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Possible Marioverse A.P. Upgrade

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Alright, just to notify you all right off the bat, this upgrade applies to Dreamy Bowser, Zeekeeper, and Antasma w/ the Dark Stone. I'm going to quote a friend of mine real quick.

"The Dream Stone is made up of multiple dreams, likely from all the citizens of at least P'ilo Island, if not the whole Mushroom Kingdom. The former would still have it far more than a thousand universes. At the bare minimum of 52 P'ilo citizens assuming they have lived for an average of 32 years (almost certainly much higher). There is 1 leap year for every 4 years as we all know, so multiplying 52 by 8 by 366 for all 8 leap years would get 152,256 universes for the leap years alone. For the other 24 years, we get 455,520 universes. Adding those we get 607,776 universes."

To stack on top of this (and to ensure why this is literally bare minimum), the Pi'illos have lived and dreamt for what's shown as ancient times. Now, it is true that we can't really tell how old ancient is, it's very evident throughout the game to be... A really long time. Possibly hundreds of years.

Also, it is shown throughout the game--with Dr. Snoozemore especially--that Pi'illo Island has a strange sleepy wavelength. Characters can fall asleep MANY times a day, which means that there are likely multiple dreams being made everyday.

To back up even MORE dreams, Bowser and Luigi dreamt plenty of times throughout the game AND in the scene with the Dream Beats, all the citizens fall asleep, each one contributing their own dream (there are, like, A LOT of NPCs in this game). And to stack on that, it's implied that Pi'illo Island has had researchers and tourists there for a long time, which contributes even more dreams than all the Pi'illos do each day.

Overall, I believe we should upgrade Dreamy Bowser, Zeekeeper and Antasma (w/ Dark Stone) to 2-B, Multiverse level. What do you guys think about the upgrade?
 
Metal Mario875 said:
Alright, just to notify you all right off the bat, this upgrade applies to Dreamy Bowser, Zeekeeper, and Antasma w/ the Dark Stone. I'm going to quote a friend of mine real quick.

"The Dream Stone is made up of multiple dreams, likely from all the citizens of at least P'ilo Island, if not the whole Mushroom Kingdom. The former would still have it far more than a thousand universes. At the bare minimum of 52 P'ilo citizens assuming they have lived for an average of 32 years (almost certainly much higher). There is 1 leap year for every 4 years as we all know, so multiplying 52 by 8 by 366 for all 8 leap years would get 152,256 universes for the leap years alone. For the other 24 years, we get 455,520 universes. Adding those we get 607,776 universes."

To stack on top of this (and to ensure why this is literally bare minimum), the Pi'illos have lived and dreamt for what's shown as ancient times. Now, it is true that we can't really tell how old ancient is, it's very evident throughout the game to be... A really long time. Possibly hundreds of years.

Also, it is shown throughout the game--with Dr. Snoozemore especially--that Pi'illo Island has a strange sleepy wavelength. Characters can fall asleep MANY times a day, which means that there are likely multiple dreams being made everyday.

To back up even MORE dreams, Bowser and Luigi dreamt plenty of times throughout the game AND in the scene with the Dream Beats, all the citizens fall asleep, each one contributing their own dream (there are, like, A LOT of NPCs in this game). And to stack on that, it's implied that Pi'illo Island has had researchers and tourists there for a long time, which contributes even more dreams than all the Pi'illos do each day.

Overall, I believe we should upgrade Dreamy Bowser, Zeekeeper and Antasma (w/ Dark Stone) to 2-B, Multiverse level. What do you guys think about the upgrade?
I definitely agree with this. In fact, based on how you said this constrains ancient dreams too, this number is likely in the billions, or even trillions or higher.
 
@Paleo: True. This was really lowballed. Glad you agree, btw. Now what we need is admins to look into this.
 
I can't tell you if this is a solid upgrade or not, as I'm not sharp in the lore of this verse, but I posted on Dino Ranger Black's wall about this. He's an expert on the series, so I figured he'd want to see this.
 
ArbitraryNumbers said:
I can't tell you if this is a solid upgrade or not, as I'm not sharp in the lore of this verse, but I posted on Dino Ranger Black's wall about this. He's an expert on the series, so I figured he'd want to see this.
Thank you.
 
I don't know much about it, I didn't play this particular game. But honestly, I don't see problems with that. Anyway, if they are not upgraded to 2-B they should get a "At least 2-C".
 
Well, from what I see in Bowser's profile he became the manifestation of the Dream World. Is this something symbolic or is it literal? If so, shouldn't that make it omnipresent in the Dream World? Correct me if I am wrong.
 
Kevyn Souza said:
Well, from what I see in Bowser's profile he became the manifestation of the Dream World. Is this something symbolic or is it literal? If so, shouldn't that make it omnipresent in the Dream World? Correct me if I am wrong, again, I don't know much about what happened in that particular game.
The Dream Stone contains the Dream Depot, which is all of the dream worlds together. And each dream being its own universe, which I can provide evidence to if you'd like, Dreamy Bowser essentially became the embodiment of a multiverse.

