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Megaman vs Ichigo

Purgy said:
Piercing weapons like swords ignore durability to an extent, if Mega Man isn't on guard and blocking (which he won't be because he has no idea he's being attacked) then it's definitely a lethal hit.
Click to expand...
Well surely it's not enough to just outright one-shot or two-shot as you're suggesting, especially if it's to a certain unknown "extent." True, Mega Man wouldn't see Ichigo attacking at first, but he knows he's in a fight so once the first hit lands, Mega Man immediately responds and fires back or defends himself. It's not like Mega Man won't be conscious of being attacked at any moment since he knows he's in a fight. Besides, he still has means of healing himself regardless if Ichigo damages him too much. Not to mention that this advantage applies to Mega Man also since he has several bladed projectile weapons himself that are made of Ceratanium (metal stronger than titanium in Mega Man) and has cut down robots made of the same materials with utter ease before. Metal Blade is an excellent example here with very high ammunition count and rapid fire.
Purgy said:
There's also the fact that Ichigo can quite greatly amp his AP with Getsuga Tensho which he does quite a lot in this key.

Mobility advantage matters little when you can't see the person attacking you nor their attack, explain to me how he's avoiding something he can't see and has no idea is coming?

Also, Ichigo can amp his speed whereas Mega Man can't iirc.
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I mean if that's the case, I can argue that Mega Man will be even more inclined to use AoE weapons here if he's getting bombarded with rapid attacks by an invisible opponent. Gravity Hold, Flash Stopper, Rain Flush and general explosive are gonna be useful here to get Ichigo to back up or leave openings where Mega Man can defend himself, heal or respond when he can.

Also, I wasn't arguing that the mobility advantage could be used in the middle of the fight (such as dodging) because you're right, Ichigo is still invisible. I'm saying Flight and Teleportation are useful in moving the fight elsewhere (again, completely in character for Mega Man to do this so no one is hurt). Ichigo isn't going to keep up with Flight and Teleportation so he has no choice but to follow Mega Man out of the area to continue elsewhere. I mean if the fight does stay here, who's to say people won't flee the area anyway upon noticing the area being destroyed or that the battle can be dragged elsewhere where it's secluded? There are alternatives here.
Purgy said:
I mean, given how you were arguing that he would just spam huge AoE danmaku earlier, I kinda have to take how you think he would fight with a grain of salt.

I think you're extremely underselling how much of an advantage not being able to be seen or sensed by your opponent is, Megaman isn't;
  • Evading an attack he can't see or has any idea is coming
  • Landing an attack that doesn't have massive AoE
It's not that I think Mega Man will let himself be hit, rather it's that I think he can't avoid an attack he has no idea exists.

Mega Man does have a chance, and that chance is to use huge AoE moves constantly and pray he lands a hit, something that isn't in character and he can't start with without killing countless random people. So while I do acknowledge that Mega Man can win, I just think it's far less likely than Ichigo winning.
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Okay, I admit, I probably should've worded it better. I didn't exactly mean that Mega Man would spam AoE like some kid camping on Fortnite or COD or something, but it's just very likely he would utilize said abilities to gauge where Ichigo is. Cause if Ichigo is set on fire or if Mega Man sees a projectile blocked, it could be markers to help him get a general idea of where Ichigo is along with the fact that Mega Man would get some hits in. Also again, why is the argument of him killing people still being used when Mega Man is gonna take the fight elsewhere? Besides, who says people won't evacuate upon seeing explosions and stuff tearing apart the area anyway? The former is more likely however due to Mega Man's characterization.

I understand how Ichigo's invisibility works (now at least), it's just that I'm continuing to argue for Mega Man since I believe he actually has what it takes to combat it. If I didn't believe that, I wouldn't even bother arguing it. Besides, since it's been established that Mega Man knows he's in a fight and there are ways to know that he's being attacked (e.g. getting hit, seeing his projectiles blocked, seeing Ichigo on fire/wet, etc.) then Mega Man has forcefields for defense and can use AoE to back him up and make Ichigo weary of approaching him. Besides, it seems invisibility is literally the only major advantage Ichigo has here and nothing else while Mega Man has several others I listed beforehand. Since he has ways of combating invisibility and has the skill to do so, then I still see Mega Man taking it.
Purgy said:
He's going to use an acid rainstorm right off the bat that kills all the surrounding people as well?

