Massive Drago Hax/Speed Revisions

NOTE: This thread will very likely be incredibly long due to detailing the neccessary suggested abilities. Just a heads up for anyone who expected an average-sized thread.

Before I begin, I would like to apologize for making (once again) another Bakugan thread at this time. Before, I believed it was better to handle anything else Bakugan related on my mssg wall due to the lack of people knowledgeable about the fiction so that others wouldnt need to go through the trouble. However, since the suggested upgrades are ones that have been talked about for a while now, and are massive, I think this is an exception so that others can give their input. Furthermore, I will do my best on my part to detail and give as much evidence as possible for all suggestions. With that out of the way, lets begin. Here are the new abilities:

'*'Regen Upgrade:

-Currently, Drago's regen at the moment is Low-Godly for his ability to regenerate within the Perfect Core. But as of now, I would like to upgrade his regen all the way to High-Godly based off of a feat done ithis episode of Bakugan, at 18:30. Now at the time, Bakugan Interspace (the virtual dimension humans and Bakugan battle in) was being used as a battle field between the Brawlers and their enemy Mag-Mel. Mag-Mel had absolute control over B.I. itself and despite their efforts, the brawlers had no way of being able to reclaim it back from him while trapped inside. So, as a final resort to stop him, Marucho decided to ultimately and completely delete Bakugan Interspace using a Deletion Program he developed. Once activated, this Deletion Program would delete anything and everything in B.I., including B.I. itself. It would be completely erased and dissapeer forever, leaving nothing left. The Brawlers and everyone inside were able to make it out and back into the real world, using Marucho's Accespoints, except for Helios and Spectra who stayed behind to fend off Mag-Mels Chaos Bakugan. Before they could make it out, the deletion program did its job and completely erased B.I. forever. Including Mag-Mels Chaos Bakugan, Spectra and Helios. But somehow, in the following episode, Spectra and Helios appear to help fight against Mag-Mel with absolutely no harm or even scratches despite being completely erased. Bear in mind that, at the time, everyone who was trapped in B.I. had their ability to come back into the real world taken away. People could teleport in, but they weren't able to teleport back out. Once coming inside they would be permanently trapped. The only way they were able to ever leave was using emergency Accesspoints Marucho developed at the last moment but Dan and Drago used the last one to escape, leaving Spectra and Helios trapped. So the only logical way both could have survived and come back from B.I.'s deletion is by regenerating after the erasure. To have High-Godly Regen you need to be able to survive being erased and the reality you're in being destroyed, which is exactly what needed to happen here. Because to be frank, without regenerating, theres literally NO possible way those 2 could come back from being completely deleted, let alone escaping the erased reality at all. In addition, Spectra and Helios both showed absolutely 0 signs of panic or worry upon being left behind (in fact they were rather confident and straight up didnt care), strongly implying that being deleted wouldnt end or even harm them, as demonstrated. So if acceptable, both would have High-Godly Rege and this would apply to Drago for obvious reasons.


*Conceptual Manipulation:

-Now the reason for this would be because of the Infinity and Silent Cores. But to be more specific, this ability would come from creating the 2 cores and the 6 attributes that all Bakugan in existence would eventually obtain for themselves. Firstly, in the beginning of the series, Drago explains to the brawlers about his homeworld and the 2 forces in the very center of it all. Forces that he specifies as "Infinity, the source of all positive energy, and the Silent Core, the source of all negative energy. These 2 opposing forces maintain the equalibrium of our dimension." You can find his statement in this episode (skip to 15:17). Basically, to make the story short, Drago is explaining that the Infinity and Silent Cores are the sources of literally all Positive and Negative forces in the Bakugan verse. But of course, that alone wouldnt be enough to grant C.M. to him. So to further give this leverage, there is also the fact that the concepts of said Positive and Negative forces were never a thing to begin with until Vestroia was created by the Original Dragonoid long ago. Although its true that the 6 Ancient Soldiers were the ones who formed the Infinity and Silent Cores, they acomplished it through gathering already existing forces. Forces that were first brought into creation the instant Vestroia itself was created. In other words, if Vestroia was never created, then neither would these concepts and other concepts that they come with (ex: Negative Energy brings evil while Positive Energy brings Good). The same treatment goes for the 6 Bakugan attributes according tothis I found. Long ago, when Vestroia used to be in its original form, Bakugan were living as normal creatures. But out of nowhere, a burst of positive energy came and created the literal 6 Attributes, giving Bakugan the power of the attributes. With this, it proves/strongly implies that the 6 Attributes were concepts that never existed until Positive Energy created them (this also explains why only the Infinity Core gives its holder the complete power of all 6 Attributes unlike its Silent Core counterpart). It is debateable on whether or not Code Eve or the Original Drago are responsible for this feat, but it really shouldnt change anything.


