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One Piece: Oh shit, Giant Hands and Flaming Feet actually do be strong?

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Big changes aren't the issue. Big changes that aren't supported by all of the other Post-Timeskip calcs thus far is a bit of an issue to me.

If Whitebeard's calc was Continent level, would you be okay with all of the Post-Timeskip characters being 1/4 of Continent level?
Depends on the scaling chain, which again would narratively make sense if Character A, B and C tanked 1/4 of a continent level attack instead of completely discrediting feats and claiming every time a Character tanks something it's an "outlier" or inconsistent with the scaling chain.

I mean, why do you think scaling
chain exist in the first place? Because not everyone scales to Insert character except said character has feats to back it up.
 
Big changes aren't the issue. Big changes that aren't supported by all of the other Post-Timeskip calcs thus far is a bit of an issue to me.

If Whitebeard's calc was Continent level, would you be okay with all of the Post-Timeskip characters being 1/4 of Continent level?
I need to ask you, would you be okay with that? If not then why?
 
Just because there was 2 people doesn't mean it gets split in half, the multiplier page states against this.
It goes against the reverse, that 2 people with united attacks don't get double the force (not 2 people blocking an attack means their individual AP is half), except for OP (I'll link it below) we've tackled it and it's confirmed to work like that in OP.
What revision?
 
I will also ask, does Luffy's Accelerated Development not also impact this scaling? Like can we really consider the Luffy start of Post-timeskip comparable enough to the one that ends up squaring off with Big Mom at Whole Cake on a close enough level that we're allowed to back scale his Gear 3 there?
 
I will also ask, does Luffy's Accelerated Development not also impact this scaling? Like can we really consider the Luffy start of Post-timeskip comparable enough to the one that ends up squaring off with Big Mom at Whole Cake on a close enough level that we're allowed to back scale his Gear 3 there?
That's what I brought up.

Even if we did agree that Whole Cake Island Gear 3 Luffy is scaling to Big Mom, that doesn't mean agreeing all prior versions of Post-Timeskip Luffy scale as well.
 
Also, really feel like I'm missing something big here, what is all this stuff about two hands about?
 
I will also ask, does Luffy's Accelerated Development not also impact this scaling? Like can we really consider the Luffy start of Post-timeskip comparable enough to the one that ends up squaring off with Big Mom at Whole Cake on a close enough level that we're allowed to back scale his Gear 3 there?
The Accelerated Development started showing its full effect in WCI's Kata 2nd fight, we don't see any effects of it prior to that for the entire timeskip up until late WCI.

It's not a passive amp that just raises by doing nothing, it's in battle, and Luffy hasn't been in much battles (since his relevant portion in Dressrosa, he's been in like 1 serious fight and hadn't shown any improvement over time).

Luffy's mainly seen and implied to be the same throughout the timeskip up until that second fight.
Also, really feel like I'm missing something big here, what is all this stuff about two hands about?
 
The Accelerated Development started showing its full effect in WCI's Kata 2nd fight, we don't see any effects of it prior to that for the entire timeskip up until late WCI.

It's not a passive amp that just raises by doing nothing, it's in battle, and Luffy hasn't been in much battles (since his relevant portion in Dressrosa, he's been in like 1 serious fight and hadn't shown any improvement over time).

Luffy's mainly seen and implied to be the same throughout the timeskip up until that second fight.
I know its not a passive amp, but Luffy before this had three arcs worth and about two worth of intense fighting. Fishman Island and Dressrosa. Hody and Doflammigo both pushed Luffy and more. Do we say neither of these fights affected his AP in any meaningful way?
 
I know its not a passive amp, but Luffy before this had three arcs worth and about two worth of intense fighting. Fishman Island and Dressrosa. Hody and Doflammigo both pushed Luffy and more. Do we say neither of these fights affected his AP in any meaningful way?
Luffy was knocking around Hody and Doflamingo's fight is the same version of Luffy as the next arc. Only relevant serious fight is Cracker's, and he fought for like 10 minutes, everything else was eating.

The only time his AP has been meaningfully affected is when we split the keys because he's shown to be much stronger. Everything else, nope, he doesn't have any implications, feats, or showings of being stronger.
 
Only relevant serious fight is Cracker's, and he fought for like 10 minutes, everything else was eating.

What makes you think it was only ten minutes of fighting?
 
Damn... That was alot of reading.

So about Sanji and Luffy canceling big mom's non haki attack which she isn't taking seriously in (as she didn't use haki and both of them came out of nowhere), looks like a problem.

That is similar with this where Jinbe blocks an attack from Big Mom or her Devil Fruit? but she puts a little more strength and makes him fly away like it's nothing (which is also a non haki attack)

I wouldn't say it's fully accurate but it is a little more accurate then what they correctly are, so I'm not sure if they scale or not 🤷‍♂️
 
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It's like every time I open this wiki people got new opinions on scaling.