Also, how potent is this acid? Ichigo in the first 5 chapters of the manga has already been attacked with acid and been relatively fine after, so unless it's pretty potent, I can't see it ending him.

They're weak comparisons because they're not at all equatable, being constantly invisible and unsensable is far more deadly than someone who turns invisible for small parts of a battle...

Right as the battle begins Mega Man has no idea where Ichigo is at all, the battle takes place in New York City, Ichigo could quite literally be anywhere.

It's also worth mentioning that they start hundreds of meters or kilometers apart, so not only does Mega Man not know where Ichigo starts, but he could literally be anywhere in the entire city as far as Mega Man knows.
Click to expand...
Not even going to mention the killing people argument again. As Dante said, it bypasses Skull Man's Skull Barrier and no, it's not due to it's corrosion. Skull Barrier is an energy barrier and the acid rain outright goes through it to damage Skull Man himself. It makes sense considering you can't corrode an energy barrier with acid. Even if you don't want to take that seriously, acid rain is good enough to corrode other robots made out of Ceratanium without issue (Toad Man use of it against Mega Man did notable damage to him) and isn't like the generic acid rain we have in real life. Also just in case this is brought up, no, Mega Man can't get damaged by his own weaponry so he isn't going to harm himself by using Rain Flush in the process. I never said it would outright kill Ichigo, but that it's something useful Mega Man has here to do considerable damage. Also the sizzle of the acid and Ichigo being wet (among other means I previously mentioned) is a plus since Mega Man can get pointers as to where Ichigo may be.

Then we're going to have to agree to disagree at this point.

Regardless, just refer to my previous points as a response to how Mega Man is gonna find out when Ichigo appears and how he might be able to track him.
 
He is aware that he's fighting "something" (And SBA says that Mega Man knows how Ichigo looks at the very least).

The fact he can't see Ichigo is problematic, but not something he doesn't have an answer for:
*Flash Stopper can blind Ichigo.
*Time Slow gives Mega Man more time to react and understand what's going on.
*Time Stopper would stop Ichigo, and Mega Man can shoot around until one of his shoots suddently stops mid-air.
*Dive Missile isn't stated to relay on vision to work.

Hell, even Oil Slider can be useful if used correctly.

Oh, and since people want to bring up SBA that much:
*Knowledge of the other character/verse: The characters know the direction their opponent(s) start in.
*Location: Central Park, New York City. The location can be left during the course of battle. If extreme advantages are generated via this location to one side, a balanced alternative should be discussed in the thread.
 
The idea that Ichigo is completely "undetectable" or Mega Man has no idea he "exists" is moot at this point. Ichigo isn't intangible so he's not completely undetectable in that sense, Mega Man has means to combat invisibility, track Ichigo and will know (albeit the hard way) about it eventually and SBA means they know they're in a fight anyway so how is Mega Man not gonna know Ichigo "exists"?

Also there's no argument being made that Mega Man is gonna find weaknesses for Ichigo like he did Bubble Man (which in itself is a poor comparison in this case but I'm pretty sure that was the point). It just supports the idea of how he's gonna fight here. If Mega Man uses the most effective weapons in a fight then yes, he will use AoE among some of the other things I've mentioned to tag an invisible enemy.

I also just realized, if Mega Man gets a clear visual on Ichigo by seeing him on fire, seeing him sizzling with acid and wet, etc. then Mega Man can just stop time and throw Metal Blades or anything really at Ichigo's form at that point. Ichigo has no way of countering this. And before anyone says anything about it, read Time Stopper on Mega Man's profile. He can attack during time stop and switch between weapons as seen in Super Adventure Rockman. As said also by Dante, Mega Man has a weapon that can cover the area in oil (Oil Slider) if he uses it right. At that point he can see Ichigo moving about and just engulf the whole area in fire. Though I'm sure Ichigo can just jump over that or something and has his own means. It's still difficult to bypass though.