*Abstract being:

-Nothing much to say here on this point as it depends on the 2nd point being acceptable or not. But if it is, then this would be from the fact that Drago literally becomes the conceptual cores themselves, becoming the concepts of Positive/Negative forces, as well as the 6 attributes he completely had power over and upheld using the cores.

• Pocket Dimension Manipulation:

-Why? Because it would seem Aquas Bakugan like Sirenoid, Juggernoid and Preyas naturally have pocket dimensions made of water for them to slip into at their own convenience. For example, when they uses certain abilities, such as Dive Mirage or the Deep Sea Dive ability, they create and slip into a pocket space in the form of an ocean. And they can use this for offensive purposes such as dodging enemy attacks, and then they can reappear out of it at will. Its similar to the Phantom Force/Shadow Force moves from Pokemon. Exampleshere at 4:00 and here at 11:05 . And this isnt where it stops. There's also the feat the 6 Soldiers did long ago in their prime. From one of the links posted above, it explains that the soldiers were the ones who split Vestroia's dimension into the 6 different attribute worlds before they formed the 2 cores, effectively meaning they can also form pocket realities in their own right.


*Body Control(?):

-Im not entirely sure about this one as there is another interesting ability we see from Sirenoid. From how it is used in the anime, her ability called Anthemusa creates a portal in water that leads to a random universe/dimension in which the victim cannot move at all. The ability then generates a special sound/song for her opponents to hear and if they hear it, the song forces them against their will to walk straight into the portal and be sent to that universe, as demonstrated when she did it to Preyas at 18:05.


*Resistance to Dimensional BFR:

-I believe this to also be a thing for Drago. Wavern was nearly going to be sent to the Doom Dimension by one of Masquarades Gate Card effects and with her ability Big Bang Blaze, she stopped it completely in this episode and was safe from being sent to the Doom Dimension (skip to 10:34). This should be perfectly appliable, especially when Wavern is a "White One" (powerless mutation of Bakugan) and all of her abilities are completely dependant on the Infinity Core.

• Attack Purification and can use it back against the opponent:

-Can also be a thing for Drago to have. Wavern once again was able to accomplish this using her Shining Pyrus Ability which allowed her to take all of the attacks Hydranoid hit her with, purify them using the power of the Infinity Core, and then send them all back at him to win the battle as if it was Waverns very own attack. Wavern also specifies that this can be done by the Infinity Core alone. "Simply put, the core feeds off of the power that any opponent throws at it. And in turn, amasses that energy to use against its enemies." Evidence of this is found in the previous link with Wavern as well as this episode at 3:23 .

• Evil Purification:

-This one should be obvious but i'll still bring evidence for it. It's specified many times in the show that the posiitve energy from the Infinity Core can purify victims who have been tainted/exposed to negative energy from the Silent Core, bringing them back to normal. And the core's negative energy can make victims obtain a savage-like nature and wish to do battle or become flat-out evil like Alice/Masquarade and her grandfather Michael who became Hal-G, aka the "Doom Beings". As for evidence, Naga's profile alone shows examples of victims being tormented by the negative energy and for purifying,this page here on the Infinity Core confirms that as well.

• Can sense Evil Presences:

-Nothing much to say here really. Drago and other Bakugan have the ability to sense the evil Negative Energy around them and within other living beings that make them evil/completely insane or wicked. Examples of when Drago fought Fearipper and Preyas and in this episode they come to Dr. Michaels Lab, sensing traces of negative energy around them, otherwise called "Minus Power" at 14:20 and 18:42.

• Information Manipulation:

-Im confident about this one for it is something I've noticed happen in the series. It would seem that whenever Bakugan either grow stronger or evolve, they don't just gain new abilities out of nowhere. They actually modify and upgrade old ones into new ones as well. We see this many times, such as when Drago evolved, Hydranoid evolved, Wavern tapping into the Infinity Core, Drago tapping into the Perfect Core and so on. Especially in the Wavern example. One of her ability cards started glowing and the words, stats and everything on it was rewritten, changed completely and then became the Shining Pyrus ability. You can find this scene during her battle with Hydranoid posted in one of the links above. Infinity Drago did the same thing when using Dextra Attack and the ability card had all of its info rewritten on a blank card Dan took out as shown in here at 7:30 . If nothing else, im highly certain this could be Info. Manip.

