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Li Shuwen vs Half Monster Garou

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<Hand to Hand Martial Artisit against Garou

Oooooooooooooooof not the best match for Li
 
Well Garou already knows Li's fighting style as Li actually uses obe Garou himself knows, meaning analytical prediction will allow him to copy his stuff quite quickly
 
Also I read it

It kills Servants by stopping their heart, Garou has Low Mid so I doubt it's useful
 
He uses the version found within the OPM universe, yes, but he does not know the Fate version of it. In fact, his analytical prediction would betray him here, since he would determine that he could simply block the incoming blows since they are not notably powerful, and he has no way to deduce the Ki manip involved in it.

He also attacks the nervous system, which I'm not sure can be quantified under out regen levels, since he has dealt no notable physical damage
 
Er...i dont think regen stops a heart attack seeing as there's no actual damage

It is your heart stopping, regen can in fact repair that.
 
Your heart and nerves are literally damaged by default for them to stop working from an attack,
 
That might be the case normally, but here Li is stopping them via aura, not by any kind of segnificant physical impact
 
If it's just the fact that Ki is being used then I don't see how having a same fighting style will help

Garou doesn't block attacks in character anyway, he usually dodges or deflects
 
Its the fact that he will analytically percieve Li's attacks as light, so he will be confident he can block them. Essentially, its a trap. If Li Shuwen decides to go for a Feint, and Garou percieves it as a Feint, thus ignoring it as one would usually do to an attack that one percieves as a feint, but even something as basic as this is enough to kill.

Not usually, but actually him attempting to deflect it means he still dies. Hell, if Garou attempts attack reflection once, he's dead
 
He will be confident he can, he just won't because that's not how he fights.

Attack Reflection I believe is more if a field then an actual block but I might be wrong
 
I mean, the proper response to a feint is usually just ot ignore the feint, but if Garou does that he dies. I'm also pretty sure he did try to block attacks from that one green tracksuit dude in his fight with the heroes

Cool, but that also means he dies
 
Nor the response to a feint is exploiting an opening that he will leave if he does that

Why? The Ki is hitting a forcefields, not himself.
 
Wut? If he tries to respond to the feint, then the feint has served its purpose, which will allow Li to exploit the opening. Garou is a good enough fighter to not give into a feint if he knows that an in coming attack, is, in fact, a feint.

I see absolutely no mention of force fields on Garou's profile at all. Even then, the punch is just a medium to envelop his enemy with aura to disrupt their nervous system.
 
Even sudden faint attacks or last ditch attacks can be dodged at the last moment for Garou.

Also on a note on Battle Instincts and the popularity of precog for Gate....

There are some stuff that have to be noted such as-


Karna literally not expecting Sieg to have a hidden sword behind him

Numerous Servants not having Battle Instincts precog and such

Mordred not expecting poison

And so on. Most of the stuff Fate Servants have are actually just techniques and skills. I really find it hard to believe all of them have ways to handle precog of the adapating analytical kind.


That said on this note, Tats did say she tried to use her ability on Garou (The one that ignores durability) but it didn't seem to work at all after a bit. Li's own technique might not finish off Garou in one go though brutally damage him instead.
 
Disrupting their nervous system gets countered by Low Mid.

Garou can very quickly adapt to said Feint though and simply dodge it with the speed advantage he gets from his reactive Evolution.
 
Ciruno Fortes said:
Even sudden faint attacks or last ditch attacks can be dodged at the last moment for Garou.
Also on a note on Battle Instincts and the popularity of precog for Gate....

There are some stuff that have to be noted such as-


Karna literally not expecting Sieg to have a hidden sword behind him

Numerous Servants not having Battle Instincts precog and such

Mordred not expecting poison

And so on. Most of the stuff Fate Servants have are actually just techniques and skills. I really find it hard to believe all of them have ways to handle precog of the adapating analytical kind.


That said on this note, Tats did say she tried to use her ability on Garou (The one that ignores durability) but it didn't seem to work at all after a bit. Li's own technique might not finish off Garou in one go though brutally damage him instead.
Click to expand...
You do understand that the point of a Feint is to get the opponent to try and dodge it right? If Garou tries to dodge it, then it has worked.


Wow that's very interesting. Karna, a servant who does not have precog, didn't use precog? That's quite ground breaking.