I honestly think you're right. There's nothing proving it wrong because the final boss fight doesn't take place in the Dream World, and because Dreamy Bowser became the embodiment of it (And because other characters such as Fusion Zamasu have been treated in such a way), Dreamy Bowser should be Omnipresent in the Dream World. So no, I think you're right.
 
I don't believe there should be upgrade. There's nothing in the game that implies that more than one dream world can be concieved by the same person. For all we know, it could be the same world from the same person with different themes. Plus, the Dreamstone isn't like the Dream Depot and Pillo Kingdom is clearly isn't a heavily populated as the Mushroom Kingdom. I believe the rating is fine the way it is......
 
Thank you very much for replying, I really do appreciate it. But anyway, Luigi conjures up new Dream Worlds each time he sleeps with such a great size that, when he jumps into space during their battles, there are an enormous amount of stars in the background. Dreambert also calls it the "nadir" of each dream world early on in the game, and nadir means the center of a circle. So, in one area of the circle, there's this much space--not only that, but Dreamy Luigi can jump out into distant stars and constellations, and the size looks very small during that.

So there's a lot of space, not counting their nadir--Dream's Deep. So because Dreamy Luigi conjures up new dream worlds each time, and each one has Dream's Deep--Antasma escapping to it in the Pi'illo Castle dream and Dreamy Luigi going to it during the Mushrise Park dream--plus each one is of such tremendous size; what with stars, constellations, and space. I believe each dream world can be transformed into a universe--and while it's nothing like MP5's Dream Depot--it's still relatable.

More proof is that, during the Dream Beats scene, Antasma states that they need to power up the Dream Stone with more dreams--and they force everyone asleep, contributing more dreams--yet, these very people, such as the researchers and Snoozemore's workers, have been there for what's implied as quite a long time, so they must have already slept once, and now, they're contributing more. And my final example is Antasma--he fed on the multiple nightmares the Pi'illo people had, so that implies there are multiple as well.

Oh, and here's some links to my evidence:

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/nadir

Sorry, I have to go. I'll be right back.
 
Well, Dino Ranger Black is our Mario expert. If he disagrees, I think that this thread should be closed, and would appreciate if everybody involved permanently drop the subject.
 
@Ant: Okay. Sorry, I had posted that wall of text before I seen your comment.
 
Same. If each Dream in the Dream Stone is treated as a separate universe, then Multiversal Dreamy Bowser makes sense.
 
Oi, I played Dream Team quite a lot. I enjoyed the game, and I must say, that I do have to agree with Metal Mario's upgrade for the dreams. This is because it makes sense and I've also done my own little powerscale of this character, but he took it to the next level (I know the guy personally). And he's talked to me a lot over Skype, and he seems to know what he's talking about.
 
Well, if DRB disagrees, I am afraid that we cannot perform any statistics changes. Sorry.
 
@Ant: Quick request... Do you mind if we leave this open just for a little while longer? I feel as though my explanation after DRB explained why he disagrees was sturdy.
 
Okay. I suppose that another reply from DRB would be preferable.
 
Forgive me for overlooking the scene with the Dreambeats. While that's actually valid, unfortunately, I don't think it's enough to make it comparable to the Dream Depot. Pillo Kingdom isn't as densely populated as the Mushroom Kingdom and it's been revealed certian characters are immune to the Dreambeats such as Starlow, Dreambert, and his fellow Pillos, meaning not everyone's dream is contributed. I believe it's better to give the characters a rating of At least 2-C, just like Keyvn suggested since you made a fair point.
 
You make a fair point yourself, but it's every person on Pi'illo Island who contributed a dream aside from the Pi'illos, and since they've been there for quite awhile, could it warrant a "Possibly 2-B"? Oh, and because the Pi'illos had contributed before, as apparantly the Dream and Dark Stones were manifestations of dreams/nightmares before Pi'illo Island became a resort, couldn't the original calculation work? If not, "At least 2-C" sounds okay to me.

Oh, and couldn't he be Omnipresent in the Dream World? He became one with the Dream Stone, and it had its own dreams--so if Dreamy Bowser were to go to the Dream World, wouldn't he be Omnipresent?
 
I've recently done something that applies to these three characters and I just wanted to point it out.

We should upgrade their speed from FTL to Massively FTL or Massively FTL+. Reason being is that they scale to Dreamy Luigi, who jumped out into the Sun in 1 second [Possibly less, since the timer on the video hadn't even reached one second yet. But I rounded it up because it made my calculating a whole heck of a lot easier.] The distance between the Earth and the Sun is 92,960,000 miles. Crossing that distance in that time is 334,656,000,000mph, or 499.0272912069 speeds of light. Almost certainly MUCH higher, as Dreamy Luigi could also jump into constellations(Skip to 5:40). And the latter is where the Massively FTL+ comes from.

EDIT: I suppose it's also worth mentioning that Dreamy Luigi could also jump into space and grab a Star in a few seconds as well.
 
Well, we generally consider the Dreamy Bowser event as an outlier: Discussion Rules
 
@Ant: I know. But I'm not scaling the Mario Bros. to him. I'm requesting we revise his stats and Antasma & Zeekeeper's, who do scale to him.
 
Zeekeeper is also considered as an outlier. We have rules against this.
 
Anyway, we should wait for Dino Ranger Black to reply.
 
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