• Void Manipulation:

-Reasons? Well for one, Code Eve quite lives in a void of her own and can manipulate it. She used her dimensional void as the final battlefield for Drago and Dharak so they wouldnt endanger everyone and the dimensions with their fighting. And it isnt just Code Eve. The Original Dragonoid and (very likely) Dharaknoid live in their own respective voids as well. We see the Original Drago in his own void talking to Dan and Drago after they defeat Mechtavius Destroyer in the very last final episode of Bakugan and has been watching over them from that void as well. Its speculative on whether Dharaknoid has one though but its highly likely given hes the counterpart to Dragonoid. But more evidence to this comes from the fact that both Dragonoid and Dharaknoid split the void that Code Eve gave birth to them in simply by being too strong, which led to the creation of their own worlds later after. So this ability shouldnt be too much out of the picture.

• High Resistance to their own Element:

-This should be one of the few ones that do not require evidence for. All bakugan lived in 6 attributed worlds in which the entirety of it was literally just their element. For example, Drago lived in Pyrus Space and that world was nothing but a space of pure fire (as a matter of fact each pocket world seemed to be the source of all the attributes while Vestroia was in this state as the rest of the dimension was just vast emptiness). Since they lived there naturally, they aren't affected by their space's environment. To further support this, Nova Lion himself stated to Dan that since he was a pyrus bakugan, him sitting in anything fire related like Lava would be like "taking a bath".

• Phasing:

-Nothing much on this point, other than the fact that Sirenoid can literally swim in solid ground.......this episode here will show it at 11:48.

• Can trap beings inside their own memories:

-Yep, its as it literally says. Wavern, even in her spirit form, has the power to teleport herself and others inside their own memories. She teleported herself, Dan and Drago inside the memories of both when they were on Gundalia in order to find a clue from when Code Eve gave Drago her powers at 3:13.

• Can exist beyond Space-Time:

-For this one, it shouldn't be too complicated. After all, Code Eve and the Original Drago live in their own voids which lie outside of the Bakuganverse, including its Space-Time. Considering Drago has all of their abilities, is Dragonoids direct descendant, and has done the same thing when becoming the Perfect Core, it is not too farfetched. Of course, this would most likely need to be a passive ability if anything since Drago obviously doesnt live outside Space-Time but could choose to do so if in the mood for it.

• Atomization and Resistance to it:

-Another good ability that should be acceptable to add. For one, whenever Drago and the others attack and defeat Mag Mel's Chaos Bakugan, they vanish into thin air upon being attacked instead of returning to ball form like other Bakugan (you can find this in the very first link at the top of the thread). And they are able to tank each other's attacks so they would logically have resistance to being atomized. But don't worry, incase this isnt enough theres more. In the 2nd half of M.S., we see Mechtavius Destroyer come to New Vestroia to exterminate the bakugan there in this episode . A battle between him and all of the brawlers old Bakugan then begins. But it becomes a huge stomp as M.D. specifically and overwhelming Atomizes all of the Bakugan he faces effortlessly and since the brawlers can tank his attacks, that gives them having resistance even more leverage (skip to 4:16 and onward).

• Astral Projection (?):

-Now for this one, im not really sure what this would be but its quite an interesting ability Drago has shown in one of his and dans battles with Mag-Mel and Razenoidhere . Dan and Drago are able to focus their minds so that they can turn into thoughts and enter other universes as "thoughts". In other words, they can project themselves mentally as "mind forms" into other universes/dimensions and still roam around and fight on the physical plane without needing to use their bodies and physically be there, as demonstrated at 7:38. This is demonstrated when Dan and Drago mentally connect with Mag-Mel and Razenoid via their link and meet each other in the Dark Reversed Dimension of Bakugan Interspace, the negative version of B.I., an opposite world. But despite only using their minds to fight, Drago and Razenoid can still use all their abilities in those forms and even cause damage onto the physical plane. Meaning, Drago can fight without needing his body, let alone being in the same reality. Again, I am not too sure on what this would be, so Astral Projecting their minds seems like the closest bet.

