth's thing is just kinda different tbh
i still have no clue how i managed to have her beat a Fate character
Time Stop is probably his best bet assuming the soulhax doesn't work. Kirin can just teleport out of telekinesis.
Kirin goes for the seal 100% of the time as her opening move, and I'm assuming this is Bizarro Sephiroth? I find it hard to believe that he would opt to dodge than block somehow
Hmmm... not good. Sephiroth resists all that.
While Sephiroth does resist Power Null, I think this would actually work normally. Sephiroth's intangibility isn't particularly noteworthy beyond phasing through matter. Immortality also isn't a major issue, given Sephiroth's is not combat applicable.
If you ask me it sounds like Tenjian's abilities also have the NPI required to interact with Prevasion, while the Black Badge user doesn't. They both target the soul, but given only Tenjian has the proper NPI, only his abilities work, while the other individual's simply miss. Though it's kinda trippy that Prevasion which affects matter can turn the immaterial soul into electrons too.
Did Gunvolt's abilities were already 4D when he fought Tenjian and the Black Badge guy or they evolved into 4D after their encounter? Maybe GV had 3D abilities by the time he fought those two and they got stronger later on. As far as I know, Gunvolt became magnitudes stronger between ASG2 and 3, right? If that's the case then it wouldn't be strange that Tenjian's abilities worked given what I mentioned above and they would simply fail to affect GV by the time his abilities reach 4D.
Sephiroth is unlikely to use magic he's never shown to use before in a fight like this His teleport is useful, but he doesn't use it to avoid every attack
He uses magic in his Crisis Core boss fight against Zack, despite that being the moment where his megalomania broke out, and also in Remake where he pretty much was toying around. This is also the original FFVII key, where he uses magic very frequently during that battle as Bizarro and Safer Sephiroth.
I didn't say he doesn't use magic often, just that he's unlikely to use spells he's never shown to use
Ah, my bad, I misread your post. Instead of: "Sephiroth is unlikely to use magic he's never shown to use..." I read it as "Sephiroth is unlikely to use magic, he's never shown to use..."
Greed Snatcher actually scales even higher than Kirin's Radiant Fetters when it comes to power null, so that's another Layer to worry about
GV fought Tenjian in GV2 and GV3. The first time he just completely died to the soul freeze. The second time he was 4D by the time he fought Tenjian.
There are several moments where you're able to hit all types of elemental manip, and even electrical constructs, but the thing that hit the electrical constructs just doesn't work on Prevasion- so for the sake of sticking to consistency, so unforrtunately I'd say no. Prevasion is fricking annoying to deal with, but Kirin actually needs it to survive
Actually, after some thinking, I've come to the conclusion that it wouldn't HURT Kirin, but it would inflict Mako Poisoning.
Nah, she's very much capable of doing all of her attacks while Prevading, the only one who disables Prevasion while attacking is GV in GV1&2 when specifically using his Flashfield
Oh, then Teleport Spam moment into Sealing
Counted and thanks for joining in.
Kirin's resistance is 3D compared to Sephiroth's 4D since we're taking the accepted additions into account
If it is I need to get that Damnatio Memorie layer back then
So is it safe to assume that Sephiroth's Time Stop will still work for now?
Even if it's a possibly that's still 2-3 Layers that Sephiroth needs to get past, and judging by his profile it doesn't seem like any of his hax are layered.
That's because layers have never been looked into in FFVII. I do have some stuff that could translate into something, but need to eventually take it to the layer evaluation thread or make a CRT.
Yeah, ok. But I'll still be bumping this so that no one forgets about it.
