Minor Addition: Adding "Speed Equalized" to Standards Battle Assumptions

[The_Impress]

Ok so, this should be relatively simple.

99% of the matches on the forums, are Speed Equalized, which annoyingly have to be specified each time because they aren't stated in SBA.

So just, add it to SBA already :V

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

Seems reasonable. Unequalized matches are the exception anyway, not the rule.

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

I feel like we'd actually need to edit nearly every profile just to update to this.

If it's worth doing that, then sure.

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

I feel like we'd actually need to edit nearly every profile just to update to this.

If it's worth doing that, then sure.

We can just use a bot to get rid of "speed was equalized" stuff, so that's not really a concern.

 

[The_Impress]

I mean, "update every profile" can be done gradually anyways, it's not like this is a hyper important thing

"OH MY GOD YOU LISTED SPEED EQUALIZED IN MATCH CLARIFICATION WHEN SBA ALREADY SAYS THAT. CANCEL THIS WIKI"

 

[Zaratthustra]

Why should SBA be "speed equalized" while yeah 99% of the matches are made like that because we always assume a bit of being faster than the opponent, it would be speedblitz but that is taking the forte for some characters (ex. Flash). A lot of times the characters can react to higher speed but thanks to how we make the debates, we go that they can't react but a true debate should also see how the other party would react to a higher speed, their strategy, how their powers may help them when fancing a faster oppoent.

This way Speedster characters get the short end of the stick. Why even put speed ratings on character profiles if we would always do Speed Equal by SBA and ignore their speed. Not even worth mentioning it then.

 

[Jinsye]

It's not like Speed Equal being listed is an issue yeah. We have some matches that say "SBA was used" when duh

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

We can just use a bot to get rid of "speed was equalized" stuff, so that's not really a concern.

You'd be surprised how many variations of that phrase are used depending on the user, and you'd still have all the text around it, which wouldn't clean up that well with a bot.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

1. Is it really that taxing to type 2 words more when making a match though?
2. Standard Battle Assumptions shouldn't be with speed equalized. The standard format in which 2 character fight each-other isn't in speed equal, just because we are so used to doing everything in speed equal doesn't mean it's the standard format.

Anyway that's just my opinion. Don't really see a point in making it SBA when all you gotta do is type 2 freaking words. "speed equal"

 

[Zaratthustra]

Like Earl said, it's too much to write on a match "speed equal" now? Have you become so lazy to write that 2 words?

You basically will change the things from going to "Speed Equal" on a match to writing "Speed Unequal" on a match. Same thing but reverse and it makes less sense to go from speed equal to unequal.

 

[Tllmbrg]

Yah seems like too much work (If my proposed revisions of similar scope is anything to go by)

 

[The_Impress]

Why is that much a pain in the ass to just add it in SBA? :V

Same amount of effort, idk why you're whining NOT to put it because "it doesn't take much effort to go Speed Equalized", when it doesn't take much effort to just, change the page either

And Standard Battle Assumptions makes alot more unstandard assumptions than you might think, the daytime Central Park setting, Verse Equalization and far more.

@Zaratthustra If you just have a problem with Speed Equalized as a whole which our conversations offsite highlight, make your own thread on it

 

[Zaratthustra]

Like I've told you, I don't want it removed, or the like. I personally don't find speed equal that interesting as it takes a forte of a character. Chracter X is a speedster? Bad for him, speed equal. Character Y sword style focues on speed to overwhelm the opponent because she lacks the hax/Ap to deal with it so through speed it can close the gap by hitting it 10 times to equal with one hit from the opponent? Bad for her, speed equal. That's my issue. People take a vital point from someone and then expect it to be a fair fight? No. Sure, speedblitz can be annoying but that's life, nothing is fair, you must work for things.

Why go from a perfectly fine system where the user who makes the fight can put speed equal and simple be done? Forget to put it? Edit the original post and done. Easy job.

 

[The_Impress]

Why are you firstly, arguing "it doesn't take much effort" with large paragraphs that do take efforts?

Also you're acting like there aren't threads that gnaw the **** out of OP who was AFK or newbie with "tHiS iS SpEeDbLiTz"

 

[Zaratthustra]

Never said, there aren't such threads. Didn't even mention them. Do you think all newbie read the SBA? No. While the others should know till now that maybe that was the intention of the OP, maybe she/he wanted it to not be speed equal. A lot of times, people say "speed blitz" but don't even read the profiles to see if maybe there is a power, a technique, an item, etc that could make that speed difference not matter that much. People don't even read the profiles in speed equal matches which is sad but that's how it is.

Anyway, why change the SBA when it goes from writing in a thread "speed equal" to "speed unequal"? Logically people would assume if nothing is written there then each character has their speed rating from their profile, not that it's an equalized speed fight.

I can see that most people agree with your OP but from my perspective, it makes less sense than what we currently have.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

I can see that most people agree with your OP but from my perspective

Actually more ppl disagree with Zark's OP. Me, you, dargoo, tllmb

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

I don't think we should add Speed Equalized to SBA, because that isn't how they are at standard, you know?