• Pocket Dimension Creation + Passive Omnipresence:

-This...kind of sounds weird but thats what it appears to be on this one. There's an ability used by one of the Nonent Bakugan, Mutabrid, called Imprison (link here ). The ability instantly creates a pocket dimension around the opponent to trap them within it and, from what it appears, the user becomes the dimension itself and stares down at the opponent from all points and directions, putting them in immense pain and misery. So...if anything, this could be a combination of both haxes (?). Skip to 1:30 in the vid.

• Precognition:

-Nothing much to argue on this ability really. I forgot the name, but one of the Nonet Bakugan, the Ventus one, is able to see into the future/accurately predict future events and occurrences. For this ability, he is refered to as a "professor" and the brains among the Nonets.

• Acasuality:

-For this one, there might be other references that imply this if my memory serves me correct, however this one is the most reliable so I'll use this one instead. Acasuality for Drago would be specifically because of the Original Dragonoid. In the very last episode of Bakugan ever the Original Drago reveals himself to Dan and Drago upon bringing them to his void and has told them that he has been watching over them and, well, all the events that have taken place in the entire series since the very beginning, not only proving he is very much alive but isnt affected by time passing by despite not being an immortal of any kind. Furthermore, Drago is the Original Drago's direct descendant whos inherited his U.W.G., basically being his reincarnation. To sum things up, the Original Drago is Drago's ancestor and the fact that he never died long ago suggests again he is Acasual, otherwise it would be impossible for Drago to be born, let alone become his descendant if he never died (and not just Drago but literally all Bakugan in existence obtaining parts of his dna and very being to spread himself throughout the whole Bakugan race). In addition to the Original Drago living in his own void outside space-time, that anyway would mean the events within the Bakugan-verses space-time wouldnt affect him regardless. So Acasuality should be at least possible for Drago to obtain.

• Possession:

-Shouldnt be much of a problem for Drago to have. After all, in the very last episode of Bakugan, before Dan and Drago defeated Mechtavius Destroyer, the Original Drago intervined and posessed Dragonoid Destroyer, using him as a vessle to communicate with everyone. Naturally, Drago should be capable of the same for, again, obvious reasons.

Thats it for the suggested hax. Now we move on to the final part. The Speed Upgrades:

-For this, I would like to upgrade some of Drago's forms to Infinite/Immeasurable Speed. For why? Its as followed:

• Both Drago and Razenoid can move and fight each other in the Dark Reversed Dimension of Earth with absolutely no problems and it would appear that Time is stopped within the reversed version of any world. We see this when the people of earth are transported to the Dark Reversed version of Earth by Mag-Mel. They are completely frozen and don't move at all andeverything starts proceeding again once they return back to the normal world .

• Drago is able to move around within voids such as Code Eve's when he fought Dharak and the Original Drago's when they were talking to each other (even though Drago was forcefully teleported there but can still move around). Im aware that this shouldn't hold water due to the void rule but since Drago is a direct descendant of the Original Drago, whom was directly spawned out of Code Eve, and inherits his power, he should be legitimately capable of moving around in voids as a real feat.

• Both Code Eve and the Original Dragonoid live in their own voids outside of space-time, so both individually would have the specific speed rating. Drago scales above them in literally everyway once he obtains the Element and all of Code Eve's power. And the Original Drago is weaker than both Drago (even Lumino Drago is superior once defeating Dragonoid Colossus) and Code Eve anyway. Basically, its Drago>>>>>Code Eve>>>>>Weaker Drago>>>>>>Dragonoid Colossus>>>Original Drago in stats.

• Drago is able to fight against and defeat enemies who even surpass Code Eve in everything (in fact, once becoming Fusion Drago he pretty much curbstomped Evolved Razenoid in a single attack fairly easily and Base Razenoid is already above Code Eve).

That should do it for the overall post. Again, I apologize for the long thread as I did my best detail and support everything. So, what does everyone think of this?

All of them seem alright. However, are you going to get into the AP Upgrade as well ?

That can come later. Right now my biggest concern is his hax and speed as they are more important at the moment.

Like I said, I don't have a problem with the hax.

I certainly agree with the regen, Body control, phasing, pocket dimension, atomization/resistance to atomization, Luck Manipulation and (surprisingly) Causality Maniuplation.

I basically agree with everything, but am still slightly iffy on the Acausality Manipulation. But I honestly find a lot of this rather solid. I guess we just need a lot more input.

Some of them are good, a lot of them aren't. As a starter, some of these things can't be given without mention. Keep in mind I'm still iffy on Drago getting every ability.