You either missunderstood my point or are misrepresenting it, but I'm gonna assume the previous. Saying "Numerous servants don't have precog" is not a contradictory statement to "numerous servants have precog," especially since my main case was that the ability is incredibly common, and the most common servants within the entire franchise are all precog users. Basically any servant worth their salt can keep up with precog users

Damn, that almost sounds like she managed to sneak her poisoning past a precognition user. Sounds like Assassin of Red is a decently competent servant

What does their abilities being based on a Skill system or being based on a technique have to do with anything? I never said all servants could, what I said was any decently competent servant should be able to deal with precognition, since those abilities are honestly kinda meh by Fate standards, and any servant who has ever been able to engage in combat with Saber (Fate/stay night) or Archer (Fate/stay night), is able to at least have a way to deal with precognition, even of the analytical sort.


Li Shuwen's technique really doesn't deal major physical damage (Or at least that is not the main point of it), and he is able to use it on servants with magical resistance despite the fact it should technically protect them from it (its not magic but it can be debatably classified under the same brands of techniques, something something nature energy).
 
Schnee One said:
Disrupting their nervous system gets countered by Low Mid.
Garou can very quickly adapt to said Feint though and simply dodge it with the speed advantage he gets from his reactive Evolution.
Click to expand...
But there is no actual segnificant damage being done tho. What is he regenerating from exactly?

What exactly would he be adapting to? If you dodge the feint then you have fallen for it. Adapting to a feint attack means not falling for it, but not falling for it means that Li gets a strike and you die. Let me remind you that Li also has Sphere Boundary, so Garou probably won't even percieve the attack until after he is struck
 
Feint commente deleted, ignore this segment. Move to next line


My point to this incredibly sassy remark of yours about precog is to this- https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/3733497#17 Not all Servants have a way to deal with analytical prediction and such

Or maybe this precog isn't actually the same as predicting every move... Maybe it's just a showcase of how skilled they are to predict the enemy rather than actual precog. You know, like what Garou's doing and is thus on a similar level...

Point taken. Then surely her massive beams of death ignore precog too right? Jokes aside, point taken on what you said about most. You just worded it horribly on the last one since I don't think there was ever a Servant that's not really worth their salt


The way I see it that's like using a riot shield against toxic gas.

Of course an attack that's supposed to breach a shield is gonna ignore said shield.

Instinctive Reactions covers Sphere Boundary


Anyway Tie vote for me.
 
I know that not all servants have a way to deal with precog, nor have a claimed such. What I claimed was that any servant worth their salt has a way to deal with it, or has it themselves. Karna falls into the previous, not the latter.

Yeah, Mordred's preog is based in predicting the best action for her to take. I'm not sure what your point is, since my main case is that forms of precog mean jack shit. Whether that be actual precog, or just being so skilled that you can predict the flow of the battle like Archer (Fate/stay night) it still does not mean that much.

Oh, trust me, there are servants that aren't worth much. Many of the lower end assassin servants can't do shit in a straight up fight, so they gotta go for killing the masters instead. Many of the Casters if they tried to fight directly as well. Riders that aren't physically inclined would also theoretically fall into this category, since the standard model would be that they need to rely on their multiple or particularly powerful NP, instead of actually trying to engage in direct combat. Although, obviously, you could argue that these are, in fact, ways of dealing with precognition, but I think for the sake of argument, you can agree that Kiyohime (She's a Berserker, but she fits the Rider Template) dropping a Dragon Nuke on her enemies too powerful for them to stop even if they see it coming isn't really "dealing wih precog." Sorry for the tangent lol


Do you mean the Magic Resist thing? Nah, not really.

I'm not really sure what makes Garou's stuff different. In fact, the Magic Resist is more along the lines of power null which is superior

His instincts would not pick it up until he already struck, unless he has feats of reacting to stuff he has no way of percieving


K.
 
Oof, OPM revisions never stop coming and they dont stop coming and they dont stop coming


Well on a last note since I missed the response

@ Iapitus

Well you did claim almost ever Servant has it, but then again the wording that threw me off was "Worth their salt" and stuff. I assumed you were talking about every other Servant that's not like Iskandar's Noble Phantasm (Historical Servants but don't really have much feats). Thought you were saying everyone literally has it lol, would be broken.

Mordred thing was right, lost what I was saying. And third paragraph makes sense and no worries lol.

Eh, that's one thing I find hard to believe since Magic Resist power nulling literally magical attacks sounds like anti-magic rather than anti-anything. Though most of Garou's abilities are physical attacks and self amping rather than abilities that are used on the enemy

In the instant he was being TK binded by telekinesis, he was ambushed from behind by Atomic Samurai with numerous slashes, yet he absolutely blitz defeated Atomic Samurai. That would probably be enough. Though you can argue it's used on his later forms


Also wasn't Garou previously 6-C before or was that someone else?
 
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