 

[ElixirBlue]

Listing “Speed Equalized” is necessary in the VS thread OP. New users will be clueless if it’s not listed and get further confused if say a sniper could take down Sonic or the Flash if their AP were similar.

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Yeah no.

Speed Equalization honestly shouldn't even be a thing, it's literally completely ignoring one of the most important stat just to allow more matches.

While we can't really remove it anymore due to how omnipresent it is, the least we can do is not make it a goddamn default assumption. If people want to literally rig the match, then they should at the very least force themselves to actually note that they're doing it instead of us giving them this opportunity on a silver platter.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Speed Equalization honestly shouldn't even be a thing, it's literally completely ignoring one of the most important stat just to allow more matches.

It should be a thing, precisely because it allows us to make any viable amount of matches. Can you imagine how limited our choices would be without it?

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

I guess we should allow AP equalized then. It allows more matches, right?

This train of thought just leads us to forgo any sense of accuracy with our matches in the name of making more of them.

I'm not here to remove it anyway, just prevent Zark from forcing this stupid standard on the entire wiki.

 

[Aguywhodoesthings]

just because it's used a lot doesn't mean it should be in SBA. it makes no sense for it to be there

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

I agree with Saikou.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

just prevent Zark from forcing this stupid standard on the entire wiki.

Agree on this obviously.

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

I disagree with Saikou. His argument is entirely based off his preference and opinion, not really backed up by anything else. The argument me and Zark are saying is, it is basically a default on the wiki anyway, when's the last time you've seen a thread without it? It just makes things quicker and easier for thread makers, esp if they accidently forget to add it because of how common it is.

Edit: Can we also please not have aggressive remarks, please? There's no need for this thread, or any thread for that matter, to turn nuclear because people have a disagreement over how things should be handled.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I believe this proposal was made years ago, and it was universally rejected by staff; most notably Reppuzan and Matt. Yes, most threads are speed equalized, and speed equalization is one of the main reasons a lot of Admins dislike Vs Threads entirely. Speed equalization is technically a fixed or rigged fight just to even the odds of what's technically supposed to be one-sided normally. I'm aware that most threads would be unfinished if we banned speed equalization outright, so not going to propose getting rid of that. But making it a SBA to have speed equalized kind of causes more issues and concerns. Like some people wanted to remove speed from all pages because of such an addition. Also, getting rid of speed was equalized to a bunch of already added pages seems pointless.

So yeah, I'm against adding it to SBA, but think it might be worth adding footnotes on the page. It seems quantity over quality to make it a SBA when even the fact that we allow speed equalization seems controversial enough. It's a bit of a double standard to allow speed equalization and not allow hax disabling or Tier equalization.

 

[Wokistan]

I disagree with it. It's not hard to add literally 2 words to an OP. It's a nonstandard specification, even if it's used frequently, so adding matches without noting speed is equalized if it's equalized is misleading. People aren't just going to see an addition with no further elaboration and assume that speed must have been equalized just because.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Hard Disagree with this. Just note speed equal on the thread and call it a day. No need to add it to SBA imho.

 

[Tllmbrg]

I disagree mainly because I think that vs threads are overrun by speed equal anyways and we should try encouraging none speed equal ones

 

[Abstractions]

Equalizing a statistic like this should never be a standard assumption.

Justifying a change like this just because it's more common and enables more matchups would be appeal to popularity. It would also beg the question as to why we don't add "AP equalized" matches, they both function on the same principle.

 

[The_Impress]

...why are so many people acting like this is me making "Speed should be equalized" thread? This is building off the already accepted standard, which if you disagree with, get that changed first and foremost.

Many of these responses are basing off their frustrations regarding speed equalization in general and masking it under their responses, and on top of that some made leaving extremely aggressive replies here which I don't think are warranted towards me one way or another.

The notion that it isn't a "standard" is nonsensical statement as well because it IS a standard we do accept, and we make FAR more unconventional presumptions in SBA already like Verse Equalization, setting, making everyone "in-character but willing to kill", which are all unconventional standards, hell "In-character but willing to kill" is character breaking in so many ways and is a disservice to said character, that by this logic it shouldn't be a standard either.

I guess I'll close this thread as a majority of people disgaree, and I honestly don't care enough to figth over this, but honestly this is just a poor showcase, guys. You don't exactly need to act hyper over something as basic as this, just say no if you disagree and give reasons why in a calm and collected manner. That is indeed the point of staff threads, and why you guys are staff, if you want to make this personal plesse just don't bother being in threads anymore.

Also if you lot genuinely act like "Speed Equalization shouldn't be a thing in the first place", make that thread right now and get it accepted, simple as that, considering about all our matches are Speed Equalized, it is a fairly simple change since it boils down to "reset Notable Matches", but don't act like this isn't a thing we accept already as a fair match condition.

 

[Wokistan]

Only one staff even said anything remotely aggressive though

 

[The_Impress]

Meh another staff member has made some... interesting statements on Discord

 

[Schnee_One]

It's more work if we add it to SBA and adjust every file with a match then to have someone simply write two words if the match is speed equal, I don't think stats should be inherently equalized either.

Disagree.

 

[Antvasima]

It seems like this suggestion has been rejected then.