Also, you don't expect us to watch all of what you linked. Make the link to the specific points.

High Godly Regenerationn: No. For one, they could've just escaped another way. Unlikely, but it's less of an assumption as High Godly regen. You can't assume they regenerated, when that level of Regenerationn is a pretty hefty claim. I'm not watching the entire episode.

Conceptual Manipulation: Forces=/=Concepts. Enough said.

Abstract Being: If what above is a no-go, then so is this, as you said.

Pocket Dimension Creation: This is fine.

Body Control: No. Lucky for you, it's better. It's mind manipulation through sound manipulation. It's pretty obvious through the name: Sirenoid.

Resistance to BFR: Not unless she's explicitly shown for it not working. How you worded it makes it sound like she stopped it before it happened. Now, if you linked the scene instead of the whole video, I could watch and see, but I'm not going through all 20+ minutes.

Causality Manipulation: No. That is either time manipulation and/or healing. Likely the latter, as repairing is seen as healing. I need more info on the Counter whatever.

Void Manipulation: Just pocket reality manipulation, at best.

Resistance to their respective elements: Okay. That's good.

Phasing: Also okay.

Trapping people in memories: This is fine, but trapping implies that she can do this offensively, in which we've never seen. Transporting is better.

Atomization and resistance to it: Ridiculous speculation, no offense.

Astral Projection: This is fine.

Pocket Reality Creation + Passive Omnipresence. I believe you mean active, and it's sorta ok. The pocket Reality stuff is fine, but the omnipresence is a result of it, so it may still be the former ability.

Precog: Okay.

Acausality: What? You don't have to die to have descendants, give an inheritance, and when did he say that the new Drago is a reincarnation? Is that also speculation? Seriously asking, not being snarky.

Luck Manipulation: Hyperbole.

Possession: This is fine.

Now on to speed. Quick statement. At best, this is infinite.

Point 1: See our new Void rule

Point 2: See our new Void rule

Point 3: This is fine, but proof that it's outside of space time?

Point 4: See above

The first part is wrong as I already specificied that escaping was impossible. Once you enter Bakugan Interspace you can't teleport back out, Mag-Mel took that ability away from everyone. So regenerating was the only way they would have been able to survive it, literally. Plus if they really did teleport out they would have been noticed to leave by the bralwers who monitored B.I.'s deletion in the real world.

2nd, alright then its still concepts as again, they were never a thing until Vestroia was created. Same with the attributes. Perhaps I shouldve worded it better.

Alright. Perhaps canceling BFR sounds better?

How is it just Pocket Reality Manip? If she is controlling her void then wouldnt that be void manip.?

Im not sure on the time part because then we would have seen time itself be manipulated and effecting everyone which it wasnt. And as for the healing, Tentaclears ability doesnt heal. It nullifies a specific ability and any damage it caused. If it was just a healing ability it would have been specified.

Agreed, my bad on that. Im fine with either teleporting or transporting.

What speculation? For the Chaos Bakugan I understand but for the second point we literally see dozens of Bakugan get atomized into bits.

I'll have to look into that more to see if its more like reincarnating.

As for the rest, I am aware of the Void rule and it shouldnt hold much water here. Yes, Drago moving in voids shouldnt mean he gets the speed but we are talking about someone who scales above and gains the powers of beings who naturally live in voids, as well as stomp beings superior to them. Even if he doesnt naturally live in the void, Code Eve and the Original Drago surely do and Drago scales above them in everyway.

Btw, I could try and specify the scenes better for you as I definitely don't expect anyone to search through 20 min vids (my fault on that.)

About the regen stuff.

Is there any proof that they died and regenerated, as opposed to just tanking it?

Unless you actually see them being deleted, and/or a mention of it, then you CANNOT assume that they regenerated from the hardest thing to regenerate from. Because literally any other scenario is more likely.

Concepts exist before universes, unless explicitly mentioned (i.e. Dialga and Palkia). So that not being the case debunks itself.

Or the assailant could've just been interrupted...

Said void is a pocket dimension. Void manipulation is existence erasing stuff.

False. Localized time hax is a thing. And that's hypocrisy. You can say that about literally all of your points.

You can't see something get atomized to bits. Atoms are way to small to be bits. It will be considered as dust. At best. Not atoms. Unless stated otherwise. It's basically our destruction value rules, but about living beings.

I said points 3 and 4 were okay. But you have to prove that Code Eve's and Original Drago's realms were devoid of spacetime.