We've discussed this already in the last scaling CRT.

Early Timeskip Sanji and Late WCI Sanji are 2 completely different people miles apart in AP
This is exactly why I said if this CRT finishes it should be applied instantly, people will bring shit up again that's already been accepted.

If it keeps on getting brang up, even after being explained this many times, someone should make a discussion rule for this
 
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This is exactly why I said if this CRT finishes it should be applied instantly, people will bring shit up again that's already been accepted.

If it keeps on getting brang up, even after being explained this many times, someone should make a discussion rule for this
It shouldn't be applied instantly. There are other Post-Timeskip changes to take into account.

I will open the earlier Post-Timeskip AP CRT which was postponed until now and this thread will be taken into consideration with that as well.
 
It shouldn't be applied instantly. There are other Post-Timeskip changes to take into account.

I will open the earlier Post-Timeskip AP CRT which was postponed until now and this thread will be taken into consideration with that as well.
My point is that say the feat gets accepted here. If it’s reconsidered again in the other CRT, then this CRT will have been for nothing. I just want the reassurance that nobody is going to question it in the other crt if this one gets accepted
 
My point is that say the feat gets accepted here. If it’s reconsidered again in the other CRT, then this CRT will have been for nothing. I just want the reassurance that nobody is going to question it in the other crt if this one gets accepted
Well, yeah... that's how CRT's work. If something new comes up in the full revisions then the conclusion of this CRT - while fine in a vacuum - may not be decided to be the most accurate.
 
So about Sanji and Luffy canceling big mom's non haki attack which she isn't taking seriously in (as she didn't use haki and both of them came out of nowhere), looks like a problem.

That is similar with this where Jinbe blocks an attack from Big Mom or her Devil Fruit? but she puts a little more strength and makes him fly away like it's nothing (which is also a non haki attack)

I wouldn't say it's fully accurate but it is a little more accurate then what they correctly are, so I'm not sure if they scale or not 🤷‍♂️
That is a good point.

This is Big Mom without using Napoleon or Haki here when she's clashing with Luffy/Sanji & when she went to hit Reiju.

How strong is Big Mom when she's just punching with Zeus?
 
Well Zeus does barley no damage to big mom if that's what you wanted
12.jpg
2.jpg
3.jpg

Otherwise I didn't understand this
How strong is Big Mom when she's just punching with Zeus?
 
I mean, any reason Napo is MUCH stronger than Prome and Zeus? Both are her strongest homies, made with her own soul and all that (and from her power up some chapters ago, her soul is much stronger than others).

Not using haki also doesn't mean her attacks suddenly drop to 7B or something like that as well, if her "combo" that scales = to WB is two hand + Napo + Prome/Zeus then without one she will just down scale, not drop to below Doffy tier.
 
Not using haki also doesn't mean her attacks suddenly drop to 7B or something like that as well, if her "combo" that scales = to WB is two hand + Napo + Prome/Zeus then without one she will just down scale, not drop to below Doffy tier.
I wasn't suggesting that she drop down to 7-B. But it doesn't seem right to me that she'd be rated at full strength for an attack that didn't use either Armament or Conqueror's Haki.
 
It makes little sense for Big Mom to be thousands of times weaker than her standard attacks with a Zeus Amped Punch

That punch by all means should still be 6-B
 
Yeah, it will downscale as it's not her full power, but it's still in the same tier, the Zeus Punch they blocked may be <6TTs or even <<6TTs, but the fact is that it is 6TTs, i thought the scaling chain would be discussed somewhere else anyway?
 
This CRT only exists to apply the fact that Gear 3rd Luffy and Diable Sanji scale to Big Mom from Oda's statement

People are looking for reasons for why that can't be the case, but this is a non negotiable, we can't direct feats and statements because it potentially effects a bunch of characters, Gear 3rd Luffy and Diable Sanji scaling to Big Mom isn't a maybe, it's a definite

Every opposal so far has only been based on the fact that it would upgrade a bunch of people
 
People are looking for reasons for why that can't be the case, but this is a non negotiable, we can't direct feats and statements because it potentially effects a bunch of characters, Gear 3rd Luffy and Diable Sanji scaling to Big Mom isn't a maybe, it's a definite

Feats aren't as black-and-white as that, otherwise Roshi's Moon feat wouldn't have been rejected for years. Even if a feat is undeniable, that doesn't necessarily mean it belongs on our profiles.

But I take your point, and acknowledge the statement from Oda.

I'm currently gathering a few new calcs for the Post-Timeskip thread which I will post later today or tomorrow with a full list of calcs, and a full list of relevant characters, and then we can get into debating who scales to what, and which values need to be updated.
 
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