Honestly, it seems Ichigo's only major advantages are invisibility and marginally higher AP here while Mega Man has several advantages that I've mentioned previously. Like I said, I don't know much about Bleach so if anyone can clarify some things I'd be happy to hear it, but uh yeah lol
 
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I don't get it, where does High 6-C come from?

It starts with Mountain level+ (2.8438095e+18 joules), then Island level after a x5 multiplier (1.42190475e+19 joules), then Large Island level after another x5 multiplier (7.10952375e+19 joules)... except 7.10952375e+16 joules isn't High 6-C.

There isn't even a "plus" on any of Ichigo's High 6-C keys, why does he have the AP advantage?
 
Rodri_Dante said:
I don't get it, where does High 6-C come from?

It starts with Mountain level+ (2.8438095e+18 joules), then Island level after a x5 multiplier (1.42190475e+19 joules), then Large Island level after another x5 multiplier (7.10952375e+19 joules)... except 7.10952375e+16 joules isn't High 6-C.

There isn't even a "plus" on any of Ichigo's High 6-C keys, why does he have the AP advantage?
Click to expand...
Where did you get Mountain level+ from?

Ichigo's AP ratings in this key are;
Island level (Stronger than before), Large Island level with Bankai (Stronger than before), Country level with Hollowfication (Fought and damaged a Resurrección Yammy)
Click to expand...
And I at least never said he had the AP advantage, I said he can amp his AP with Getsuga Tensho, which he can.

Regardless, as for the thread as a whole, we're kinda just arguing in circles at this point and my goal was just to defend my vote, which hasn't changed, I don't really care for convincing others.
 
Rodri_Dante said:
Is what I understood after reading the profiles, that Island level comes from multiplying Mountain level+.
Click to expand...
I think it comes from here:

  • "Characters that are Large Island level from Arrancar Arc is 566.25 Gigatons"
Correct me if I'm wrong though, but I think that's where Ichigo's High 6-C rating comes from in this key. It's from the Versus Page under the Notes tab.
 
In that case, I'm not voting for Ichigo, with a 4.3x AP advantage and massively higher versatility it's arguably a stomp if not for the invisibility.
 
We were bamboozled. I thought Ichigo was 566 in this key so I went along with it. We should've cleared it up before lol
 
Post Rez Bankai can't be 120 gigatons when a x5 multiplier in his Pre Rez key puts him into Small Country. Small Country is gotten from backscaling from the Country level Cero Oscuras.
 
AnonymousBlank said:
Post Rez Bankai can't be 120 gigatons when a x5 multiplier in his Pre Rez key puts him into Small Country. Small Country is gotten from backscaling from the Country level Cero Oscuras.
Click to expand...
Base Ulquiorra's rating comes from the 120 Gigatons and Bankai Ichigo scales to him though right?

Honestly, Ichigo's AP layout is such a mess that it's kinda hard to see where most of it comes from.
 
CO = 33.66 teratons
Ulq's standard Cero would be a tenth of that (3.366 teratons) which is what Pre Rez Masked Bankai scales to.
Divide by 5 for just Bankai and we get 673.2 gigatons ....... which makes me wonder where the hell the 500 figure came from in the notes.
Post Rez Bankai scales above the Pre Rez so > 673.2 gigatons
 
AnonymousBlank said:
CO = 33.66 teratons
Ulq's standard Cero would be a tenth of that (3.366 teratons) which is what Pre Rez Masked Bankai scales to.
Divide by 5 for just Bankai and we get 673.2 gigatons ....... which makes me wonder where the hell the 500 figure came from in the notes.
Post Rez Bankai scales above the Pre Rez so > 673.2 gigatons
Click to expand...
Ulquiorra used CO in Resurreccion, Bankai Ichigo doesn't scale to Resurreccion Ulquiorra, only Base Ulquiorra.

Also, weirdly his profile notes that his mask is an at least 5x multiplier, so I don't think you can just divide it by 5x and downscale like that.
 
Purgy said:
Base Ulquiorra's rating comes from the 120 Gigatons and Bankai Ichigo scales to him though right?