Thanks.

The Everlasting said:

About the regen stuff.
Is there any proof that they died and regenerated, as opposed to just tanking it?

Click to expand...

Well, once the brawlers made it back into the real world they monitored the deletion of Bakugan Interspace from Marucho's lab and they saw everything get deleted, including the reality itself. If Spectra and Helios were to have tanked it, then they would have noticed they survived the deletion and teleported right out back into the real world from the monitors. Eveyone, even Marucho himself, were completely convinced both died via the erasure.

Plus isnt a realiy being erased just a Low 2-C feat? If thats the case then Dan and Drago would have been confident that the deletion wouldnt effect them and they'd stay behind to help them fight.

Being convinced they died doesn't mean they did. Goku believed Gohan died to Majin Buu, but he was with Kibito Kai. Unless you can prove they got erased and regenerated, then it's speculation and can't be added.

Not true. There are 4-C, even 3-A characters who are afraid of falling to their deaths.

But we did see them get deleted. We saw everything in Bakugan Interspace be deleted, including B.I. itself and the monitors that run its programming in the real world confirmed it as well. There's no other scenerio in which they could survive that other than them regenerating. They couldnt teleport out as Mag-Mel made it impossible for anyone to do that, and tanking it wouldnt work because then the monitors that monitored the deletion program would have confirmed them surviving and escape immediately, plus the fact that Dan and Drago wouldnt have felt they needed to leave if it wouldnt harm them, let alone Helios and Spectra.

Yes but we are talking about a Bakugan who's obtained god-tier level power. If Helios and Spectra were completely confident in not being harmed by the deletion theres no reason Dan and Drago wouldn't either, especially when they've faced threats far worse than what was happening in B.I.

If you didn't see the two of them get deleted (not the universe, them). Literally anything is more believable. The nullifying wearing off, a new portal, tanking the attack, etc. If they don't have a scene of them being deleted, or if they weren't point blank in the attack, then it's not it. And still, not true.

Again, still not true. Do you know how many tier 5s and up that are threatened by bullets, some even being killed by them?

"The nulifying wearing off"

Bakugan Interspace was permanently deleted. Nothing came back from it, everything including the reality itself was erased. It never revived at all, the program kept going until literally everything was erased.

"A new portal".

Also impossible for as again, leaving B.I. in any way other than the emergency accesspoints was taken away by Mag-Mel. Dan and Drago took the very last one Marucho created, Helios and Spectra remained completely and permanently trapped. Also Helios and Spectra can't create portals on their own.

They were. They were in the center of the deletion as it was taking place. All of the Chaos Bakugan and everything was being erased entirely. They were even covered by the flashing light that was doing the deleting inside the reality. We would have been specificed of them still living if they tanked it which we are never given.

Yes but arent those just glass-canon characters?

Not what I meant. For all we know, the "you can't teleport out" thing may have worn off. It's still more believable.

Still more believable. They were never stated to regenerate prior, iirc.

But not specification of Regenerationn? High-Godly Regenerationn is reasonable speculation? That sounds like a double standard. And not what I meant. For example, Ygg was taken out by All Delete, and the universe subsequently from the same attack. That's why he has High Godly Regenerationn.

I'm going to be brief. No. No they are not.

If it warn off then not only would they have tried teleporting out instead of just standing around letting themselves be deleted by the flash but it would make the whole purpose of deleting B.I. completely pointless. As long as B.I. existed Mag-Mel had complete control over it, thats why deleting it was the only way to get his hands off of it.

Of course because none of the brawlers thought they would survive as they were monitoring it and B.I. vanished nearly instantly from the servers. They all completely believed those 2 were deleted upon seeing nothing remain on the screens.

Yes and thats exactly why its the same situation here. The deletion program targeted and deleted everyone and everything thats in and makes up B.I. similutaneously just like what All Delete did to Ygg and the universe he was in.

Wait, was Mag Mel deleted? Then it should've worn off.

I've already responded to this.

No. It's not. Ygg was seen to be destroyed. These two weren't.

No, Mag-Mel wasnt even present in B.I., he didnt need to be in B.I. to control it. Mag-Mel controlled B.I. from the Dark Reverse dimension of it (the opposite world of B.I., a shadow world basically). He was controlling and using B.I. as a way to fight the brawlers from his prison that Code Eve trapped him in. Even though he wasnt physically present there, he still had total control of it and prevented everyone from being able to leave in any way (other than the accesspoints which Marucho made last minute upon preparing the program). So he was completely safe from the deletion while only his Chaos Bakugan would get sacrificed along with everything else.

Yes I am aware of that but the fact that no signal or any form of sign of them survivng when, after the program was done, there was absolutely nothing as it all vanished nigh-instantly would mean they didnt survive otherwise.

Skip to 18:30 here . Thats when the flash comes to start deleting everything that touches it. Spectra and Helios don't even try to escape at that point they remain perfectly still just standing in place, letting themselves be deleted by the flash. They dont even care that they were going to be deleted in a mere instant, implying that the deletion wouldnt end them as they would come back.

Here's where your downfall is: We see things get deleted, from the bottom up. That doesn't happen to them. They got enveloped in the light. All everyone else sees is the light. So my point still stands. I can't assume anything if the thing happens in complete darkness. Same happens for blinding lights. Also, being brave doesn't mean not caring. Like, at all.

Yes but the problem with that is this is assuming they arent affected by it at all even if they are covered by the flash, which there's no way of proving. We can't assume that only they would not get deleted while literally everything else, such as the Bakugan, the Mechtogan, even the reality itself gets deleted, especially when Helios and Spectra have never previously been anywhere near the level of taking such magnitude (Helios literally just became tier 2 with this latest evolution, while his previous form was like a Tier 5 at best). And what darkness? We only see darkness once B.I. vanishes off the screens, showing us it was deleted completely. If they were to survive it why didnt we see any signal of them on the screens just floating around safe? And this isnt the first time this has happend in Bakugan actually.

How so? Because im highly certain Spectra and Helios are not stupid enough to remain behind in a place thats about to be erased when they have a way back along with everyone else.

PS- btw Cal no hard feelings of course in case you thought I was upset lol. Im not and I hope you dont take anything the wrong way.

Well, I think Spectra knew he was going to be rescued by the Vestal Destroyer, and in the next episode he reappears in a dimensional hole commanding the ship, so he did not panic.

Executor N0 said:

Well, I think Spectra knew he was going to be rescued by the Vestal Destroyer, and in the next episode he reappears in a dimensional hole commanding the ship, so he did not panic.

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I knew someone would bring this up.

This doesnt change anything at all actually because the Vestal Destroyer can't go into B.I. itself. In fact, no form of machinery or technology other than the Mechtogan summoned by Bakugan themselves are able to go into B.I., you need to log-in or teleport in like the Neathians and Gundalins do (plus Mechtogan are actually created by the power of Bakugan and have living wills of their own. They are mostly living beings while only being part mechanical). If anything, the Vestal Destroyer would only be able to go there once there is no more B.I., still requiring those 2 to regenerate from being deleted in order to come back in it, especially since the Vestal Destroyer would have been trapped there and deleted too thanks to Mag-Mel taking away any form of teleporting from victims trapped inside.

Don't worry. I'm not upset, and I know you're not upset. Dude, you're likely the chillest person here, with no outbursts at all.

Thank you Cal that means a lot. To be perfectly honest there are sometimes where im actually afraid to discuss a certain topic w/ people im cool with because it might cause a rift during the discussion. Like here for example. I know we have our different views towards Bakugan on what we both think it should/shouldnt have and I always do my best to make sure personal rifts never happen. No matter how different our opinions are I still respect each and everyone here to the highest degree and I hope everyone else feels the same way.

Anyways, back to our discussion. I'll get to the other points later but i'll focus on the main one for the moment lol.

I still believe that the only option for Helios and Spectra to have once getting trapped inside Interspace was to regenerate (incase anyone was wondering, Helios does have Regenerationn hax so its not like its coming out of nowhere) as all their other options were taken away. Teleporting out wasnt an option thanks to Mag-Mel taking away that ability by destroying the accesspoints, cutting off all form of teleportation out of B.I. (even cross-dimensional teleportation to other worlds like Neathia and Gundalia were taken away). The Vestal Destroyer also isnt an option for the reasons listed above, and it doesnt make much sense for them to teleport out as both just stood by while the deleting did its job of erasing everything. If they really could teleport away if given the option, they would have done so much sooner. And the Deletion Program didnt stop until Interspace itself was completely erased as Marucho explained it, saying that the program is so massive that once its launched it can't be stopped, effectively deleting the reality itself with no way of it returning. The only arguable point against this is them tanking it and its very unlikely since Helios and Spectra didnt show any trace or sign of being left in the system once Interspace vanished (in fact this isnt the first time Bakugan has done this. Interspace was on the verge of being deleted before when Marucho was in the middle of making it but unlike this situation, the victims left inside actually showed us they survived and teleported away in time before getting erased). The brawlers would have noticed they survived instead of getting blank screens of everything being erased, leaving behind a kind of signal that the systems monitors would detect. And with everyone being in the form of pure data while inside Interspace, it'd only make perfect sense that the program would delete them as easily as the virtual world itself. So unless theres another explanation for this, reviving from being deleted is the only possible way those 2 could come back from Interspace's complete deletion.