Honestly, Ichigo's AP layout is such a mess that it's kinda hard to see where most of it comes from.
Click to expand...
Post Rez Bankai should honestly be far higher than the High 6-C since he would be backscaling from harming Rez Yammy while only at 50%. 50% Masked Bankai = 33.66 teratons, 100% = 67.32 teratons, divide by 5 for his mask and we get 13.464 teratons. Thats almost double baseline Country 😭
 
Purgy said:
Ulquiorra used CO in Resurreccion, Bankai Ichigo doesn't scale to Resurreccion Ulquiorra, only Base Ulquiorra.

Also, weirdly his profile notes that his mask is an at least 5x multiplier, so I don't think you can just divide it by 5x and downscale like that.
Click to expand...
Thats what I can tell from the profile cuz it says his Mask gets him to Small Country and backscaling from Ulq is the only thing that gets him there.
 
On the other hand, is Bleach as good as they say? This thread as well as previous events, have interested me and I kinda want to get into it.
 
I will say in regards to AOE for Megaman I do lean towards him using it assuming he can't see Ichigo there. Under SBA Mega knows what he's supposed to look like and that he's somewhere in the area so I assume he'd just start tearing up the place I guess?
 
Stillwinston said:
I will say in regards to AOE for Megaman I do lean towards him using it assuming he can't see Ichigo there. Under SBA Mega knows what he's supposed to look like and that he's somewhere in the area so I assume he'd just start tearing up the place I guess?
Click to expand...
I mean, it takes place in New York City and they start hundreds of meters to kilometers apart, just because Mega Man can't see Ichigo doesn't mean he's going to conclude he's invisible or something, as far as Mega Man knows, Ichigo could be in a building somewhere or on the other side of the city.

There's also the whole thing with his AoE killing everyone around, so it wouldn't be in character for him to start with it under these circumstances.

Regardless, Ichigo's AP is either 120 Gigatons or 500+, so I'm retracting my vote until I know which.
 
As SBA says, if location gives either opponent an important advantage, then other location should be used.

And I don't know if this is relevant, but optional equipment wasn't restricted which gives Mega Man the Proto Shield, which can no-sell attacks from Mega Man's 5-A key.
 
Rodri_Dante said:
As SBA says, if location gives either opponent an important advantage, then other location should be used.

And I don't know if this is relevant, but optional equipment wasn't restricted which gives Mega Man the Proto Shield, which can no-sell attacks from Mega Man's 5-A key.
Click to expand...
It says if "extreme advantages are generated via this", that's not what I'd call this, in fact I'd say the starting location balances things, instead of say, them starting in a barren wasteland.

Ichigo is already heavily disadvantaged, ignoring the fact that Mega Man potentially has a 4.3x AP advantage, he has massively higher versatility among other things.

So yeah, I'd say the standard starting location balances this battle if anything.
 
I think it's still 5 votes for Mega Man. Regardless yeah, we need to determine what exactly Ichigo's AP is in this key.
 
Stillwinston said:
I will say in regards to AOE for Megaman I do lean towards him using it assuming he can't see Ichigo there. Under SBA Mega knows what he's supposed to look like and that he's somewhere in the area so I assume he'd just start tearing up the place I guess?
Click to expand...
Yeah, no. Mega Man is not doing that. That's completely OOC. Mega Man would never harm civilians and wreak havoc across the city lol.
 
Purgy said:
It says if "extreme advantages are generated via this", that's not what I'd call this, in fact I'd say the starting location balances things, instead of say, them starting in a barren wasteland.

Ichigo is already heavily disadvantaged, ignoring the fact that Mega Man potentially has a 4.3x AP advantage, he has massively higher versatility among other things.

So yeah, I'd say the standard starting location balances this battle if anything.
Click to expand...
I agree. If Mega Man has that much of an AP advantage then it helps with balancing if the setting is somewhere where Mega Man is at a disadvantage. I still think Mega Man could move the battle elsewhere however or at least make it so that their fight doesn't take place with a lot of people present, but starting the battle here can help regardless.
 
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I mean considering Ichigo is High 6-C compared to Mega Man's High 6-C+, that implies he's below Mega Man's AP and therefore he may be 120 Gigatons. Cause if Ichigo was 566.25 Gigatons then he would be listed as High 6-C+ just like Mega Man, no? That's my guess anyway from the looks of it.
 
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