EDIT: Looking back at it more, I take it back. Even tanking the deletion isnt a thing for them now however this comments longer than it already is so i'll explain why later.

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1. Wow that post is long.

2. You should inform dragonmasterxyz about this if you haven't.

Yeah my bad about the length, I know its troublesome. And I will if he doesnt come here on his own soon since Dragon knows about me planning this thread but he might be bust with other stuff.

I will only comment on couple things now. More later.

Regen.

-Could just be a resistance to Existence Erasure. Similar to how Rroyal Knights can tank a complete Multiversal reset and destruction and survive. Yet they don't all get High-Godly Regen, it is regarded as a resistance.

Concptual Manipulation

-Creating the source of energy =/= Creating said concept.of the energy.

Abstract Being

-No, due to what is above.

Pocket Reality Manipulation

-Okay

Body Manipulation

-Downplayed. Sound based Mind hax.

More later.

Good! Dragon's finally here lol. For now i'll only talk about the regen as thats whats mostly up for discussion right now.

Resistance i'll admit does sound logical but its also in the same boat as tanking (ill explain why tanking isnt possible later). If they were resistant to existence erasure, then Helios and Spectra would have been seen left behind in the system once Interspace vanished from the deletion remaining in nothingess on the monitors instead of them resulting in blank screens.

What was there was blinding white light. There's a difference between that and nothing at all, or a void.

Oh yeah of course but the thing is the flashing white light was what was doing the deleting. It stopped the moment Interspace was erased. Even if it was a void or just empty space left behind afterward, those 2 would have still been just floating there waiting to be transfered away (back to Vestal anyway since they show up later in the Vestal Destroyer) if they were resistant. A similar situation with Interspace happened before and the victims inside were able to survive and teleport away before Interspace got destroyed.

EDIT: Btw, I can accept Resistance being a possiblity as thats frankly the only other thing we could put on the table other than Regen (though im still leaning towards regen as even resistance sounds somewhat faulty). However for those who think tanking is an alternative, it is not at all.

Now to start again.

-Resistance to BFR

Cal sums up that point.

-Causality Manipulation

No...That's more or less healing

-Void Manipulation

More options for Pocket Reality Manipulation.

-Elemental Resistance

Perfectly fine.

-Phasing

Perfectly Fine

-Atomization and Resistance to it.

No. Cal sums up the reasons why.

Memory Trapping

Perfectly fine

-Precog

Perfectly fine

-Time Paradox Immunity

Not sure on this one.

-Probability Manipulation

Hyperbole

-Speed

Infinite seems fine.

My bad, had to take care of some things IRL.

Yeah Probability Manip can be ignored (in fact I removed it from the thread entirely as its just plain exaggerating).

Would canceling BFR be more appropriate? Wavern was enveloped by a dark aura that was about to send her to the doom dimension but she dispeled it using an ability, preventing her from going there.

For Casuality, there's still the matter of what the infinity core did to the broken vase and for Skyress, I can see why it would be healing but the problem I see here is Tentaclears ability was never specified to be a healing hax, it only nullifies a specific ability. It was used to nullify Hairadee's ability and by canceling his move, any damages caused by that move subsiquently vanished as well, which saved Skyress in the progress. Unless is this still healing?

I believe he sumed it up for the Chaos Bakugan. We still have Mechtavius Destroyer seemingly reducing the bakugan from New Vestroia to particles (if you want to check the scene I specified the time in the thread).

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This should be concluded fast. My Alphie vs Drago thread is waiting.

Burning Full Fingers said:

This should be concluded fast. My Alphie vs Drago thread is waiting.

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This thread will now never be concluded...

I'll make sure this never ends just to piss you off. ovo

What hideous creatures.

Oh god please no.......xD

So wait is it possible that we could get infinite speed Drago